Why doesn't someone build a UL BPing chair…Entrepreneur needed!

Ryan Jordan packs a chair…

Dr. J also packs fishing gear and satellite communications, video and camera gear…

Not my thing, but then I’m not carrying it. ;^)

Fortunately, my ‘luxury’ item is my 3.6 oz GSI coffee mug.

You are of course entitled to your predudices and opinion. With this thread as an example there is interest from enough folks who would like a more comfortable alternative to siting their duff in the dirt. You could let them discuss that without interjection.

I have recently purchased a Alite Mayfly. Sure I would love it to be lighter. Saying that, it is certainly comfortable enough that I would not hesitate taking it on more social trips that have a bit more emphasis on in camp time. GGGs come to mind as well.

Some people bring pounds of camera equipment. Different strokes…

As long as nobody is asking me to carry their crap, I don’t care what they bring.

Fair enough.

I’ve taken chairs quite a few times on canoe trips.

Still have 2 of these, and at one time they were the best thing around at 2.5 lb

I used to use a similar backpack to this commuting in nyc. Would plop down and read while waiting for the subway. If seems to me if you had a gossamer gear or a pack with an inflatable back this might not be ridiculously hard to replicate. 

I have recently purchased a Alite Mayfly.

I have two of them, nice chairs. But we only use them when we are going places in our inflatable boat that is pushed by a internal combustion engine. Heck, I have a camper that weighs close to 9,000 lbs and has internal plumbing, a shower, a DVD connected to a 32″ TV, and an electric blender to make margaritas; all powered by solar and LPG. Camping and boating are different activities than backpacking. I enjoy all kinds of outdoor adventures.

But this is BPL, which has a focus on going as light as possible while staying warm, dry, and safe. I am happy to sit on a boulder or lean against a tree if it makes my pack lighter. Just seems weird to me that folks can’t get comfortable in the backcountry using natural materials. However, if someone wants to haul a chair or a cooler full of beer, that is okay if it makes them happy… and yes, I’ll drink a cold beer if you offer one to me :-)

There is a tipping point where a chair becomes viable.  I am sure that if the weight dipped low enough that a chair would become “mainstream” in the UL world.  The question is what is that weight threshold?  I would guess that 6-8 oz. for a comfortable chair with a backrest would do very well.

I would guess that 6-8 oz. for a comfortable chair with a backrest would do very well.

+1.  And it would not have to be cheap either.  I happily paid $80 for a Chair One  and it lists for $119.

If 8 ounces is the justification point then the mattress pad to chair kits fit the bill. I’m curious, has anyone ever made a “what’s your guilty weight pleasure” thread on BPL… like Bob’s mug? Mine are definitely my airchair kit and the small amount of rum and cider packets I carry. They take me from my 9.5lb base to just over 10, excommunicating me from the church of ultralight. Still, a little hot rum in a comfy chair is tough to beat after long miles.

I would love to be able to get away with something as simple as the Thermarest or STS chairs, but I simply cannot sit directly on the ground…old knees.

If someone is looking for something lightweight, small, relatively comfortable, quick and easy to set up and that gets them off the ground–something like the following, but made with carbon fiber, 1 oz robic, and a lack of bottom horizontal bars could probably get to around 3 or 4 oz.

I don’t think a back rest is necessarily necessary.  Some chairs allow you to sit in a way where you’re decently comfortable w/out one.  Any kind of back rest is going to add weight, volume, and probably complexity.

With CF, you probably wouldn’t want to drill a pivot hinge (? probably wrong term) like that?  Maybe you could get away with using some dyneema type cord to lash it, or perhaps self adhering velcro?

I would sit on a foam pad if I didn’t want a backrest. If I am going to pack in a chair I want it to have a backrest.

Scott,

That’s a neat idea, but how much can you lean back before it tips over?

Jim, I think it’s a function of how much you have in your backpack providing ballast, and in all our cases that’s presumably not much.

Ok, this fall I’m going to try and install a chair that folds out of the pack using my Talon 22. It’s my 3 to 4 day summer pack, so I’m not willing to butcher it right now. I have a feeling i can create the sit frame with old aluminum stays, and use ospreys airscape panel, or another similar one as both the top of the seat and the backpanel of the backpack. I’ll report back in november, probably with pictures of my osprey in tatters and me sitting on the ground.

“f someone is looking for something lightweight, small, relatively comfortable, quick and easy to set up and that gets them off the ground–something like the following, but made with carbon fiber, 1 oz robic, and a lack of bottom horizontal bars could probably get to around 3 or 4 oz.”

I have a chair like that, but made with aluminium.  The fabric is fairly light, and there are no cross bars on the bottom.  The aluminium is fairly light and the chair has lasted a long time, more than 20 years.  But, it doesn’t get that much use as it is 1lb 3 oz.

How about something such as the TR Jembe combined with the Litesmith quikback?

I think CF tubes with 1mm wall thickness might work in that configuration since the loads are much more in compression than bending, producing a sub-10oz chair.

Today I weighed some 1-meter sections of 11mm diameter CF tubes and they weigh about 1.6 oz. I have an old-style REI Stratus air mat that I might sacrifice ‘for the cause’ to make a Jembe-specific air bladder. If the concept works, I think an 8 oz chair is not out of the question after some refining of design and materials.

Still thinking this through. Not necessarily interested in carrying a chair, but the challenge is becoming increasingly irresistible.

…but the challenge is becoming increasingly irresistible..

Yeah! You GO Bob! :)

LOL, you just want the CF splinters in my ass, not yours!! :^)

Actually, I think there’s a way to dispense with the Jembe, so there’s one hurdle cleared already.

Slicing commences tomorrow.

this is like being there when Woz and Steve came up with the desk top! Go Bob!!

“I have a chair like that, but made with aluminium.  The fabric is fairly light, and there are no cross bars on the bottom.  The aluminium is fairly light and the chair has lasted a long time, more than 20 years.  But, it doesn’t get that much use as it is 1lb 3 oz.”

Hmm, seems overly heavy for a combo of Al and “fairly light” fabric.

The external frame that i made out of a combo of CF poles, heavy duty Al elbows, expanding foam, epoxy, epoxy tape (Fiber Fix It), and silicone tape came in at 7.5 oz.  It’s approx. similar amount of tubing needed for a chair similar to that one.  If it was pure CF w/out the extra stuff (foam, F.F.I, etc) it would be a few oz’s lighter.  For reference see:
https://backpackinglight.com/forums/topic/7075-al-alloy-polecarbon-fiber-arrowfoam-external-frame-w-uhmwpe-fabric-bag/

And if using the 1 oz/yd2 Robic for the seat, that would probably weigh about .5 oz.

But yes, i do think my initial estimate is probably a bit low. Probably closer to 5 or 6 oz total.

this is like being there when Woz and Steve came up with the desk top! Go Bob!!

Haha, and then there’s the matter of the very large gulf between the saying and the doing. ;^)

But a whole bunch can be learned simply by attempting a prototype.

Now if Sierra Designs or Cascade Designs would just hire me it’d definitely make it worth my time, lol.

LOL, you just want the CF splinters in my ass, not yours!! :^)

Oh Bob…I would never wish that on anyone.  It is however entirely true that I don’t want them in mine :)

Hurts just thinking about it. :-o

Well it’s raining in my workshop (back deck) this morning so that’ll slow things down a bit.

But I have far fewer excuses since I’m now in possession of a “Round TUIT” given to me by Gary Dunckel.

Lightweight, too.

If you drill it out you could make it SUL.

I carry a chair because I have an interesting back problem compounded by a traumatic injury in ’05 (broken back), and perhaps spending a lot of my cumulative time in a sitting position.

“Chairs” in general are uncomfortable for me. I can’t stand sitting, and it causes problems for me after an hour. I use a standing desk, most of the time now.

Knees aren’t an issue for me. Back support is, and the most important is posture. A leaning-back position with knees elevated is great for me. But it depends on your back dysfunction. My wife has a back condition called spondylolisthesis and she can’t comfortably sit the way I sit.

I like and have used the folding crazy-creek-type chairs and they are ok, but sitting directly on a hard surface creates spinal compression that I can’t tolerate for long periods of time.

So I use the Helinox Ground Chair for these reasons.

I’m working on a mod using CF tubing and a lighter fabric for the seat support material but I don’t have high hopes that it’s all going to work and withstand the stresses of supporting the weight of a human.

It’s a big tax: 20 oz. But it allows me to do one of the things I really love to do while in the wilderness, and that is write, which is hard to do hunched over with a bent neck sitting on the ground – for me.

That said, it doesn’t go with me on all trips, just the ones where I know I’m going to spend significant time in camp, rather than on the trail. On trips where I’m focused on long hiking days, it stays home.