Esbit burner testing

[rmeurant]

Lightning driven personal Esbit ignition system currently under development. Portability is rumored to be a touch problematic.

[rmeurant]

Secure high security R&D testing facility for Esbit stove prototype development, with close-up of test in progress below.

[rmeurant]

Evernew Japanese catalog – sorry about the quality of the images.

If seriously interested, probably Evernew’s Japanese website will be of more help, if not their US site. But later I’ll post photos of my fiddles in the store with this extended set.

[rmeurant]

You need to countdown,
to get your Esbit right…

[DAN-Y]

BLASPHEMY!

FYI gentlemen (& you too Robert ;o) Over on the Trailspace site there is a review of the Kojin alcohol burner.Yes, I said alcohol and, I know, this is an ESBIT thread but before you throw stones please listen.

SOME TERMS:

1.burner- a device that burns fuel or holds and burns fuel

2.stove- a device consisting of a burner, pot support and often a windscreen – i.e a complete system

Evidently Trail Designs, the maker of our beloved Caldera Cones, is now selling theKojin alky burner. The reviewer posted some comparative boil times using several alky burners including the TD 12-10, Starlyte and a few others plus, natch, the Kojin burner. The Kojin tops out above the sainted Starlyte as fastest to boil, fastest by a lot. And its about 1/2 the volume of the 12-10 burner. Store it inside a rolled up cone.

I’m all about weight and if the Kojin can produce the same burn time for less weight than ESBIT (especially over several days of breakfasts and dinners)  then I may become a convert to the “Denatured Alcohol Persuasion”. Blasphemy, I know. But this tiny Kojin burner seems to be both hot and efficient – kinda like my Filipina wife. BTW, The test was done with a Sidewinder ti Caldera Cone, my favorite.

So I’m ordering the Kojin stove to test the sucker myself.

Now begin the stone (or stove) throwing.

 

Eric, Sounds like you’ll be switching to alchy. I wish you the best! No stones from me.

[John K]

Isn’t the Kojin just an open pellet can? Ok, it has some fuzzy stuff to prevent spills, but still. Where does the Toaks titanium siphon fall in all this?

[Eric Blumensaadt]

Been wondering too about the “magic” of the Kojin alky stove. Looked as you described it John. When mine gets here I’ll look closely at that “fuzzy stuff”. So, yeah, get a small screw-top can, fill it with a non-burning wicking material like fiberglass cloth or  non-woven matting layers or welder’s felting and see what happens.

Dan, I kinda doubt I’ll switch to alky unless this Kojin is truly a “miracle”. I have toyed with a friend’s Starlyte and was not impressed with its efficiency and truly wonder how the Kojin could be as much better as claimed. Can’t see how the Kojin’s “fuzzy stuff” could be that much different. But I still gotta try it.

Mostly a stove is a stove if it’s efficient, stable and easy to use. And I’ve had many commercial and home made stoves, some pretty useless. The useless ones were mostly ones I made and got excited about my “latest idea” – until they didn’t work like I’d hoped.

BTW, I’ve wondered if one coated an ESBIT tablet with Stearine wax (from a “plumber’s candle”) if it would not only contain the fishy smell but probably light faster and burn a little longer. Stearine wax is virtually drip free so I’d have to melt some in a small can and immerse ESBIT tablets in it. (Of course then it would be a wider tablet and must be forced into a BEGT holder.) Just thinking out loud.

There is still a lot I like about ESBIT. I’ve solved the fishy smell by storing it in a coffee bag B/C they almost always have an aluminum layer laminated to the mylar. That aluminum layer keeps air out (and fishy smell in) and that’s why it’s used.

[John Papini]

Eric,

I also read about and will likely try the Kojin burner. However, keep in mind that it achieves greater boil times by burning fuel at a faster rate and burning more fuel to achieve a boil (i.e. vs. the modified Starlyte, the Starlyte burned 18% less fuel to get to a boil at a cost of over 3 minutes extra boil time).

Whether this is a good trade off or not depends on your circumstances. I’ve run out of alcohol more than once between resupplies while thru hiking, so I’d probably prefer to wait extra minutes for dinner and conserve fuel. Skurka did a good write up on this: https://andrewskurka.com/2018/stove-testing-kojin-12-10-starlyte-supalite/

Please share your thoughts on the Kojin when you receive it!

Woodstock

[Stormin]

I make a similar burner, Boil and burn times are influenced by the enviroment it is used in. Also pot/pan base diameter and windshield affect all parameters.

[Eric Blumensaadt]

Stormin’, What is the media you use to retain the alcohol?

PM me with price and yer address & phone.

@ john, Thanks for that Skurka link. Very informative. I have his book and that guy is always improving his gear.

[Stormin]

Eric, PM sent.

[DAN-Y]

LMAO Stormin Normin, does your stove label say what I think it does????

Is TD Trail Designs????

Interesting loose fibers

[Matthew / BPL]

HAHAHA now I kind of want to buy one.

[DAN-Y]

Matthew, get a dozen ;)

[DAN-Y]

The heads-up flags are up…..the surface of the Kojins are solidifying/deforming due to direct flames and fingers touching the surface of the absorbing felt.

FlipNC’s Kojin He said a dispensing bottle needs to be used to prevent fuel from overflowing burning. Surface is sealed due to flames/fingers touching absorbing material.

Skurkas’s Kojin

The surface of the Starlyte Gold is protected by a stainless steel mesh. Will never be affected by flames or fingers.

http://www.woodgaz-stove.com/starlyte-gold-burner.php

[Eric Blumensaadt]

Interesting not Danon the Kojin burner pad material. What the heck! You’d think Kojin would have chosen a wicking material that would not be so easily damaged. I have some stainless screening so I’ll put it on the Kojin when it arrives. Maybe that will help, or maybe it will mess it up. We’ll see.

And I think I’ll order a burner from Norman too. I like his ceramic felt material as he explained it to me in a PM. And I like his cottage industry style. Seems a lot of good things for backpacking come from cottage industries. That’s how many of the present bigger-than-cottage companies like Tarptent and Gossamer Gear began.

 

[rmeurant]

ERRRic try a gauze screen between flame and pot to even out the hotspots. Evernew, 2 sizes square, one circular with roasting array.

[rmeurant]

Evernew Ti Foo Bo
Price (tax included): 4,860 yen
Ultra space saving 2-stage Titanium draft shield

To avoid confusion, this product works well with the Evernew 400 Ti and 570 Ti pots; but its storage using the provided plastic bowl and lid is not compatible with the 570.

The plastic bowl, which is rather fine given that it is plastic, but has a gutter rim that will trap food, won’t fit in the 570:

while the 570 won’t fit in the bowl:

However, it works fine with the 400 (pot inside windscreen):

But when you use both halves (rings) of the windscreen, you can’t just use the TriveTi (for Esbit):

because the handle fouls on the windscreen. You have to stack the TriveTi on the alcohol burner:

Then it’s sweet:

So if using Esbit, use only one ring, with the TriveTi, with either the 400 or the 570.

The rings allow two settings for diameter; the narrower for the 400, and the wider for the 570.

In all, quite a nice product, I just found the storage incompatibility between the plastic case and the 570 rather weird.

The TriveTi is designed to either be used on the flat plate, which can also act as a lid for the 400 (a separate product, though then you get old Esbit on the inside of the pot; also the loose fit then snap tight closure can be frustrating, though I do recommend it if you are using a 400); and also stacked on the Evernew alcohol burner, so is particularly appropriate for alternative Esbit/alcohol use. As mentioned in my previous posts on this thread, the screen will cut, so caution is advised; and be wary of your eyes when removing (the windscreen, not your eyes) from storage (uncoiling).

Thanks to IBS/ISHI for allowing me to play with and photograph their products on display.

[rmeurant]

At long last. Polypropylene portable pill case fits 4 x 4 gm Esbit tabs – 37x63x12 mm. A squeeze lengthwise of the tab. Ideal for day trips. 100 yen + tax, Muji, Canal City.

Also, 64x52x20 mm big brother, 120 yen + tax.

[DAN-Y]

This past week of camping made me aware of the  highly hygroscopic  nature of esbit. I broke a full size cube in half, small particles fell to the wooden picnic bench that I was straddling. Within 15 min. the little particles showed rings surrounding them of what I suspect to be water or maybe dissolved salts that the esbit is made of.  One of the experimental esbit trays had a small unburned piece left in it overnight. That little piece liquefied by morning. The humidity was high enough to cause the dry chemicals to revert back to liquids.(formaldehyde?) Robert, maybe it’s best to keep the esbit in it’s original packaging. ;)

My kitchen kit was in the back seat of my car for the trip back home.  Every once in a while, while driving, I smelled something. I thought I may have stepped in some dog poop somewhere and checked the soles of my shoes a time or two to try and figure out where the odor was coming from. After arriving home and taking the camping stuff out of the car and lifting out the box with kitchen gear did I realize then that the esbit was the culprit causing the odor. (reminder to self…keep esbit in trunk) :)

[Eric Blumensaadt]

Dan,

I’ve mentioned here before that my solution to ESBIT’s fishy smells to keep it in high quality coffee bags that have a mylar/aluminum laminate like bags sold by PEET’S, Starbucks, Dunkin’ Doughnuts, etc.

Also, when the coffee bags are folded properly – first one direction then the other – they prevent water from easily entering.

 

[DAN-Y]

Within 15 min. the little particles showed rings surrounding them of what I suspect to be water or maybe dissolved salts that the esbit is made of.  One of the experimental esbit trays had a small unburned piece left in it overnight. That little piece liquefied by morning. The humidity was high enough to cause the dry chemicals to revert back to liquids.(formaldehyde?) Robert, maybe it’s best to keep the esbit in it’s original packaging. ;)

[rmeurant]

I’ve not had that problem (of Esbit smell) particularly, and have been using small zip close plastic sacs (not air-tight), but in any event the new polypropylene case is snap shut reasonably air-tight. But I’ll keep that in mind, thanks Dan. Eric, I’m waiting on chance to photograph gauze screens.

[Jon Fong / Flat Cat Gear]

Unwrapped Esbit,

Something doesn’t seem to be adding up here.  4 gram Esbit is not wrapped and seems to burn fine.  In fact some people have claimed that 4 gram Esbit doesn’t have the same strong odor;

Peter claimed that there was a difference in the odor of 4 gram tablets versus 14 gram tablets. I didn’t think that the actual material was any different, but that the packaging was quite different. If the 4 gram tablets were allowed to “air out” more, then that could explain why the odor seemed different.

The actual burn efficiency of the two sizes is identical in terms of BTUs per weight, so the actual material must be virtually identical.

https://backpackinglight.com/forums/topic/92771/

 

[rmeurant]

In Korea and Japan, 4 gm Esbit boxes may or may not be sealed in cellophane wrapping. It varies, and I prefer the wrapped. 4 gm Korean Esbit I have bought has occasionally been “off”, and has appeared to have deteriorated. In some cases sputtering, and expelling particles or gas in a manner reminiscent of volcano eruptions, making it unsuitable to use inside the well-ventilated tent…

[Author]

Posts