school me on gps's

How do you know you need one?

Did you do a search on BPL? There must be 100’s of threads on them. Usually there is a debate if a smartphone is better than a dedicated GPS. With phones its Apple vs Android and which apps to use. Garmin seems to be the most popular choice for a dedicated GPS unit. Can you use a compass and map?

A smart phone can do the same thing as a GPS unit. It has a much bigger screen and is far easier to use. You don’t need to have a service plan as it connects to satellites, not cell phone towers. The advantage of a dedicated GPS unit is better battery life, durability, and water resistance. For most people they will only use their GPS occasionally when confused so those issues aren’t as important.

For difficult off trail travel you really shouldn’t be staring at your GPS the whole time as you won’t develop proper navigational skills and it creates a kind of mental disconnect from you and your surrounding environment. Still, a GPS is a good tool to have when you are learning navigational skills. It helps you confirm accuracy in your map and compass navigational decisions, which I think helps you learn faster as long as don’t overuse it.

My advice, if you don’t own a smartphone, is to buy a cheap used smartphone unless you really think you will be using the GPS heavily and what the advantages of a dedicated GPS.

don’t stand alone GPSes get a little better reception?  There will be places, like in canyons or under heavy tree cover where a smartphone GPS won’t work?

I like to take a track of the route I take.  Take a position point every 100 feet or so.  Dedicated GPS does this, I think a smartphone will also.

I sometimes like to stare at the route I’m taking on the GPS topo map.  Just sort of a geeky thing.  I think a smart phone and stand alone will do this equally.

Sometimes I’ll retrace a route or follow a trail covered by snow.  Looking at the GPS will get me back on the correct route.

Stand alone GPSes are going extinct.  Tiny market compared to smartphones.  They can’t afford to design them to be as good.

I’ve used stand alone for years.  I’m thinking about buying smartphone.  The buttons on my Garmin are wearing off, so it’s hard to make them work.

As Nick said, how do you know you need one?

The reasons will determine the recommendations.  At least in my experience, the accuracy of smartphones is more than sufficient for most cases, and the user interfaces of stand-alone models are incredibly poor in comparison.  Still, there may be some edge cases where a dedicated model is appropriate.

-J

I hadn’t considered using my smartphone for a GPS. I’d just always heard people recommend carrying a GPS but if my phone will do the same I’ll just use that. I’ll need to work on my map and compass skills it seems. Any material on that I can read up on?

What gps apps do you guys like for android?

What part of the world are in? Different map apps for different areas.

Youtube has a bunch of how to with map and compass, gps.

This would be a good video for you to watch, but for your specific question go to 48 min in

Ultimate Hiking Gear & Skills Clinic

BPL member Amy helped write this article “here’s our article about using iPhone as Backpacking GPS/Mapping device  with some critical information about maintaining battery life and info about how to select an app. Alan’s comment about 4-5 hours of battery life is true ONLY if you don’t tune anything – by tuning the settings and usage, you should be able to use the iPhone GPS for backpacking for 3-5 days without carrying a recharging solution.”

Amy is maintaining an annotated list of iphone gps apps with info about all the apps she has found. If you know of apps that I’ve missed, or know of important updates that make my comments inaccurate, please PM her with the info AMY LAUTERBACH

People who recommend GPS units apparently forget to mention that knowing how to use them is important, and that takes some understanding of map and compass.

I recommend, because Search and Rescue volunteers generally do, for really good, really valid reasons, taking a class in navigation skills before you try to use a GPS for navigation. Practice with someone who knows how to use them is necessary. Reading a book or instruction manual doesn’t cut it.

I’ve had several Garmin GPSes over the years, from the original etrex to more advanced types.  This was all before I started units my phone.  I really like GAIA GPS app, both for Android and iPhone.  I’m not an advanced user, and there are lots of threads on this here an elsewhere.  It’s great for showing you where you are on the map (that you have to download in advance if you are out of cell phone range) and for keeping track of your hike.  You can look at stats or keep track of your tracks.

I think it’s worth mentioning that you need to know where you are going to be to download the right map, and you should know where you want to go.  This last point is true for hand held GPSes as well.

I’ve actually heard newer smart phones are as good or better than most dedicated GPS units.  You may want one because it is more rugged than a smart phone, or in my case I have the DeLorme InReach Explorer, which has a GPS, but also two way satellite communication.  Even with this advanced device both navigating and communicating is done better with my smart phone.  I use GAIA on my smart phone for tracking the hike and connect it to bluetooth and DeLorme’s app to manage the two way communication.

+1 on having map and compass skills down first. I like to use a gps only to double check my location. Especially in low visibility, darkness. So like 1% of the time. The paper map is always handy.

depending on terrain and conditions,

GPS can sometimes be as much as 10% off, and the error is not consistent thru out the different models. some measure over and some measure under.

“GPS can sometimes be as much as 10% off…” Do you mean 10 metres, an often quoted figure? If not, 10% of what?

+100 to knowing map & compass.

And to learning basic knots, and first aid, how to build a fire, LNT principles, etc…

Bottom line: The best thing about acquiring basic knowledge is it doesn’t weigh anything, and you aren’t dependent on some form of “technology” which could fail, brake, or get lost.

yeah, GPS can measure 10% off

for example it’ll say I walked 11 miles when it was actually 10.

Sometimes it says I did less than actual

the same GPS will vary from trip to trip

it may depend on the location of the GPS satellites – their position is constantly changing, and occasionally a satellite will die or a new one will be launched

+1 on learning basic map and compass skills before buying a GPS. Here’s a great little book that will tell you all the basics you’ll need for using a map, compass, GPS or smart phone for navigation. Make sure you get the latest 2015 third edition for best smart phone info:

Wilderness Navigation : Finding Your Way Using Map, Compass, Altimeter & GPS
Third edition
Bob Burns, Mike Burns
Mountaineers Books

In my opinion, one of the best online resources now available is the  navigation series by the Columbia River Orientation Club. A series of YouTube videos, they cover map, compass, GPS and using smart phones, too.

Well done and encompasses what, I think, should be known by a backcountry navigator in 2016.

“yeah, GPS can measure 10% off

for example it’ll say I walked 11 miles when it was actually 10.”

Ah, ok; that makes sense. I thought Art meant 10% off in stating your position, which I couldn’t make sense of.

Thanks everyone.  I’ll be busy for a while studying all this info.

“People who recommend GPS units apparently forget to mention that knowing how to use them is important, and that takes some understanding of map and compass.”

Yep. Have a friend that bought a 600.00 Garmin GPS unit in a hurry before a trip. He left his map and compass at home believing all the hype about GPS. Well… you guessed it, he promptly got himself lost and couldn’t figure out how to use the GPS on the fly. Moral of the story: Practice with your GPS at home, around your block, and on known day hikes to learn BEFORE you actually need it. And taking a map and compass along with the GPS is a good idea too.

billy

“And taking a map and compass along with the GPS is a good idea too.”

Unless you don’t know how to use those either!  ;)

“yeah, GPS can measure 10% off

for example it’ll say I walked 11 miles when it was actually 10.”

Ah, ok; that makes sense. I thought Art meant 10% off in stating your position, which I couldn’t make sense of.

It will be off sometimes when you’re navigating too. Four people with Garmin 60csx units with a single UTM coordinate. Three of the four units attempted to navigate the group on a bearing that was 20+ degrees off the fourth — and all three were wrong. Fortunately, SAR has everyone practice map and compass every month, every training, and requires that all GPS results be verified with the map and compass, and so the team did not get so far off track that it delayed or confused anyone.

Yes, all units were set to the correct same settings and matched to the maps provided, at the start of every search and every training, and recalibrated often into the bargain. Satellites, and electronic devices that depend on them, can be glitchy. If you cannot use a map and compass to verify anything you probably won’t catch the glitch until you’re miles off course and it’s dark. The more you know, the more you can catch things earlier, the less delayed or in trouble you’ll be. I leave a GPS home for leisure trips. It’s so much faster  for me to use a map. The trick is never get lost in the first place — look at the map often as you go along and never wait until you are questioning location or direction. Then you won’t need to bother with triangulation.

A famous GPS mistake here in Central California is the group of backpackers who, caught in a storm that blew in two days early, punched navigate to the truck (a waypoint) on the GPS and navigated themselves through a white-out blizzard to a ledge where they had to wrap up in a tent fly for two days to wait for weather to clear so a helicopter could short haul them to safety, instead of making it back to their truck like they imagined they would. Kings Canyon is not the place to do straight lines. The real skill involved would have been the wisdom to hunker down, not how to navigate in a blizzard, but it would have helped them immensely to understand that a GPS will not take into account all those contour lines on the map.

Not sure what’s going on, I wrote a reply but it doesn’t show up.  Not sure if this will.

Nope, that one doesn’t show up either, I don’t see anything : )