Ryan Jordan’s SUL Winter Challenge

Ryan Jordan writes:

>> 3.5 220 g canister (empty)

Wow! Ryan, who makes a 3.5oz 220g canister? I *need* to get some of those. :^)

Hey, it looks like someone is changing the conditions initially set by this forum:
Hi all,
So, our illustrious publisher and certified nut, Ryan Jordan, and I were chatting about the SUL challenge. He came up with this idea with no help from me…

You all choose his SUL gear list for WINTER backpacking – we’re talking sub 5# and real Montana winter – and he’ll take exactly that gear out…in Montana…in the winter. He’ll report back, IF he survives. We want him to survive, so really put some thought into this!

We provided 2 lists for you to choose from–and yet you just modified both to replace with other gear you felt necessary, thereby negating the opinions of everyone else on this forum and denying the terms initially set foward by the beginning of this forum. I vote that this gear list be changed to only allow gear from the final lists posted by Ryan and Kevin. Anyone else agree??

In effect, Ryan Jordan did choose a list mostly culled from the final lists that Ryan Faulkner and I had presented ( which were largely previously generated by a number of other people on this board). Dr. Ryan is choosing to subtract items that were on our 2 lists, but that was in the rules of the game. He did choose to add a few unique specimans ( like Maui Jim Ti Sunglasses—we hope they don’t freeze on to his temples). Also—very few people were involved at the end. Someone had to call the shots. And he’s the guy who has to do the hike w/ this list.

Ryan— if you read this—-take the candles, you’ll thank me.

I made a .pdf file of the gearlist.

http://hometown.aol.com/rhd101/BPL_SUL_Winter_Challenge.pdf

> Wow! Ryan, who makes a 3.5oz 220g canister? I *need* to get some of those. :^)

That’s ’empty’.
You might note another line 7.7 oz for 220 g fuel.

Roger writes:

>> That’s ’empty’.

Thanks, Roger. Umm, maybe I was a bit vague at what I was getting at…

My 220g (fuel wt.) Giga canisters weigh 5.3oz (150g) *empty*. I was wondering if somebody makes a particularly light canister (maybe aluminum or something.) fwiw, my empty 110g (fuel wt.) Giga canisters weigh 3.2oz (90g). Perhaps the weight on Ryan’s list was incorrectly posted for a small canister instead…

Cheers,

-MIke

> My 220g (fuel wt.) Giga canisters weigh 5.3oz (150g) *empty*. I was wondering if somebody makes a particularly light canister (maybe alumunium or something.) fwiw, my empty 110g (fuel wt.) Giga canisters weigh 3.2oz (90g).

Well, yeah, it’s a problem. Canister weights are all over the place. We love the old Primus ones: they were made of aluminium (steel base) and were down around 110 g empty. Some of the more ‘tourist’ brands are quite heavy. Sadly, it may be that the aluminium Primus ones are going off the market. Makes the Powermax even more attractive.

_____________________________________________________________________
Re:
You all choose his SUL gear list for WINTER backpacking – we’re talking sub 5# and real Montana winter – and he’ll take exactly that gear out…in Montana…in the winter. He’ll report back, IF he survives. We want him to survive, so really put some thought into this!
_______________________________________________________________________

O.K. first of all if only 1 sub 5# list got submitted, than why would there be any consideration in going over 5#. The rest of the posters couldn’t even agree to the challenge. It became some hoopla about things he should take to make it a list that anyone could go with, (which in tern killed the list and the sub 5#).

“He’ll report back, IF he survives”

Bet yet he can’t just carry just a photon or something else lighter, no. In fact he has to carry a photon as a back up. I mean cone on. I would carry less “light” weight if I went on a through hike. I even suggested to cut back, and oh no.

What someone really needs to do is go back through all of the forums and pick the lightest of each gear suggested. I’d bet it will easily be under 5#

—SUB 5#

I’m sorry, but if we can’t even play by his rules, then Ryan should be able to change the list to whatever he wants.

Aaron,

I understand your remarks, because I was the one who posted the sub 5 list. I always thought this was the goal so I tried my hardest to make it happen, but it looks like RJ decided to go with the idea of redefining winter SUL to be 6lbs or less. I dont quite get it, but I gave up on trying to save the sub 5 idea.

You might be surprised when Ryan is back and posts his gear list. There is still some fluff on his list and he may leave enough behind to bring his stuff under 5 pounds. Also the final gear weigh-in my come up lighter than the weights posted.

It would not take much to drop under the 5 pound mark.

Hey Ryan F
I know. I’ve read every last one of the msgs on this forum at least once.

I guess Bill F. will just have to go Sub 4# over the winter some time to show em how it’s done.
I really liked your list better any way. Just because it didn’t meet the masses, is was still very doable.
This is just the biggest and most complex set of msgs in a single forum on a page that I’ve ever seen.

I would have loved to have seen the report from your list. It would have been, yeah, I survived, BUT…

Besides, your list was a minimalist approach, where the sub 6# was a shot down version of what really happens when majority rules.

Too bad!

None of you need worry. I’ve already changed the list, will post those changes before I leave. I actually think RyanF’s list was too heavy.

Did a dry run on the clothing and sleep gear in this last cold snap ;)

More later :)
Ryan

Aaron: I was trying to answer your comment and lost my post. Anyway, Ryan has made a comment about his final (today anyway) list and it seems it will be lighter.

One thing about the challenge I think, was that the gear taken was available and not “one of” home made gear.

I could DROP another 17.5oz by only replacing 4 items on the list with my home made items.
1- My Cuben fiber Pack (2.5oz)
2/4 – my Cuben fiber VB: socks (0.22oz), pants (2.0oz) and shirt/jacket (2.5oz)

I also think my Poly-Tube Down Air Mattress would be much warmer, more comfortable, and lighter than the pads (at 9.4oz) on the list.

Is any of my SUL weight gear ready for prime time, not without some real good testing. Would I go out with it, yes.

My Cocoon Pullover and Pants, I hope will get to me about the first of the year. This is an item where some weight might be saved in a future version. Cocoon 2, The Sequel, Polarguard Delta??/Cuben?? or some insulation/fiber not yet developed or that I know about.

What I think is important about Ryan’s list is that it shows up several areas where new lighter gear is possible with just a little effort or need (someone to buy it).

We shall all of us be entertained. 4#, 5#, or 6.

But I hope that people will be more than tourists and actually get out and try out their own Winter SUL solutions. They may find it not so very easy to dial in.

As for a sub 5 lb. pack—it would appear that half the battle (or more) is creating a Winter trip appropriate to such a base weight(and gearlist), with all the limitations that implies.The means will be dictating the ends. To a much, much greater degree than for the other 3 seasons.

But It may well prove that the Ultimate Ryan Jordan Winter SUL gearlist will prove to be a good core to build and adapt upon for greater versatility and for more sustained ventures.

any updates on when?

final gearlist…

I don’t think RJ is off on the SUL Winter Stomp yet– no final announcements or news of live RSS feeds yet. Hopefully the weather is cooperating in the Bozeman hinterlands. Weather would have been perfect in my neck of the woods — the snow is both bountiful and bottomless and up high, the temperatures be cold and colder.

News would be appreciated. ¡Salud!

Just a quick update: mountain temperatures have been in the teens+ here since Christmas, and I’m waiting for the cold to return (lows of zero or lower) before doing this trek.

?

some news please

I can’t believe I read the whole thing….

Now I gotta go to the gym :)

Does anyone know what the status is on Ryan’s Winter Sul trip?

Ryan is returning from a backpacking trip in Utah (for the university there) today. AFAIK he has not had weather conditions to do the SUL trip in MT yet.

Hello Carol,

if the conditions are right will he still go?

I hope so!

Here are some thoughts about the Winter SUL excercise (with benefit of hindsight, of course)

* There is definitely benefit in a good discussion involving a lot of options … there were many more ideas presented than any one person is likely to think of alone

* But isn’t the benefit severely limited when the result is a kit that works for conditions so narrowly defined that they have not happened in almost 3 months of waiting? Talk about the inverse of the 80/20 “rule”! It’s looking like this kit was designed for conditions that occur(ed) <5% of this winter (so far). Wouldn't it be a more effective promo of wintertime packing light if we presented a kit that would be usable more than half the time .... with suggestions on what could be left behind based on weather forecast the morning of departure?

* Lastly, rather than a goal of 5lbs in winter, maybe next year we could try “How light have you gone in Winter in __________. Fill in the blank (MT, MN, OH, ME, CO … where ever we can find someone with the interest and budget)