Thoughts on new REI EVRGRN line, catalogs, offers and light polluting tents…

“one of my least favorite things about BPL, is there is often an "elitist" sentiment that the outdoors can only be enjoyed one way, the BPL way IMO, this is not generally true. If you can find some rare, specific examples, I'd like to see them.” Elitism: 1. the belief that society should be governed by a select group of gifted and highly educated individuals 2. the belief that the back country should be governed by BPLers Most of us hike on public lands. My point is anyone can enjoy them however they want as long as they are not breaking any laws. People have just as much right to play cards in a light up tent until 2 am, as BPLers have to their preferred way to enjoy the outdoors. Also, as I said I like BPL and I find the people on this site very helpful. However, imo far too often is there the undertone that BPL is the only way to enjoy the outdoors, and others are some how wrong or inferior. I just find that sentiment off putting and elitist. Examples from this thread: (of the many to choose from) BPLers now define why people go outdoors and how they can enjoy that experience “…find it offensive that people would cause light pollution at the campsite with their new LED tents, or that we don't want "chilling, music and getting drunk" to be the focus of why people are outside?” BPLers now advocate violence for those who enjoy the outdoors differently “LED lit tent being an eyesore…Same with powerful mini-speakers, but a multi-camper camp may also talk loud. Think we will need quiet hrs posted…. I'd like to suggest first warning be a tent full of bear spray!!!” “what makes me want to throw rocks are portable speakers blasting music as people hike/camp.” Pure Elitism “When I see them struggling along the with their heavy packs, I think to myself: "you're clearly stupid"!” Ohh the Irony “Who is being elitist? Is it really necessary to be mortally offended because someone disagrees with you? Can't different sides of an argument both have some merit?”

Come on Brian, you just killed the thread! ;^)

“what makes me want to throw rocks are portable speakers blasting music as people hike/camp."–Pure elitism. Really? Why "elitism"? Or rather, aren't the elitists the people who are blasting the music in complete disregard of the people around them, and the wilderness setting as well? As if broadcasting "I don't have to acknowledge other peoples' existence–I do what I want". But "elitism" isn't the correct term here anyway. When did this become the catch-all term of absolute slander anyway? Usually it's a sign of lazy thinking–Not you Brian!!!–"lying elitist scientists are foisting the notion of global warming on us non-elitists, who know better–because of our gut instinct". Usually it's a way for anti-intellectuals to dismiss the other side's better reasoning without having to come up with a rational counter-argument. It's a sort of nyaa nyaa nyaa response. so John McCain, who owns six mansions–at last count, but who knows, not even him–accuses scientists at the EPA of "elitism". Rich.

Jeffery, I think you may have pulled a Roseanne Roseannadanna on that one. The “throwing rocks” comment came under the heading of “now advocate violence” The comment that was under the “pure elitism” heading was the “you’re clearly stupid” comment. In context, I think both are apt

Sometimes when I'm thinking lazy I reading comprehension fail, then post a rant online.

Yeah I'm bored and sleepy at home recovering from a hernia surgery..also grumpy. My reading comprehension is down. so sorry…Lashing out is part of the healing process…? Ranting is my default position when I'm in a bit of pain. now which of youse punks want to disagree with that?

I often think that humanity would be much happier if more people cared more about others (both individually, and in a more collectively universal sense), while at the same time caring less about what others do or don't do. Though, i think it's ok to occasionally get annoyed or a little intolerant with others, just don't make it a habit or trend. What we focus on, and feed the most, becomes strongest within.