Open Letter: Don’t make the Gear Swap for members only

I didn't read every comment in this thread so if this has been mentioned already, I agree with whoever said it.

In regards to "the cost to keep the site up and running": Mountain Project has been up and running since 2000. And it has always been free. No annoying ads posted to the bottom of forum posts, no annoying pop up ads. No need for people to give a percentage of what was paid for their used gear to the site. And if you've spent some time on Mountain Project, there is A LOT more content on there compared to here.

And take this for what it's worth…I would love to see a spreadsheet of the costs it takes to keep the forum going along with how the money received for $25/year and the $110/lifetime memberships are being used, specifically towards forum and site maintenance.

BPL is not a non profit.

Mountain Project ….
This ?
http://www.mountainproject.com/
Franco

Yes, that mountain project. Your point?

Not just mountain project, but there are MANY forums that are free and have been for years and years.

Personally, I'd pay for having the ability to completely delete my account.

Guess you haven't gone "poof" yet:) (as you mentioned in another post)

There's more to BPL than the forums, as others have said. Hammockforums.net (another great site) gets similar "help" from donations. For enjoying my
time in the woods, this site has made a huge difference for me. Worth every penny for some, not for others. Just like individual pieces of gear.

I'm not familiar w/the site you referenced but I'll check it out.

>"Mountain Project has been up and running since 2000. And it has always been free."

And there were four ads on the home page when I just looked at it.

>"No annoying ads posted to the bottom of forum posts,"

Huh? You don't like text lines at the bottom of a forum post but prefer scrolling color ads at the upper-right corner of the forum? Scrolling? Color? That's better? I suppose it's better because it probably brings in more revenue, but I personally find it more distracting.

There's such an ideal solution for those who want their web content free, ad-less, and high in quality: Do their own site, themselves. Set it up however they want. Put as much of their own time and money into it as they want. And maybe, it's such a fantastic idea AND implementation that, like Wikipedia it can always be free and ad-less or like Khan Academy it can wean itself from ads.

I've been on BPL for a month and added 10,000-15,000 words. Some chaff like this, but most of it content on stoves, fuels, design, mods to gear, etc. Contributing, well, contributes something of value, IMO. Whining, not so much.

>"I would love to see a spreadsheet of the costs it takes to keep the forum."

And I'd love to see Exxon's detailed budget documents. Not that I'm a shareholder, employee, auditer or regulator. I'd just like to see them. Right.

RPS76
Yes, that mountain project. Your point?

I think your question well explains how you see things, or how you don't…
Pretty obvious that Mountain Project is a site sponsored by the gear advertised in it.
What do you get on the FRONT page or when you click on deals ?
BTW, click on the iPhone/Android link and you find this comment in the FAQ ;
FAQ

Why isn't it free like the web site?
Mobile App development is hard, never-ending work, the app has no ads (which is how we support the web site)

took me less than 30 sec to find that out.

Would you care to name another site that has detailed information and is add free and or does not ask for donations ?
Franco

Here is the bottom line. Ryan Jordan owns the site. He is aware of what people think. It doesn't matter what we think, we are free to participate and free to leave. Whatever decision Ryan makes on this and other issues determine the future of BPL, we will not make this decision. It is his decision alone and he can take into consideration what the members (paying or not) think, but ultimately the final say lays on his shoulders. There is no need to continue this thread, as Ryan has plenty of feedback.

— says "Personally, I'd pay for having the ability to completely delete my account."
Quit posting and you will be lost by the wayside in no time. Geez you've only been here nine months. Go away. Nobody is forcing you to post.
I would have PM, but you don't want to be enough of a part of this group to even give us the chance to ream you out in private.

I've notice that the people who have raised the most stink about this whole subject are people who I have never heard of for the most part outside of gearswap.

PM me I'm accessible.
Ryan will do what he wants. That has been true for the 10 years or so that I have been here.

well that stinks. i was gonna post a sale item.. but no!
hmph.

"Personally, I'd pay for having the ability to completely delete my account."

I noticed the "Gone fishing" placard in your avatar. Does that mean you're willing to pay for a fishing license? Or should that be "free" as well? Where do you draw the line between free services and ones you are willing to pay for?

I really hope the new guy who is debating on whether or not to pay for a membership looks at this thread. Hopefully they will see that unless you are kissing the a**** of the forum moderators and/or the owner of this site, you will be sh** on. God forbid someone says something "bad" on here.

I could understand if I was a non-member and posting my comments but I am a member and to be honest, the articles and the gear swap thread isn't enough to justify paying for a membership.

As for paying for a fishing license, no, I get it for free for being a veteran. You're welcome for helping you keep your right to bash someone for expressing their opinion you elitist scum.

As for me not being an active participant on the forum…do you find it strange that there are soooo many people with sooo many posts on a BACKPACKING site? Interesting how the outdoor world spends so much time on the internet.

Wow. More entitlement mentality. I applaud our service men and women, just like applaud all police officers and firemen who put their lives on the line for us daily. But…free fishing licenses….and attitude… I am fairly certain that your service has nothing to do with my ability to post on this forum.

RPS 76
Given your anal fixation, it is no wonder you talk a load of crap.
I am still waiting for you to tell us what forum there is that is ads free, non sponsored and has no membership free either.
If you can't do that then don't open your mouth and let whatever comes to mind come out, cause it smells just like the other stuff.
As for kissing Arse , read the comments on the Stagnation article. Most there are members and not that many agreed with Ryan.
Franco

Im fairly new to these forums….and have not purchased a membership as of yet. Honestly i didnt even realize you had to pay until i tried to access some articles….which really is no major inconvenience if you just wanna cruise the forums….with the exception of selling items or participating in most PIF's on gear swap….
Ive been on other forums…and they really pale in comparison to this forum. The knowledge shared by both member's, non members, and the founders of this site is just awesome. When i get paid next, i plan on buying a membership. I dont have a problem with that. To me it seems pretty cool of these guys to let people use 98% of the forums capabilities for FREE….that alone should warrant a small donation to access all these other cool articles and stuff i know will be waiting for me once i have an M next to my name….So in closing-I am new here-I love it-I dont mind them charging for certain levels of access-if you DONT- then dont pay…simple as that…but remember that this thread was started for FREE!
Hasta Muchachos

nm

>Hopefully they will see that unless you are kissing the a**** of the forum moderators and/or the owner of this site, you will be sh** on. God forbid someone says something "bad" on here.

Simply not true and a ridiculous accusation and assessment of reality here on BPL.

>"I applaud our service men and women, just like applaud all police officers and firemen who put their lives on the line for us daily."

Well, this thread is already so chaffy, I might as well post what I really think:

There are soldiers with a larger sense of purpose who accurately indentified a conflict on which there was a right and a wrong side. Most of my uncles and many of the rest of "Great Generation" are examples. To some extent all my grandparents (yes, ALL of them – men and women) in "The Great War" but that seems a lot less clearcut in retrospect. And then there are soldiers who have a choice between the "the few, the proud" versus flipping burgers and opted for the guns, shiny uniform and killing other humans in return for money from a government that sends them to places that have "WMDs" and who "were behind 9-11" and these enlistees were so clueless that they believed it or just went along with it. I don't respect them. There is a lot of wisdom in the thought, "What if they held a war and no one came?" Spilling our nation's and world's blood and treasure in a dishonorable pursuit is not honorable.

I do NOT applaud ALL police officers, but I have tremendous respect for those who can discern in complex situations how to make things better while respecting the civil rights of all those involved. That's a rare skill set.

Nor do I respect ALL firefighters (although a higher fraction than the last two catagories). Simply looking at the disproportionate number of adrenaline-junky firefighters who are ultimately convicted of arson charges precludes respecting ALL firefighters and makes me doubt the sincerity or intelligence of anyone who claims they do.

But, yeah, that poster was screaming entitlement long before he mentioned his free fishing license. "Veteran" indicates no longer active duty and he doesn't appear old enough to have finished his 20. Why he was he cut loose when the skilled and talented were being involuntarily re-upped? Hmmmmm.

David,

Agreed. Poor wording to include that absolute. There are good and bad in all professions, just as there are laudable motivations and those that are not. It is also notable that not all military positions place one in the line of fire. That being said, I do maintainable a level of respect for those who are willing to put themselves at risk on behalf of others.

""What if they held a war and no one came?"

What if wars were fought by the leaders of the opposing sides, mano a mano, in an arena? We almost certainly wouldn't have gotten into it with Iraq were that the case. ;=)