NPR Reports: REI vs L.L. Bean Return Policy

Therein lies the problem; deciding the profitability of word-of-mouth advertising.

Ian,

I think judgement is wrong and I would never do it.

I must gently warn you that there is a special place in hell for those that deny local bike shops.

My opinions on stealth camping are… complex and ever-evolving. I won't start that discussion. :)

What's wrong with 1P tents? Really? HYOH.

But, coming onto Back Packing LIGHT and advocating carrying heavier packs is just ill-advised…

That said, do I think you are a 'bad person'? Hell, how would I know?- I'm talking to you on an intertube forum. If you abuse return policies (a point of which i am not convinced) then that certainly speaks poorly of you, but that's hardly a litmus issue on which to hang such a judgment. Wrong, yes, but not litmus.

"I must gently warn you that there is a special place in hell for those that deny local bike shops."

Remember though, I live in Washinton so REI is local for me.

"I'll still shop at REI and I don't blush when I return an item as there always is a legitimate reason. Yes returning shoes with 700 miles on them is shameful but I guess I don't understand some of the group-think on BPL in regards to any return at all falling into the same category. I drive to the other side of town, past Sportsman Warehouse and other outfitters, to spend more money at REI. If a gasket fails on my filter after using it less than a dozen times, I (guilt free) expect for them to stand behind their return policy."

No one is arguing against such legitimate returns, Ian. I find it a stretch to think that ANYONE on this forum would say that any return at all is wrong.

But I have actually heard people brag about buying children's clothes at REI and returning it to get new clothes as they wear them thin or grow out of them. I have heard people brag about getting "shoes for life" from REI by returning them as they wear out. These are all the same people who are now pissed that REI changed the policy.

"I think judgement [sic] is wrong and I would never do it."

Well, now you're just being a smart-@$$. :)

'No one is arguing against such legitimate returns, Ian. I find it a stretch to think that ANYONE on this forum would say that any return at all is wrong."

That wasn't directed at you or anyone on this thread for that matter. "Group-think" was an unfair and inaccurate statement.

Dean, the Influence Explorer link came from my phone. I repeated the Google search on my desktop and got the same result (disregarding the ad which pops up above the regular search results).

If you think that one of Leon L Bean's grandchildren ownes 90% of the company, or that Linda L Bean would allow balanced contributions (not to mention same-sex partner benefits for employees) if she controlled the company, then more power to you. You can research this stuff yourself; I need to get back to work.

Local bike shops are head and shoulders above REI's bike service. I'm apparently enough of a member of the cycling industry to get some pro deals, so I guess I'd better advocate once in a while.

I form a relationship with my mechanic; after all, he's working on the closest thing I have to a surrogate child. He and I do team triathlons together. A good bike mechanic will never steer you wrong, get a great many things at a reduced price, and ultimately keep your bike in better working condition. For tents, I see REI, but for bicycles, I would never go to a big-box.

That's another conversation for another day, though. I don't want to open the door on this becoming a "Cottage VS Big Industry" debate. *shudder*

P.S. There's an REI near me in Massachusetts. Where aren't they local? Guess the returns didn't hold them back from expanding!

Well, clearly LL Bean Inc. realizes what a liability Linda has become- the only board members mentioned on their corporate website are the chairman and the CEO, and I keep seeing her mentioned elsewhere as a board member.

But I clearly have to research more. The problem is that LL Bean is a private corporation and they do not release shareholder information, or in fact ANY financial information. (What can I say- no one has time to research EVERYTHING in great detail, and we all work from imperfect information.) Not that there's much of anything I really want from LL Bean except maybe work boots, and even then there are better alternatives.

Dean,

Here's a link. http://influenceexplorer.com/organization/ll-bean-inc/7b5317ec59e846b9a4f3aa8c1682f955

Yeah… that would be the same link that Ian just posted. And that's just what the CORPORATION does, not the shareholders.

fun fact about LL bean

they use PL1 on quite a few of their competitively priced jackets …

now im not saying that those jackets are built for UL use … though some are nanopoofay copies for cheaper

but at the price they are at and their unlimited return policy, it just goes to show that companies can use the "best" synthetic in the world at a lower price point than the popular outdoursy "performance" brand …

it shows the hypocrisy of many of these "top brands" going towards their own proprietary insulation or lesser ones like PL sport/eco and charging MORE than a company like ll bean

note that MEC also has decently priced PL1 pieces

;)

Oh, whoops. I thought that link didn't work for you because it was from his phone.

And anyways, what's the difference there? There are shareholders in every company that have unsavory political affiliations. if your goal is to never do business with a crook in the United States, you'll have to start killing elk for hides.

My point is, maybe (THIS IS JUST AN EXAMPLE) the owner of ZPacks or Elightened Equipment contribute to the "Shut Down Public Education" fund on the weekends. It's their business. It doesn't really affect my business.

If L.L. Bean as a company was doing something hokey, I'd think twice, but boycotting based on a single shareholder is a little too serious for my taste.

If you’re not getting the same results from a search engine as someone else, it’s probably b/c of bubbling: http://dontbubble.us/

"P.S. There's an REI near me in Massachusetts. Where aren't they local? Guess the returns didn't hold them back from expanding!"

REI HQ is in Washington.

I throw as much money as I can to the mom-and-pop shops of the world but they have to deliver the goods. By reputation, our truly local shops deliver sub-par work at inflated prices.

Glad things are different where you live.

@spelt-

DDG is one of my alternates at home, but I'm at work. (That's probably why the graphs won't load.)

Speaking of, back to work…

> fun fact about LL bean

> they use PL1 on quite a few of their competitively priced jackets …

Thanks for turning me on to these. I've never seen them in the LL Bean stores and this is the first time I've heard of them. For others who are looking, the model described is the Ascent Packaway Jacket. I'd get one, but all the other climbers will laugh at me if I'm not wearing Patagucci.

I looked at Eddie Bauer, whose PL1 and Polartec Alpha jackets are priced in line or higher than the competition. They aren't trying too hard to make waves…

Ian,

You get a full pardon. The local shops in Montreal were so bad… I brought a broken fork to 3 shops and they told me "We can't fix this or replace it."

The fourth shop said "I can fix this!" and then took my bike apart, and then told me "I can't fix this…" He spent an hour telling me in English/French why the aluminum Marinoni forks were better, even though I told him I wasn't buying a new wheel and tire to be compatible with it. "I carry more than you, and I only get a few flats!" he proclaimed.

I'm looking at my bike, which is almost a mountain bike with 35mm tires and beefy Mavic rims, and thinking of the aggressive trails and dirt roads I ride, and the aluminum Marinoni is looking flimsier and flimsier by the second. Ultimately, I had to take the bike back to the states with my father to get it fixed.

He charged me $60 bucks for the hour he spent learning my bike was broken, like I told him when I walked in.

Bike's fixed now.

P.S. Stephen, I've owned a few L.L. Bean "technical" items in the past, and it's a good thing they have that return policy. I didn't actually return any of them (donated to my brothers) but after seeing the poor craftsmanship and terrible sizing firsthand, I stay away from the brand.

My L.L. Bean gift card went to a Mountain Hardwear sleeping bag.

Move it to Chaff.

GEAR

GEAR talk. Everything GEAR. All about GEAR. Ultralight backpacking gear. Lightweight backpacking gear. Hiking gear. Anything GEAR. Gear that sucks, gear that works, gear that's cheap, gear that's cool, gear that's overrated by lying manufacturers, gear that's only available from a side street Spanish market, gear that breaks, gear that's multi-use, gear that can be Googled, GEAR GEAR GEAR GEAR GEAR. Now go. Talk 'some gear

Since this thread is not talking about a specific piece of equipment. But instead of policies of companies that sell gear or at the most have gear made for them by someone who actually manufacturer gear.

Should have been posted in On The Web then

Fine, I guess now's a good a time to say it as any…

Doesn't need to be moved to chaff. It's relevant to a conversation we're having on gear companies and return policies on gear.

People policing the forums saying "move it to chaff" are getting annoying. I come here to discuss stuff and that's exactly what's happening, and lots of people are engaged! What's the big deal? I didn't make a thread called "politics," it just came up organically in discussion.

Lower your baton…

I thought it was agreed to post chaff on… where was that?… I forget now, maybe it was GEAR : )

The change in policy makes it easy to spot those who abused REI.

They are the ones who find a one year unconditional return policy unacceptable, even when defects are covered for life.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/10-retailers-that-will-let-you-return-anything-152310017.html?page=all

more at link

Recently, REI announced it would curb its return policy to products purchased within one year. But plenty of other retailers will let you return anything, any time, and for any reason.

Here are 10 retailers with ridiculously relaxed return policies.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505143_162-57603677/return-policies-does-no-good-deed-go-unpunished/

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Warranty Comparison
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Other manufacturers may tell you they have a lifetime warranty, but in fact no one compares to Briggs & Riley:

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;)