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intense emotions at altitude?


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Viewing 25 posts - 1 through 25 (of 53 total)
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  • #1332827
    ben .
    BPL Member

    @frozenintime

    hey all has anyone experienced this?? i just got back from a week on the high sierra trail and had two brief episodes of really intense emotion after hiking up a bit of elevation to campsites. i should preface by saying i'm an absurdly steady and calm guy (and live at sea level). so these events were pretty surprising and funny to me (and my wife!). the first time, i became really sad. like 'oh my god everything is meaningless!' sad. the second, i got uneasy and anxious. both events lasted an hour or two and were a little uncomfortable. not necessarily bad – just surprising and unusual. in both cases, we had just climbed a modest amount – once 800 feet in a short period (8200 to 9000) and the next 1500 over a longer period (10,500 to 12,000). maybe these were just internal reactions to intense visual surroundings and experiences, but i'm wondering if altitude may have had something to do with it. i had some other mild altitude symptoms on the trip – faster heart rate for a few days and some lethargic feelings earlier on. i did some googling and found someone doing a fascinating and ongoing study on altitude and suicide (http://mic.com/articles/104096/there-s-a-suicide-epidemic-in-utah-and-one-neuroscientist-thinks-he-knows-why), but not too much else. some webmd-ish sites list 'more emotional' as a possible symptom of altitude sickness. i've spent a decent amount of time at elevation up to about 9k, and never noticed anything like this. has anyone else had or heard of similar reactions to altitude?? i'm really curious about this now!

    #2228379
    Peter Boysen
    BPL Member

    @peterboysen

    However many years ago I did a Colorado trip knowing nothing about actually spending time at elevation (camp was around 10,500 I think), and I tagged along with a couple other guys to go tackle a 14er. Almost no acclimitization and probably not great nutrition, and by the time we were at the last little push to the top I was completely unable to continue. Obviously short of breath, but for whatever reason it also made me super emotional and anxious. It was definitely just altitude sickness, but that was part of how it manifested in me. Quick descent and I started feeling much better really quickly, and felt stupid for not having climbed the last 50 feet of a 14,050 foot mountain.

    #2228380
    Paul Wagner
    BPL Member

    @balzaccom

    Locale: Wine Country

    My wife often gets teary as we get around 10,000 feet–so much so that she looked into it herself. Turns out that the Marine Corps Mountain Warfare Training Center actually teaches the soldiers about this—what to expect, and how to deal with it. join the club!

    #2228381
    Billy Ray
    Spectator

    @rosyfinch

    Locale: the mountains

    I've climbed many 14ers on weekends when living at sea level. And Climbed several mountains over 20,000 feet. Have never heard anyone claim an emotional response from altitude… including guides who take a multitude of clients who mostly live at sea level to these high altitudes. What had you been smoking? :) Billy

    #2228382
    ben .
    BPL Member

    @frozenintime

    super interesting! i'm sure there's all kinds of things happening in your brain with the change in O2. (ps peter: my wife and i were using our accomplice quilt the whole time this past week. temperatures were lower than expected a few nights and it held up great. it's an amazing piece of gear!)

    #2228383
    ben .
    BPL Member

    @frozenintime

    what can i say billy ray, i'm special

    #2228385
    d k
    BPL Member

    @dkramalc

    I have one friend who reported years ago being in tears for absolutely no reason on a high altitude hike with her husband and kids; another who could not stop laughing hysterically, also for pretty much no reason. Neither of them smoke anything :)

    #2228393
    Paul Wagner
    BPL Member

    @balzaccom

    Locale: Wine Country

    http://oai.dtic.mil/oai/oai?verb=getRecord&metadataPrefix=html&identifier=ADA445442 "mood disturbances" at high altitude. Many Marines report these, and they are part of the regular training. And in some soldiers, the effects last well beyond the high altitude exercises.

    #2228395
    Paul Wagner
    BPL Member

    @balzaccom

    Locale: Wine Country

    Altitude Effects on the Human Body Some of the most common effects of altitude exposure on the human body include: Reduced physical performance: Soldiers cannot maintain the same physical performance at altitude as they can at sea level, regardless of their fitness level. Countermeasures include ensuring acclimatization, adjusting work rates and load carriage, planning frequent rests during work and exercise, and planning and performing physical training programs at altitude. Psychological Effects: Altitude exposure may result in changes in senses (e.g., vision, taste), mood, and personality. These effects are directly related to altitude and are common at over 3,048m. Some effects occur early and are temporary while others may persist after acclimatization or even for a period of time after descent. Vision is generally the sense most affected by altitude exposure. Dark adaptation is significantly reduced, affecting Soldiers as low as 2,438m and can potentially affect military operations at altitude. Mental effects most noticeable at very high and extreme altitudes include decreased perception, memory, judgment, and attention. Alterations in mood and personality traits are common during altitude exposures. Sleep Disturbances: Altitude exposure may have significant effects on sleep. The most prominent effects are frequent periods of apnea (a temporary pause in breathing) and fragmented sleep. Reports of “not being able to sleep” and “being awake half the night” are common and may also contribute to mood changes and daytime drowsiness. These effects have been reported at elevations as low as 1,524m and are very common at higher altitudes. Dehydration: Dehydration is a very common condition in Soldiers at altitude. Causes include perspiration/sweating, vomiting, increased breathing, and diminished thirst sensation. Dehydration decreases physical performance, increases symptoms of altitude illness, and may increase risk of developing cold injuries. Nutrition: Poor nutrition can severely impact military operations and contribute to illness or injury, decreased performance and poor morale. At high elevations dulled taste sensations (making food undesirable), nausea, or lack of energy can decrease the motivation to prepare or eat meals. Poor eating habits may also lead to constipation, aggravation of hemorrhoids, and undesired weight loss.

    #2228396
    ben .
    BPL Member

    @frozenintime

    "We wondered what immediate mood effects strenuous high-altitude training would have in male Marines, what mood effects would endure 30 and 90 days after completion of training, and how mood scores would compare with normative data. The Marines reported significant increases in mood symptoms from baseline to completion of training, most of which endured for up to 90 days. In terms of anger and fatigue, the degree of mood symptoms reported by the Marines was elevated to levels comparable to normative data for adult male psychiatric outpatients. Rigorous military training in challenging environments may result in enduring mood symptoms that approach levels of clinical significance." sweet vindication of my insanity!

    #2228397
    Charles Grier
    BPL Member

    @rincon

    Locale: Desert Southwest

    I lived in the Puget Sound area for over 30 years and climbed Mt. Rainier a lot: over 35 ascents via most of the established routes. Most people who climb Rainier (including me) would leave sea level (Seattle area) and climb to at least 10,000' the first day to a high camp. They then spent the night at altitude and the next day would climb to the 14,400' summit. Many then would descend to their car and drive home the same day. It made for a fairly strenuous weekend. I'm not talking about guided parties here BTW. The extreme change of altitude and the exertion involved brought out a lot of bizarre behavior in many of the climbers I saw. I saw major panic attacks, laughing jags, falling asleep while standing, paranoia, hyperventilation and abnormally reckless behavior. I saw one guy drink himself into a stupor. I'm not surprised by your feelings, I've had 'em myself.

    #2228400
    Allen C
    BPL Member

    @acurrano

    I haven't noticed this in myself, but on a couple trips with my wife she has gotten pretty emotional at altitudes of 12-13,000 feet, even with plenty of acclimation beforehand. Symptoms lasted until we descended and then faded pretty quickly.

    #2228470
    Ken Thompson
    BPL Member

    @here

    Locale: Right there

    ….but, but… Billy says….

    #2228637
    Billy Ray
    Spectator

    @rosyfinch

    Locale: the mountains

    There is nothing in the posts above that conclusively prove emotions due to altitude. The effects of altitude have been researched scientifically for many decades. Show me the research that indicates emotions due to altitude and maybe I'll believe. Otherwise I will just figure this is yet another instance of people on BPL posting opinions. Not saying people don't experience emotions that they claim above, but… You know, the emotions expressed above could be due to something other than altitude. billy

    #2228654
    Paul Wagner
    BPL Member

    @balzaccom

    Locale: Wine Country

    Psychological Effects: Altitude exposure may result in changes in senses (e.g., vision, taste), mood, and personality. These effects are directly related to altitude and are common at over 3,048m. I'll let you argue with them over whether that is opinion or something else.

    #2228670
    Billy Ray
    Spectator

    @rosyfinch

    Locale: the mountains

    "Army doctors say" do you have a reference to a document? a study? or is this just hearsay? billy

    #2228671
    Billy Ray
    Spectator

    @rosyfinch

    Locale: the mountains

    I've had doctors say a lot of things to me that turned out to be wrong. Show is a substantial study on this issue. billy

    #2228694
    Michael Gunderloy
    BPL Member

    @ffmike

    (deleted. I shouldn't feed the trolls, even on a bad day.)

    #2228708
    Billy Ray
    Spectator

    @rosyfinch

    Locale: the mountains

    If you're talking about the link that Paul posted: http://oai.dtic.mil/oai/oai?verb=getRecord&metadataPrefix=html&identifier=ADA445442 I read the abstract and it has nothing to say about altitude itself causing emotions. The point of the study, as I read it, is that high stress marine training situations cause emotional symptoms… daaaa pretty obvious don't you think? It says nothing about altitude itself causing the emotions In order to prove that there would need to be a control group doing the same high stress training at sea level for comparison… not part of the study as I read it… All they have 'proven' is that high stress military training is stressful and leads to emotions. The training was done at altitude, but altitude was not isolated as a factor. As in all the examples of the post above. It may well be that it is physical stress that brings out the emotions (in some); not altitude itself. billy

    #2228738
    jimmy b
    BPL Member

    @jimmyb

    "It may well be that it is physical stress that brings out the emotions (in some); not altitude itself." Or as you say it may not be, due to the fact that if they did not isolate the elevation variable then they in tern didn't isolate the physical stress variable. There is the fact that BPing at elevation is strenuous physical activity and so in combination with the anecdotal evidence above, combining the two, it seems there is some relationship to emotional abnormalities in some folks. Interesting enough for me in that I have experienced a similar event. I passed it off as being overwhelmed with the natural beauty before me. At times in the absence of ever changing studies, many of which are based on bad scientific execution, we must simply resolve to use a little common sense :)

    #2228748
    Stephen Barber
    BPL Member

    @grampa

    Locale: SoCal

    Rocky Mountain high?!

    #2228756
    Billy Ray
    Spectator

    @rosyfinch

    Locale: the mountains

    It would be interesting to know if these same people who experience unusual emotions doing heavy duty exercise at altitude experience the same thing, say, when doing the same level of exercise in Death Valley… or when xc skiing with a backpack in winter. It may be just the exercise. But I can tell you that due to altitude sickness and edema there have been some serious studies on the effects of altitude on the human body and I still can't find one that indicates this supposed effect on emotions. billy

    #2228757
    Billy Ray
    Spectator

    @rosyfinch

    Locale: the mountains

    "…we must simply resolve to use a little common sense" I have seen a lot of 'common sense' here on BPL turn out to be wrong… Let's not jump to a conclusion based on just a few responses… Millions have been to altitude so let's not draw conclusions based on a dozen or so anecdotal postings… billy

    #2228758
    Kattt
    BPL Member

    @kattt

    "Let's not jump to a conclusion based on just a few responses… Millions have been to altitude so let's not draw conclusions based on a dozen or so anecdotal postings… billy" I see nothing wrong with Billy asking for more studies before going with this; It may well be true, but at this point there should be no pressure to just accept it as a fact.

    #2228762
    David Ure
    Member

    @familyguy

    I am with Billy. Show me the studies….

Viewing 25 posts - 1 through 25 (of 53 total)
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