Joshua Tree CRHT Run

20 miles of water varies according to conditions and individual consumption practices.
as far as food for a 38 miler, I'd recommend 250 cal/hr minimum.

a cheaper pack alternative, which both Craig and I use, is the Black Diamond Bbee. not a running pack but works well when running slow, and holds twice as much as the Nathan HPL 20 (which really does not hold much if you use the bladder). this may come in handy if the weather suggests more clothing.

for stomach issues, a combination if Nuun tablets and Tums.

Jacob, if you want a Nathan HPL20, I was trying to sell mine a few months ago. Pack, bladder, and new bite valve for $40 shipped. It's used, but no holes, tears, stains, etc. All in fine working shape.

I think I'll be carrying 1800 calories of MD, 500 calories of Frontier Bites, 400 calories of Shot Bloks, and ~ 400 calories of other snacks. I feel like that should cover me pretty well for 10 hours of desert fun.

@Craig, thanks for the offer on the HPL 20. I think I'm going to head over to the local REI and see what they have, grab something, and go for a ~ 10 mile run with it today so I can see how I get along with whatever pack/vest I end up with.

calories- I'm planning on one bottle mixed w/ 2 scoops of Perpetuem/1 scoop HEED which should yield ~ 350 calories and plan on it lasting 2-2.5hrs, I'll have another with me to mix at around 1/4 point and then will have two more waiting at the 1/2 way point

Clif blocks- couple every hour, ~ 500 calories total

a couple of Hammer bars ~400 calories total

probably a P&J stashed at the 1/2 point :)

I secured spot #98 in the Black Rock campground. Many of the spots were reserved already, but we'll be close enough to walk over for social hour. If you guys end up tight on space for tents/tarps you're more than welcome to setup with us.

Sandra D (my wife) will be accompanying David and I. She's a backpacker/runner/triathlete, but she won't be joining us on the trail, just coming along for some fresh air and scenery.

It looks like all of us have Friday off, not sure what time we're leaving at just yet, but we might make it out there before 4 PM on Friday.

for guys that have been there, what's the surface like we'll be running- sounds like at least one stretch will be sandy (near blackrock???)- any rocky sections? reason I'm asking as I got a new, kind of minimal trail shoe and was contemplating using them, but don't want to make the wrong choice on this long of a run

danke

also I was contacted by another runner (another forum) and he inquired if he could run w/ us, I told him I didn't see a problem, but that he would have to find a camp spot or possibly contact Jacob to see if he had extra room- hope I told him right :)

Mike

any other runner is fine by me, as long as he can at least walk the distance.

Craig knows the trail, but from the hiking I've done in Joshua Tree, there was a lot of sand.

Just make sure your feet have really gotten to know a shoe before using it on a very long run.

thanks Art- I'm definitely far from 100% on my new shoes, they should handle sand and light rock just fine, but not so sure how they will feel w/ lots of miles

the gent that is thinking about joining us is GTG, he's a Hammer sponsored runner w/ multiple 100's under his belt- if he comes, I'm sure I'll see him once when I start and then once more when I get back to camp :)

Hey Mike. I just got back in town and saw your post…

A couple friends from Long Beach decided to come out and join us. They're not going to be on the trail but will be staying in our camp. So, we'll have 2 vehicles, 3 tents, and 5 people. I think we are allowed 6 people, but we may be at the limit on number of tents… I'm not worried about it if your buddy wants to crash at our site, but I have no idea how strict the Rangers are about their rules.

edit – scratch that. Just found out our friends booked site 97. So we should be good for whatever.

Is everyone cool on maps for this?

I still live in the relative stone age and use paper maps (Tom Harrison, NatGeo, etc.).
I could make some B/W copies of the CRHT off of the NatGeo topo I have.

If anyone has software and can print something better for evryone without much trouble, it might be a good idea.

I’ve done this route before…personally, I don’t need a map or GPS. But it’s a good idea for those new to the area just in case.

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Mike, let me know what camping gear you need.
I think you and Adan and I will share a big 6 man family tent. I’ll have a stove, cookware, cooler, etc.
I can bring a pad, bag, camp chair, whatever…

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As for surface: lots of sandy/loose areas. Not too much rock. I’ve run/hiked this entire trail in a pair of NB MT101s and they were fine. I’ll be doing it this time in a pair of MT110s. Lightweight is fine, but I think a minimal rock plate is good, simply due to mileage.

Sweeping the Garden: Joshua Tree Solo Bike and Run

Craig – what's GPS ?
I use paper maps. am pretty familiar with Josh in general, so probably could do without one if the trail is well marked, but it may be nice to carry a piece of paper anyways. don't suppose Tom Harrison has one, I use those all the time.

Craig, thanks for the offer on maps. I could use one, or at least if it's not too much trouble for you it will be one less thing I have to scramble to do next week. I overbooked myself with a snowshoe trip this weekend and a ton of other things going on around the household.

BTW, I'm running this in Brooks Pure Grits… hope that doesn't come back to bite me.

Jacob – as long as you've done at least a 20 miler in your Pure Grits you should be fine. now if you've never gone further than 5 … well.

Check that, Art.

My feet felt ok after 20. Keeping my knee feeling ok will be the bigger trick. I will just have to take it a little easy.

I ordered a Nat Geo map so should be gtg in that regard

Craig- a camp chair would be great if you have a spare- I think I can squeeze in my quilt/neoair w/o much trouble so should be good there, if you can throw in a plate/bowl/cup/utensil for me that would be great!

Hopefully my low mileage the last couple of weeks won't hurt anything, I was still suffering from the flu during my Uwharrie race and took a little break afterwards; got a couple of light days in and then Friday suffered a stomach virus that I'm just today feeling close to normal from- the good news is my body should be overflowing w/ antibodies and I might get a long stretch w/o any more illness :)

Mike

my favorite backcountry maps (California only) are the Tom Harrison series.

I just checked online, Tom Harrison does make a Joshua Tree map.
has anyone seen it ? used it ?
is the CRHT on it ? enough detail for the run ?

costs $10
I will see if REI has it in stock today.

looks like they changed the forecast recently- was highs in the 50's lows in 30's, now looks like highs in 70's lows in mid 40's; of course w/ a week out that certainly is subject to change :)

Yeah, I think it's definitely heating up. We've had a few days here that were full-on summer conditions. I'm prepared to see it possibly rise into the 80s.
I'm certainly not worried about insulation.
I'll be wearing nothing but a t-shirt with arm warmers and pack a Houdini as a backup.

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So I'm on this revolutionary new training plan in which you do nothing but surf in preparation for a 38 mile hike/run. The waves have been great over the last few weeks so I'm definitely ready. I timed the training for this run in Joshua Tree to correspond perfectly with the winter SoCal swell. Tip-top shape on my end….

My new training book,
Surfing for Ultrarunning Success
should be due to hit stores in the next two weeks.

I'm working on a companion nutritional guide as well:
Backyard Barbeques and Beer for Optimal Athletic Performance

I'm gonna make a $$$million$$$.

Ultrarunning is definitely All about the Money :-)

Mike, I'm not sure what shoes you're running in, but I wouldn't use my Inov-8 TrailRoc 255s on a sandy run. The sand just pours in through the mesh uppers.

Love them apart from that, and will use them on my 100km in a few weeks. Not available in orange sorry, but they don't clash too badly with the black and orange gaiters, and if you swapped the red laces for orange, you'd ba home free!

Craig, can you do me an autographed first editio of the BBQ book?

Thanks

Rod

I now have my own map.
just bought a Tom Harrison map of Joshua Tree from REI ( along with 4 bags full of Hammer nutrition, think that will last me ? )
the $10 map purchase was probably not necessary,
but it was too nice looking to pass up.

I'm going to stick w/ my Sabino Trails, just not enough miles on the FluidFlex to trust them- probably overkill for JT, but I know they work w/ long miles

I am quite pi$$ed that the FluidFlex are only offered in grey/neongreen

good idea on the laces though :D

just a few things to think about for next Saturday :

distance – 38 ish miles (one source gives it 37.3)
elevation gain – 3,500 ft
start-finish – net downhill by about 1,000 ft

about 19 miles to Keys Rd water drop.

sunrise – 6:15 am
sunset – 5:47 pm
so about 12 hrs of nonheadlamp time.

I'm guessing a solid 1-1.5 hr drive from the camp to start of run, with one water drop.

weather – 5 days out it looks to be partly cloudy, hi 72*, low 52*, so pretty perfect.

so the question is what time do we want to start ?
there are those who have never seen the park. do we want to make our drive to the start in the daylight so they can get a nice look see, meaning a somewhat later start ? or do we want to begin running at the crack of dawn ?
12 hrs of light should be plenty of time, but a backup light wouldn't hurt.

I was speaking with Adan about this last night. It would be nice if we could stash water on Friday, but I don't think everyone will be in at the same time to do so.

We'll have to do it Saturday morning on the way out to the start. Better so we're all together.

There's a spot right at the back of Ryan campground that could make a good drop; trash cans are right there so we can dump empties after transferring water. There's also the Juniper Flats day use area that intersects the CRHT and Keys View road. We can decide that morning. I'll look around on Friday also.

Make sure to remove paper labels from water jugs; I've had mice eat all the paper labeling off my containers, including the masking tape I used to label them with the date and time I'd pick them up. Sharpie on the container is better for this reason.

I think a 6:30ish start would work for me. It would give us time to drive, stash water, and eat quickly in camp. I figure we'd have to wake up at ~4:30 to be on schedule for this. I'll eat in the car on the drive, so we can get out quick. I'll be slow, but if I'm out for a few hours after dark I don't mind. I'll bring a light just in case.

that sounds good, earlier better than latter- I know my training isn't what it should be for a run of this length, the more time I have w/o resorting to my headlamp the better :)

if we only had a ocean near by I could use Craig's method of surfing to whip myself into shape :)