Very unpleasant experience with Six Moon Design (SMD)

When the Tie-0ut loop was missing on my SMD tent, I never got a call (left VM an hour after receiving it) never replied to my emails. After 4 days I got ahold of them..i returned tent and had to pay shipping. FWIW

I had to pay shipping because I told them I wanted to return it. They did offer to remedy the situation but I immediately lost faith in them when the sewing was so bad. I mean, sewing is half the product.

"When the Tie-0ut loop was missing on my SMD tent, I never got a call (left VM an hour after receiving it) never replied to my emails. After 4 days I got ahold of them..i returned tent and had to pay shipping. FWIW"

I just got off the phone with Zorg he said you are clearly a whiner you should have just sewed it up and moved on posting a positive review on BPL for said items. He also said you should call Ron again and tlak to him man to man over the phone.

See Subject.

Seriously? Does anybody read the return policy? Is this due our 3rd world educational system?

Thats a great Story Jason, but didn't the actual series of events go more like this :

1) SMD delivered an excellent product
2) You decided you wanted a different color from a different company, but needed a way to return the item.
3) You set up your shelter on the Jersey Shore during hurricane Sandy, but the SMD tent held up to the challenge.
4) You took the tent to Nebraska, Oklahoma, and Texas to put the gear directly in the path of F4 and F5 tornados, but the shelter would not budge. At one point, not caught on video, but remored to be true, the shelter grew in size to protect a family caught out in the storms, and continue to grow until thousands of people were sheltered from the hail and wind. It was truly a miracle product.
5) But the color still bothered you, so eventually you gave up and took a knife to it, removing a tie out, and claiming a defective product.

Admit it, That is how it really went. Nothing comes defective, and everyone here knows that. That is a fact !

The paths some people take to get out of gear they regret purchasing just blows my mind.

–G.B.–

Last June Manfred bought a cuben Haven and net tent from SMD, the latter of which came in at 16 ounces when the website stated it was 14 ounces. Here's the link to the thread:

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=65221&disable_pagination=1

The discussion remained civil throughout but the SMD website still shows the net tent at 14 ounces even though SMD said in the thread that 16 ounces is the new weight based on the new mesh they are using.

That said, in the thread SMD also said they would update the weight in 2013, so I guess they have time…

Could you all please go for a hike?

In Mannfred's thread, someone jumped in and talked about "bringing out the torches" and Mannfred quite civilly stated he just wanted a "sensible discussion about reasonable expectations."

Pretty sure the OP was (and still is) only looking for this also…

–B.R.–

What? How will we hit 15 pages?

My 3-day weekend fell apart so I decided to do some light reading… ;-)

Personally my take is just that if SMD told him they would refund the shipping they should have. To not do so is pretty lame in my book, and invites the lambasting.

Zorg is a funny troll. (Or a sock puppet, I am trying to figure that out.) But you all know how I feel about people that hide behind fake names. (Nature Boy is that you?)

Can't wait to use my new SMD Lunar Solo I got this past winter. Ron and his son helped me before and after the purchase. I've got no beef. Hopefully this doesn't leave a big mark.

Indeed I am… =0

"But you all know how I feel about people that hide behind fake names. (Nature Boy is that you?)"

That is his internet name google him. He lives in oregon is and advocate for gun rights and hates chinese shipping things to the US… Thats just what i found in a couple of seconds

But clearly this is his thing getting in to confrontations behind a computer screens.

Ray – if it IS Nature Boy, we can find out by posting a shoe question.

I posted this thread on WhiteBlaze as a "heads up" about concerns with SMD… The first reply was from a Moderator, Sly(Hikertrash)

http://www.whiteblaze.net/forum/showthread.php?95649-Interesting-SMD-Customer-Service(or-lack-there-of)-Thread

Email replies are in the OP.

Seems to me there was a lack of understanding on Yang Lu's part and some miscommunication. Brandon told him to send it back in a priority mail tyvek envelope (1 lb) which would not have cost $21.60. Ron's response was rather than getting an exchange, he canceled the order.

Of the 10 replies, 2 were WhiteBlaze moderators, the second being Alligator(DB extraordinaire)Closing the thread with these comments:

This is a customer disagreement posted to another website. The customer has not weighed in on it here. Best to leave your comments over on the other site instead of dragging it over here. Thanks.

I hope that Yang will indeed post there, so that other hikers will be able to determine for themselves if SMD products/quality and most importantly, customer service is worthy of their time and money…

…

We're so close to 15 pages that it is ok to attack the messenger.

LOL Ron already comented on this thread and then deleted them so im sure he is apprised of the situation….

But if you'd like to help crop dusting Ron on the street or in a restaurant would be great! and then when he smells it say that was for my man YANG!!!

Ps Daniel you are to nice….cut it out.

I'm going to disagree with the general consensus. And will probably be accused of attacking Yang for doing so but that is not my intent. I've never done business with SMD or know anyone there so I'm not biased in favor of them.

"It is funny that even at this moment some people are still looking for excuses to blame a consumer but ignore some very basic facts."

Well, the basic facts are not as clear as suggested here.

You ask for replacements for both. Fair enough.

" I am thinking I should get a replacement for both the Tarp and NetTent."

He thinks the trap should be OK and gives you an RMA for the NetTent which he also refers to as the shelter.

"The Haven NetTent can be returned for repair or exchange. We will look at the issue more closely once we get the shelter in.

Please use the RMA code 2013-0502A Include a note that says that you are sending the shelter back due to some small holes."

He did not authorize you to return the tarp. Maybe he should have and maybe not. But you two should have worked that out so it was agreed upon what would be returned before sending anything back.

"After we get the shelter in we can reimburse you for shipping costs. The shelter should fit nicely in a priority mail tyvek envelope and only weight 1 lb."

Again, he is referring to the NetTent. He probably should have stated that explicitly. But one thing we know on BPL is weights. The NetTent weighs 1 lb. From their website:

The Haven NetTent is now 2 oz. heavier, for a final weight of 16 oz.

The combination weighs over 2 lbs.

Even after all that, they probably would have replaced or repaired both items and sent them back as per their stated policy:

Our products are fully warranted to the original owner against defects in materials and workmanship. If our product fails due to a manufacturing defect, we will repair the product, without charge, or replace it, at our discretion.

You are responsible for paying for postage for all products returned for Warranty Coverage. If the item is covered under Warranty, we'll absorb the return shipping cost.

So you were entitled to get the items you ordered repaired or replaced and have the shipping reimbursed. But you decided to cancel the order instead. Which is covered by:

We are confident you will pleased with your Six Moon Designs equipment. However, if for some reason your purchase from Six Moon Designs does not meet your needs, you may return any unused items within 30 days for a full refund (less shipping charges).

Which, in the end, is all that matters. No matter how we got here, you cancelled your order because you wanted something else, the cuben version. If you had just wanted what you ordered fixed or replaced, you shouldn't have cancelled your order.

It appears to me that SMD followed their clearly stated policies.

+1

John Abdela hates Yang.

I bets its cause of the time he spent in korea.

So close to 15!

I can neither confirm nor deny any involvement or non-involvement in the DPRK.

Oh, and its Lorax now… get it right ;)

Are most cottage manufacturers return policy filled with so many technicalities?

Can someone explain to me why if they ship a faulty product, the person who gets that product has to eat any charge for returning it, regardless of exchange or not.

its like buying a hamburger, they get it wrong, i take it back and say i just want my money back, and they take out 30 cents from my refund to compensate for the wage they had to pay the worker to make my sandwich wrong to begin with…

15 yet?

Edit: its all moot, the return policy, because once yang was informed by a customer service representative that he would be refunded shipping… That overruled the policy, which the company is allowed to do, not the customer. If the customer service representative did not have the authority to override the policy… Perhaps he should pay the 20 dollars.

$20 has turned into multiple accounts of faulty products, bad service, and generally bad advertising.

By the way, at this point, i dont even rememmber which company i am talking about

Somewhere in an alternate universe:

Ron :" I'm sorry to hear about your issues. Normally we don't refund shipping, and I see now my company said they would. We want you to like your purchase, so, what i can do is either refund your shipping, or give you a code for a discount off your next purchase that will more than cover shipping. Our cuben should arrive by $DATE, and I'll be glad to put you at the top of the list, and call you when they arrive.

We know you have choices, and it's prime trip season, let us know what you want to do. Call me on my cell for fastest service at 867-5309.

Thanks,
SMD"

This universe: "he might never buy anything again so it is best to pocket the shipping"

Hope that helps, for people just tuning in
–G.B.–

That would go against what I have seen with SMD