Seek Outside Flight Pack [was Upcoming light packs from SO]

[Stumphges]

Must be blind: compression straps extra weight and money?

[Mike M]

they come with several compression straps- no extra money

[John Brown]

Looking hard at a Flight pack as a replacement for my old ULA Circuit that is frequently overmatched on desert (water haul) and family (xtra gear/weight) trips.

As I look at the Flight it seems like the curve of the pack bag is quite pronounced, such that when the bag is packed full, with volume extending above the top of the shoulder straps, that it would interfere with your head, especially when looking up.

Can anyone who has an actual pack in hand comment on whether that’s an issue/non issue?

And is there anyone with both a Circuit and a Flight who could compare?

Thanks!

[Stumphges]

Thanks Mike. Do u know if listed weight includes those straps?

[Mike M]

I think the weight includes one strap; reason I think so is one came attached to the bag, the rest were in a plastic bag

[Stumphges]

Sorry to lean on you so hard, Mike, but how many straps total and what do you reckon total weight of pack is with all compression straps?

BTW, I assume you got one; how do you like it?

[Kevin @ Seek Outside]

I think we provide 6 straps plus an over the top strap. Most straps are 1/2 ounce with the over the top being heavier (longer and 3 connections)

For the creative, you can run the compression a lot of ways. You can put 3 Gatekeepers on one strap and weave it (the lightest way to get the most compression via straps) . I do this on trips that I am trying to save weight.

[Stumphges]

Hi Kevin,

Thanks for coming to Mike’s rescue on the strap questions.

Another question: How thick is the lumbar pad? Is it really just a covering/fixator for the belt, or is it designed to provide significant support/friction at the lumbar as part of the suspension? I prefer full-wrap systems like your Divide and have had discomfort with packs featuring thick lumbar pads.

[Kevin @ Seek Outside]

Not super think maybe a half inch. Its not one of those that super protrude. You can feel it though and know it is there.

[Thomas H]

Could someone post some photos of the frame and cross piece taken out of the bag as well as how it attaches internally with the bag (lifters, mid- cross piece, hip belt)? I am having difficulty understanding how such a light pack could handle loads so much better than other lightweight packs such as my HMG southwest or other bags with aluminum tube frames.

Thanks!

[J-L]

Well I can confirm that a Bearikade Expedition does not fit. It technically can fit inside the pack, but then it protrudes into the backpanel and doesn’t leave much  room above it. The frame seems to be too curved.

[Matthew / BPL]

I edited the name of this thread to help users find it now that we know the name of that pack.

[Stumphges]

John, you tried the Rogue Panda Zoro, right? Could you compare the freedom of pelvic movement of the Zoro, with its hanging belt, and the Flight One? Do you think the former is significantly better in this regard?

[Brian Goode]

On man that belt attaching in the same place as the original Seekoutside design is awesome! I can’t have any weight on my lumbar or I have pain for weeks from inflammation. That Zoro belt is what I keep saying is missing in most of the belt attachment points. Attack the belt to the outer 2 points of the pack. Not the center.

[robert mckay]

Hi Kevin,

It is awesome that you’re available here to help answer questions. In the early videos for the flight pack there was another model that is geared more toward alpinism, skiing and such. Is that pack still in the works? If so, any idea on a timeline for release?
I love my unaweep. It has seen some heavy use and keeps chugging along!

Thanks

[J-L]

@stumphges I don’t think there would be any difference in freedom of movement. The Flight’s hip belt is very flexible, hard to see how it would be constricting, but I have not used the pack on trail

[Mike M]

BTW, I assume you got one; how do you like it?

I just got back from a two day trip in the Elkhorns with my wife (and Tiny Elvis!).  When my wife goes it has to be as close to first class as possible- large, cushy shelter, chairs, always a fire (necessitating the need for a saw and small axe), etc.  I try to keep her pack to a minimum- sleeping bag/pad/clothing/water/few essentials and I carry all the food/shelter/chairs/fishing poles/etc.  Soooo.. my pack was just under 30 lbs (on my own a trip like that would be closer to 15 lbs) and I was comfy the entire way.

At ~30 lbs I didn’t have any issues with the hip belt sagging and that’s with keeping most of the weight on my hips.

I felt the both the waist belt and shoulder harness were very adequately padded (obviously their hunting packs are more heavily padded).  The two belt pockets are super roomy- a great detail lacking in many packs.  The water bottle pockets are roomy and secure, but I wasn’t easily able to access them- I’ll probably have to go to a shoulder water pocket.  I liked the size and depth of the front pocket (I always want to call this is a rear pocket!!!)- handy for rain gear, lunch, windshirt, etc.

So yeah, I’m very happy with the Flight :)

[Kevin @ Seek Outside]

I use the prototype of the more alpinist styled pack a lot.

The best way, is to send an email requesting it or a style similar. Then when we have available time, we will evaluate which new products we want to pursue. Currently, we simply don’t have the capacity to add more products, as it has been busier than expected. However, capacity is a moving target, and we have hired several sewers the past couple weeks and trained a couple other staff to sew.

However, we are not mind readers. We get the best results, from user feedback and it is tracked and it is easy to say we should add product “X” when we have several requests.

From my perspective, alpinism was one of the reasons for it’s development. I kept settling back on a Gila, for any time I needed to carry serious gear for a day, because I could not find anything else that would “pencil out” as better. Although the wide frame of our big platform, sometimes would be a problem point when scrambling.

[Murali C]

Hey Kevin – sorry I have to use this forum for an unrelated issue. [email protected] is not very reliable or helpful – I cancelled my order and on June 11th, someone said they will refund the order – but haven’t seen the refund email from you all. Can you please check into that? thanks! I had also sent another email to this address a few days back asking them about the refund – no reply. My order # is #27195. I could call – but, it seems like [email protected] should do the job…..

[Kevin @ Seek Outside]

@mchinnak Please check your spam folder. I see 4 tickets, and everything appears to be answered except the email from Jun 18th at 6:11. We work Mon-Thur and close at 5 so I suspect that should be answered in the AM Monday.

Thanks
Kevin

[Link .]

Any pictures of Tiny Elvis!

[Mike M]

sure :)

 

[Stumphges]

Go Elvis!

The Ash color BD Alpine Start:)

[Stumphges]

Brian, I have similar symptoms with pressure on my lumbar area. A couple years ago I auditioned a bunch of packs for the 50L long trip/family trip role and had to reject a number of packs I really liked for this reason. I ended up going with the Osprey Stratos 50, despite it weighing 3.5 pounds, mostly because the sprung mesh backpanel does not irritate my lumbar at all. But 3.5 pounds! I’ve been looking for a replacement ever since. I did try the Divide but felt it was too much pack for me, which kind of doesn’t make sense as it is lighter than the one I went with. I think the Divide is kind of a big man’s pack, which I’m not, just from the perspective of the frame being wide, the shoulder harness being wide, etc. It just felt like it was designed for someone bigger than me. The Flight One looks perfect, but wish they’d have suspended the belt, although I’m sure there were very good design reasons for going the way they have.

 

I mentioned upthread that I’ve started wearing belts lower, with the back of the belt on the sacrum rather than on the lumbar pad. From a biomechanical perspective, I think this is the superior place to put it. First, during bipedal activites, there is always a forward shear torque at the base of the spine, or at the L5/S1 junction – L5 is tending to get pushed forward on S1, and the top of S1 is slated down and forward. A lumbar pad will tend to push the entire lumbar, including L5 forward even more. The external torque from the pack may not be huge, but in some people it might be enough to irritate. In any case, it’s exacerbating a biomechanical vulnerability that is always made worse by the forward trunk lean that is required to balance a load carried entirely on the back side of the body.

By contrast, the posterior (back of body) surface of the sacrum is slanted back and down – it’s like a downward-angled shelf. Balancing weight on the sacrum will tend to produce a torque opposite the one described above. In addition, the pelvis has a pseudo-conical shape below the iliac crests and will tend to resist downward slippage if the belt is placed lower. However, with a suspension that does not have articulation between the belt and the pack body/stays, the belt will have to rotate and yaw some during walking gait. My hunch is that this rotation and yawing is more comfortable if it happens higher up, with the belt centered in its traditional position at the iliac crest. But if there is a pivot or similar at the junction of the belt/pack body the belt does not move against the pelvis and the lower position feels much more secure. In addition, the low position places the front of the belt/buckle lower, where it does not interfere with breathing.

I think Arcteryx have thought along similar lines with their awesome but horribly heavy Bora 50/63 packs, which feature a pivot at the back of the hipbelt. The hipbelt is designed to be worn just below the iliac crest and is much stiffer – being reinforced with carbon- than typical hipbelts. The sitffness is an advantage in this design because the pivot allows the hipbelt to move with the pelvis in a coupled fashion, whereas a belt that stiff would chafe like crazy in a conventional design.

 

Sorry for the thread drivt.

[Link .]

Thanks Mike! He looks sweet, oh and the pack looks nice also;)

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