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Water Strategy

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Viewing 25 posts - 26 through 50 (of 84 total)
Ben C BPL Member
PostedNov 13, 2014 at 10:39 am

Fausto:

Experience will fix your problem of carrying too much water, especially if you are paying attention to it. In an attempt to speed up the learning curve, its been my experience that, at least for those of us hiking in relatively wet areas, we need much less water than we think we need. Outside of breakfast, lunch, and supper, I really only need to drink 2-3 times a day, and its usually only about half a liter. Your experience will show you how often you are crossing water sources.

Personally, in southern Appalachia, I very rarely carry more than a liter of water. I carry a mini Squeeze filter and typically get new water only after I've run out of water or am very close to empty. I pass lots of water sources and see no need to carry extra water. If I know I am on a ridge or doing a dry camp or am away from my usual territory, I might plan differently.

Jerry Adams BPL Member
PostedNov 13, 2014 at 12:28 pm

yeah, if at altitude, like 10,000 feet, then you need to drink more water to avoid horrible headache

standard advice is to carry 2 quarts if you're climbing a Cascades volcano

D M BPL Member
PostedNov 13, 2014 at 2:46 pm

Just do it. Go out and figure what you personally need, there is no "formula". We are all different, I live in the desert, you live in the Pacific Northwest, North east, etc., etc..
You DO need the minerals, salt and sugar are not enough.
I've been doing extreme sports for 40 years. I've mentored a LOT of people. Some get hypoglycemia from Gatorade at the drop of a liter, some don't. Some sweat more, some don't. The only way to know what YOU need in terms of water and electrolytes and minerals is to go test yourself in all conditions and take notes, keep a log/diary and pay attention. Altitude sickness hurts and is unnecessary and is easily prevented by forethought and a little planning.

PostedNov 13, 2014 at 2:53 pm

There are a lot more variables than constants when it comes to water needs.
Variables:
Altitude
Temperature
humidity
level of exertion
individual metabolism
body mass
how much you drank yesterday
what you're eating

So no one can tell you precisely what will work for you except that you need to establish by trial and error how much water keeps you comfortable for how long, and then you need to assess (or guess) the distance and time to the next water source and carry as needed.
I know from experience that if I only drink when I'm thirsty I will get dehydrated. And worse. Kidney stone? been there, done that because I didn't drink enough.
But what anyone can do to reduce how much water is carried is to drink up at the current water source. When I'm at altitude (like over 10,000 feet), in warm dry weather, (typical for the Sierra summer) I like to drink plenty in the morning before I start so I stay ahead of the game – knowing as I do from experience that in those conditions if I wait until I'm thirsty I tend to get behind and pretty soon I'm peeing dark yellow.
I always figure if I'm carrying more than a cup or so of water when I reach a water source then I was carrying more than I need.
You also need to consider the situation. If you don't know where the next water source is going to be then the game is different, and you may want to play it safer.

PostedNov 13, 2014 at 2:59 pm

"And worse. Kidney stone? been there, done that because I didn't drink enough."

Yup. Kidney stone halfway through a 65 mile trip is never fun. Ask me how I know.

PostedNov 13, 2014 at 7:35 pm

My Water Strategy:

I drink when I am thirsty.

I don't drink when I am not thirsty.

I don't worry about how much I am drinking or not drinking; I don't keep track for the purpose of meeting some recommendation.

works for me.

billy

PostedNov 13, 2014 at 7:46 pm

Billy,

"I drink when I am thirsty."

That was pretty much the point of this several hundred page book.

Waterlogged: The Serious Problem of Overhydration in Endurance Athletes

PostedNov 13, 2014 at 10:31 pm

""I drink when I am thirsty."

That was pretty much the point of this several hundred page book.

Waterlogged: The Serious Problem of Overhydration in Endurance Athletes"

Wow… Amazing! Stupendous! Brillian! …. er, Dahhhhhhh
Amazing how people get off on these marketing fads.
Geez… the most commons sense thing in all aspects of your life is to 'listen to your body'… a few million years of evolution has more built in wisdom than a several hundred page book… or marketing campaign…

Billy

David Thomas BPL Member
PostedNov 13, 2014 at 10:42 pm

>"My kidneys dump A LOT of water at altitude"

I'm the reverse – at altitude, I carry several kilos of water weight. As I ascend, I drink and drink without peeing much. After I return to town, I pee copiously for 36 hours. Even at a density elevation of 7500 feet (cabin pressure in a jet) – 3 flights in a day, and especially 6 flights in a long day and I come home 5 pounds heavier but it's all gone 1.5 days later.

HYOH

PYOP (Pee your own piss).

PostedNov 13, 2014 at 10:50 pm

David,

One of us is build bassakwards…

I pee all the time… whether I drink a lot or a little :(

billy

Bob Gross BPL Member
PostedNov 13, 2014 at 11:12 pm

You guys sound like a bunch of old men complaining about your prostate glands.

–B.G.–

Fausto M BPL Member
PostedNov 14, 2014 at 8:50 am

Thanks to all that replied!

After reading everything, my take away is to try to push the envelope a little regarding how much water I carry, and include some sort of sports drink or electrolytes in the future.

Tks

Fausto

PostedNov 14, 2014 at 4:04 pm

My sister hardly drinks alcohol at all so people are puzzled when she says she has a drinking problem.

The drinking problem she has is that she can only take small sips for some reason. "Guzzle" is not in her vocabulary. Takes a really long time for her to drink a quart of water so she has to work at it to stay hydrated when hiking.

Bill Segraves BPL Member
PostedNov 15, 2014 at 6:28 am

As others have suggested, you need to know your own needs.

I'm late to the party, but a few suggestions:

1) Learn to monitor your hydration level. There are a lot of good online resources with urine color guides. Look at several of them – you'll see that the color rendering differs considerably, but the average is about right.

2) Monitor your hydration level and record your water consumption on a series of hikes under various conditions. You'll need this information in order to project your needs. Unless you're trail-running, you'll need less than you did when you were racing, but under hot conditions, you can still lose a lot of water to sweat, and dry conditions will up your losses through breathing and evaporation.

3) Monitor your hydration regularly during all hikes that are long enough or dry enough that water matters. If water is plentiful, you don't need to pay much attention to things. If conditions are dry, you want to stay reasonably well-hydrated. Staying reasonably well-hydrated gives you a margin of safety and means you need to *carry* less water.

4) Use your information from suggestion #2 to project your future needs, and reliable information about potable sources on your route to plan out how you'll meet them. It won't hurt you to go into a little bit of deficit (just as you did when you were racing), but you need to be sure you won't hit clinically relevant dehydration levels even if you're delayed or if a potential source doesn't pan out.

There's very little you can do to alter your needs, but if you do these things, you'll be able to minimize unnecessary water carrying while still staying safe and healthy.

A few additional thoughts:

5) It's not a bad idea to record your thirst perceptions while you're following suggestion #2. If you find that thirst is an adequate indicator of your hydration level, it makes life a little easier. It doesn't work for everyone, especially as people get older. I know at least two people who will just forget to drink if they don't think about it. One of them occasionally approaches clinically relevant levels of dehydration (after noticing he hasn't peed all day).

6) Unless you're trail-running, I'd be surprised if your hydration needs pushed you up against the limits of what your system could readily absorb, even if you're drinking plain water. "Sports drinks" are unnecessary.

7) If you're sweating out a lot of electrolytes, you're going to need to replace them. If you're eating real food, you'll already have plenty of potassium. (Do the calculations on your daily potassium intake. You'll probably be surprised how much potassium real food has.) If you're eating real food that doesn't have salt added, you *won't* have enough sodium. (Do the calculations on how much sodium is in a pound of gorp.) There's a reason why animals in most parts of the world are always looking for salt. If you have a lowish sodium diet at home and don't add some extra salt when you go into the mountains for long days, it's not that hard to reach clinically relevant levels of hyponatremia.

Cheers,

Bill S.

Robert Blean BPL Member
PostedNov 15, 2014 at 7:28 am

" If you're eating real food, you'll already have plenty of potassium."

I was on a trip some years ago where we were definitely eating "real food". We had to stretcher a guy out. The doctor's analysis was that he had low potassium, which caused diarrhea. Unfortunately, one of the effects of the diarrhea was to excrete potassium, leading to a vicious cycle. I've been careful of potassium since then.

–MV

Bob Gross BPL Member
PostedNov 15, 2014 at 7:53 am

Some of us have a natural deficiency of potassium, perhaps due to not eating potassium-rich sources of food. As a result, we can consume some Gatorade or similar supplement with our water, and then we are OK. Without that extra potassium, I get muscle cramps.

–B.G.–

Bill Segraves BPL Member
PostedNov 15, 2014 at 1:46 pm

Which will be more likely to prevent cramps?

1) 12 oz of Gatorade thirst quencher

2) 12 oz of water and an ounce of raisins (~ same # of calories as the gatorade)

And most importantly, why?

Bill S.

PostedNov 15, 2014 at 3:18 pm

No simple answer to a such complex question –

We have no idea why the cramps are occurring, so any answer is a WAG.

Also, Thirst Quencher has no magnesium, and raisins have very little sodium.
So not an apples to apples situation.

Make up the scenario of your choice and then offer the "correct" answer.

PostedNov 15, 2014 at 4:52 pm

My father in law used to frequently get leg cramps.
Someone told him to drink Tonic Water (it has some quinine ) , it worked for him.
Overdosing on quinine will probably kill you but so does overdosing on water…

PostedNov 15, 2014 at 5:34 pm

The PubMed reference above is from 1995.

"In early 2007, FDA banned all prescription quinine products other than Qualaquin."
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18454580

"The most commonly used quinine dosage [for leg cramps] was 300 mg/day…"
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21154358

"Medicinal tonic water originally contained only carbonated water and a large amount of quinine. However, most tonic water today contains a less significant amount of quinine, and is thus used mostly for its flavour.

"In the United States, the US Food and Drug Administration (FDA) limits the quinine content in tonic water to 83 mg per liter … Still, it is often recommended as a relief for leg cramps, but medical research suggests some care is needed in monitoring doses. Because of quinine's risks, the FDA cautions consumers against using "off-label" quinine drugs to treat leg cramps."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tonic_water

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