New Kifaru Pack – less then 3lbs, 5200 ci, will carry 100+ lbs!

Ed:

I'm curious what was included in that weight? All frame, bags, straps buckles, hardware etc? Is it similar to the pics?

Carry comfort is going to vary from person to person, some of the packs many think are most comfortable, feel like carrying a cinder block sideways on *my* back. This is and likely always will be true of every pack, it's just a YMMV thing.

That being said, "will carry 100+ lbs", and "carries 100+ lbs" comfortably are two different things.. Generally the standard amongst the backpacking scene is to list a comfortable carry wt.

Here's a quote I've always liked from MLD regarding their packs:
• Load Rating: Strong enough for 50+lbs. 25lbs is the recommended max average for all day comfort.

Anybody considering putting 50+ lbs in an MLD pack is stupid, or seriously desperate. No offense to MLD, it's just not what it's made for.

To which, I'll say, very few people can carry 100lbs+ in comfort without some sort of mechanical assistance. Obviously ElkReaper said he could barely stand up. I wouldn't call that comfort, but maybe he does.

I don't believe in a pack that carries 100+lbs *in comfort*, because I could never be comfortable with that wt. I doubt many are, or their idea of comfort, and mine, are polar opposites.

Not saying this gear doesn't have a role, but I'd like the conversation about it to stay grounded in "reality" the way we do it on BPL, as opposed to getting all macho gung-ho about big wts. If we want to do that, I'll be happy to start trying to justify my Khukri as a necessary piece of my kit. :P

Well said Russell. Aron "The Elk Reaper" has done a lot of great reviews. I am convinced that he finds packs more comfortable then most people and he can haul way more then I'd ever want to but he is consistent and he really puts the packs though their paces in the real world.

I didn't realize how big a can of worms this topic would be (well maybe a little) but I think it's a good discussion. I'd like to see someone do a review and writeup here at BPL on lightweight heavy haulers. I didn't know TiGoat was making a pack and looking at it it looks very interesting as well. Kuiu mentioned interest in getting their gear reviewed here at BPL as well so it looks like there would be at least 3 packs to review…Kifaru, TiGoat, and Kuiu. I don't think MR has any packs that you'd consider lightweight just yet but I know they're always developing new packs.

Obviously some sort of criteria would need to be setup to include/exclude packs.

I was just joking. I wouldn't make my wife carry anywhere near 150lbs. I limit her to 50-60lbs because otherwise she slows me down too much.

Don't know why any would consider a hunting style pack for lightweight backpacking. I'll stick with my McHale's, cant wait for my 3lb Merkebeiner pack to arrive for my heavy 30lb max loads.

http://mchalepacks.com/images/NJ%20Merkebeiner%20harness%20no%20comps%20outside_9x.jpg

"I am convinced that he finds packs more comfortable than most folks"

!!!! What does that have to do with MY comfort? !!!

i personally find it amazing all the comments here

whether it carries 150 lbs or 75 lbs … a 3 lb pack that can do either decently … and hopefully as "comfortable" as possible is not to be sneered at

my climbing pack depending on the config weights 2-3 lbs…

if this pack can live up to the talk .. and id assume it durable if it can carry out a goat … it may be pretty good for those who need to hump heavy loads on expeditions …. beats getting a 6 lb 90L+ pack

sure YOU might not carry heavy loads … but no reason why someone else who does wants to find the lightest pack that can deal with those loads

i heartily applaud the efforts to lighten up any gear without a reduction in functionality

hunters i suspect are like climbers … they hate the loads they HAVE to carry and cant lighten … and want to lighten up everything else

Javan,

The Kifaru UL 5200 was complete in that stated 2 lb 9 oz weight. There were no accessories available for it as mine was one of the final prototypes.

To better suit my needs, I added an MLD water bottle pocket to one shoulder strap, one Granite Gear hip belt pocket and a homemade Grab-it to the outside.

I too have packed some very heavy loads. 125 lbs is about my limit and that is while packing out boned elk. I have used Kifaru G1 & G2 Long Hunters and Siwash, all of Granite Gear's big packs, Osprey Crescent & Argon 85's & 110's as well as Dana Design Terraplane and Astroplane. Add to that list, Lowe Expedition, several Gregory packs and Kelty frame packs. Up to the 87 lbs that I have had in the KUL 5200, it rates as the most comfortable. And yes comfort has a different meaning with heavy weight. I have no doubt that my KUL5200 will easilly handle my personal maximum load of about 125. Some of the other packs I have mentioned above were total misery to carry with more than 50 lbs.

I would much rather carry less than 20 lbs and usually do but when hunting, I need a pack that will carry heavy weight.

Well Mike it's just like sleeping bags, some people sleep warm and others cold. If you know the reviewer is a warm sleeper you know to keep that in mind if you're a cold sleeper.

In this case I think he's a bit tougher man than me when it comes to what he considers a comfortable weight. I broke my clavicle some years back and my one shoulder is lower then the other so I have found packs only comfortable to the mid range of what pack companies say since then. Based on past experience in this case I'd guess I'd find the new Kifaru relatively comfortable to 80lbs or so and bearable up to about 110 unless each shoulder straps is adjustable for my dropped shoulder. Heavy is still heavy and what I consider comfortable in a 20lbs pack isn't the same as when I have 80lbs in a pack. I've had packs with 40lbs in them that felt a lot worse then another with 60lbs in it.

It's all subjective is all I'm saying. It wasn't like I said he's on a morphine drip when he tests these packs or something.

I spoke with Aron on the phone earlier regarding a review of the TiGoat carbon pack, and it looks like something that will happen. That is of course if we ever get our manufacturing worked out, or should I say manufacture. I will say also that I had not seen the Kuiu pack frame yet, but having seen it, I'm impressed. If Aron can get his hands on one of those, then maybe he should right the BPL comparitive review. As he explained on the phone, he is not a light weight guy, but if we are talking about non UL loads, that may be worth something.

I think this will be a great pack if some of us ever need to carry our entire collection of UL gear on our backs at one time e.g moving apartment :). Seriously it's always good to see new packs coming out.

i'm surprised at all the negative remarks. Everyone's favorite trip reports seem to be the week long plus un-resupplied excursions. I have enjoyed those, reading about the Arctic 1000, and other long trips. I think it would be amazing to have a lightweight pack that could carry a month and a half of food as comfortably as possible. Then the only problem is finding somewhere where you can walk for that long without running into someone.

I was a Scots Infantry Soldier in a previous life, what you guy call a grunt, i think.
I've carried mega loads, and it isn't comfortable. It's bearable.

This is a recreational site called BPLight!

"Everyone's favorite trip reports seem to be the week long plus un-resupplied excursions."

That is certainly where a pack like this makes sense, even for BPlers. I think many comments have to do with the number 150, I dont think they carried that much on the Artic 1000. We all understand miles verses weight, I believe a little context clears up most disagreements on the subject.

For one , I am looking forward to the rest of the new UL products by Kifaru.
To some here a 500g/ 1 lbs pack is already heavy but to the ones that had to use a 3-4 kg pack before and now (maybe) they can use one half of that weight , I would say that it will be welcome news.
After all one could have a UL set up and still end up with 60 plus pounds if doing a long unsupported walk…
And , yes I do find it helpfull to know the perceived level of comfort based on previous use/experience.
When I read that a guy finds a 5mm mat comfortable, I adjust his comments to that level.
Same when I read 2 water drops described as "puddles" that is (to me) a dead give away of low tollerance.
Franco

"Let's see a show of hands. How many people want to haul 100-150 pounds in their pack?"

How about a middle ground show of hands: How many people might want to carry 40-45# to do an unresupplied 21 day trip, probably in the KU3700? I am assuming a base weight around 10# and 1.5# of food/day, which seems to be where most people end up. I am further assuming that the KU3700 will come in around 2-2.25#. I could easily imagine myself contemplating a trip like this, so I'll be the first to raise my hand.

You would be surprised as to how many hunters come to this site to try and help shave weight. Heck Ryan Jordan is a hunter himself. I have learned a lot here and continue to do so. I check this site daily and read as much as can in hopes of improving my gear and technique so I can hunt longer and harder. I've got my base weight down to a level that I think is reasonable and now the only thing left to really shave weight on is my pack itself. I want what I carry in to be as light as possible because on the way out hopefully my pack will be full of meat and quite heavy. Kifaru has set the bar and now the other pack companies that cater the hunting/expedition crowd will follow. There are many exciting options coming in 2011 and I cant wait to see them all.

And remember…just because YOU dont carry 150lbs on your way out doesnt mean that WE dont. Hunters are as much a part of this community as the next. In the end it benefits us all.

That sounds cool Tom. I have a trip planned for next year that means i'll be carrying 10 days food.
I still hope to be carrying under 25-30lbs starting total carried weight. Unless you are climbing or hunting, the ability to carry 100-150lbs means nothing.

http://backpackinglight.typepad.com/2006_arctic/
Franco

Hey Raymond, I saw your post where you mentioned you had asymmetrical shoulders due to a previous injury. All Kifaru packs, including the new ultralights, have individually adjustable shoulder straps for a precise fit.

Mel

You are required to disclose that you work for Kifaru in ANY posting of this nature. Please remember to do so in the future.

Cheers
Roger Caffin
Online Community Monitor
Backpacking Light

Mel, I noticed that you could do that on the Longhunter packs and was hoping the new ones would be the same. That was the main reason I was looking to switch over to your packs. My current setup puts way too much pressure on my shoulders and on top of that I can't adjust for the asymmetry very well. Thanks for the info.

Kuiu's pack looks like it might do the same thing. It's going to be an interesting year for hunting packs I think.

Ray

Sorry about that Roger. Will do in the future. Thanks.

Mel

norcalblacktail:

Just want to say that I don't think any of us here are trying to disassociate ourselves from, or ostracize the hunters in the group.. You're absolutely right that you are as much a part of this group as we are.

However, just because a small sub-set of us (the hunters) have accepted something that sounds a bit un-real as the gospel, doesn't mean the rest of us will without some evidence.

A requisite of being a part of a community is active participation in it. Maybe the hunters need to stop lurking and start posting. We'll welcome them open arms I believe.

I'm a vegetarian, so this may sound ironic or even downright contradictory, but I'm deeply fascinated with remote/pack type hunting, and would love to learn more about it, and will likely attempt to participate at some point. I'm also enamored with winter hiking, especially when it involves wood stoves, and palatial shelters, so the larger volume/carrying capacity packs apply for me there also, hence the reason I'm itching for the Goat Pack.

As someone else said, the issue that's polarizing here is simply the load number, and I think it's just important to clarify. In fairness it seems mostly that there's an implication of high weight comfort.

I agree that I may not belong on Backpackinglight, but in the end, I would bet my normal camping gear (as well as other backcountry hunters) is not much different then any of yours.

I think something that should be noted, is the amount of extra gear a backcountry hunter would need above and beyond the norm.

If you add in the spotting scope,tripod,bow,binoculars,game bags,550 cord,camera gear,extra release,marking ribbon (and a few other items), you are hitting around 20 lbs before you even start loading the backpacking gear. So with that being said, I start out pretty darn light, but my pack increases greatly with all the additional gear needed.

So with a UL pack( that I can hunt with) that is a few pounds less then most others on the market, it will allow me to pack an extra 3 days of food and keep me in the field that much longer….and still allow me to pack out heavy loads on the way out.

I agree with you Javan, and I feel I could pick up several good ideas, as well as add a few of my own, so I will start posting more on here and read just as much:)