UL Propane stove with 300 BAR refillable 0.6L composite fuel bottle?

[David Thomas]

”you shave your lower legs the rest of the time?”. Only for you, DavidG

”larger propane tanks?” Jerry, in 2003, I was troubleshooting an AirStream with two 40-pound cylinders. In 1992, I was operating a number of “thermal oxidation units” to treat soil vapors extracted from former service station sites and had them plumbed to 500-gallon and 1000-gallon propane tanks.  One of those, in SF, drew vapor off the propane tank fast enough to ice up a 1000-gallon tank.

P.S. a way to very accurately assess the fill level in a propane tank is, during or shortly after a period of high use, run your finger down the side of the tank and you’ll notice the steel is distinctly colder starting right where the liquid level is. With higher use, you can see condensation or water ice building up at the liquid level and below.

[Pierre Descoteaux]

I got the Ultra Flame 100% propane canister.Picture of the back.

[Pierre Descoteaux]

Now the DOT number. They’re hiding under the bilingual sticker… I hope it helps.

[Pierre Descoteaux]

I forgot the weight! 350g new with the plastic cap (3g). Now I’ll go play with it… and report back.

[Nick Gatel]

Does it have a Lindal valve?

[Nick Gatel]

I’ve never cause a gasoline or WG fire, or singed any part of my body, though I’ve been present a couple times when a gasoline fire started.

I’ve worked in gas stations that sold bulk propane, so I familiar with the product and delivery. When I first started filling tanks, I had a problem with a bleed valve and the cold propane froze my right index finger causing a second degree “burn.”

[Pierre Descoteaux]

Yes, it does have a Lindal valve. It worked flawlessly with my Caffin stove (V1 if I recall). I’ll let you decide if the weight saving would be worth it…

[David Gardner]

@pierre: Cool. No pressure or flame problems? Did you do any comparison for boil times & grams of fuel used vs. butane? Enquiring minds want to know!

[Pierre Descoteaux]

No problems  but no boil test and such. As anal as I can be for many things in my life… boil times and precise testing like most of you enjoy are not my thing. ;) If I get to it, I’ll be sure to post results.

[Roger Caffin]

A lot of myths and false statements here.

Actually White gas is SAFER according to your criteria.
It is far less volatile than butane/propane.

Ah – most autogas contains propane. Granted, some of the higher carbon chains are less volatile, but autogas vapour is a well-known hazard.

The liquid needs to evaporate before it ignites.

ALL liquids need to vaporise before they burn. ALL OF THEM. Propane does tend to float away though.

Try dropping a cigarette into a bucket of WG.

A classic demo is to flick a lit match into a pool of autogas. WHOOMP! Whether a lit cigarette would do the same I do not know, but who smokes today?

WG flare-ups seem more of a safety issue

And how!!! I have photos of melted tents from this problem. The campers had trouble with the priming, and spilt more autogas than they realised.

lots of Amazon listings that would ship butane to the 48 states (I suspect some of those are properly labeled for surface-only shipping)

Provided the butane is in DoT-approved packages and you use a carrier who can handle this stuff, of course. How else do you think the cans reach the shops selling them? Maybe not the post office.

As for fuel consumption – my experience has been that one typically uses double the amount of autogas or kero compared to butane/propane. That’s based on many years of record-keeping. Priming and starting is a major consumer.

</sermon>
Cheers

[Ben H.]

I noticed the website that sells these propane cans has a camping section:

https://www.ultracool.ca/camping/

… with the tantalizing “Coming Soon…” Perhaps the company plans to market it to backpackers.

I’m not sure why this thread got derailed into WG.  Lots of people love there SVEA 123 but I haven’t noticed lots of advancements or competitors over the years.  The market has spoken and left WG behind…. sorry.

[David Gardner]

Can’t wait to see what ultracool ultralight camping stuff they come up with!

[Nick Gatel]

Whether a lit cigarette would do the same I do not know

The answer is, No.

When I used to rebuild a lot of carburetors, I used to do all kinds of fun things with the young guys just starting out.

The most common was to drain the gas in the carb into a small bucket, light a cigarette and ask the new guy if he wanted to bet $1 I could make a basket with the cig into the bucket. Most would run away to a safe distance, expecting it to blow up or something.

One of my favorites was to take the plastic tray the rebuilt kit came in and I would give it to a new guy and tell him to go to a gas pump and fill it up. Then we would watch to see what he did when the bottom melted. Some would lift it up, see no gas, put it down and try again and again.

 

[Aleksi K]

spent cartridges going into a landfill

No metal recycling available?

[Roger Caffin]

^^ Just so. Recycle!

Cheers

[Jan Rezac]

These titanium spheres posted at the beginning are cool. An UL Svea-style integrated tank liquid fuel stove may be built on top of a small one…

[Nick Gatel]

Seems that a light Caffin vortex stove using liquid gas and one of these light bottles with a threaded cap, instead of a Lindal type valve, would be very marketable. Can Ranger develop a super light, and reliable pump?

[Roger Caffin]

You mean an MSR XGK at 1/10th the weight? :)

Cheers

[Nick Gatel]

You mean an MSR XGK at 1/10th the weight?

Yeah, but I have little need for multiple fuels. In the US, white gas is readily available in department stoves and other places. Once in a great while I have to clean a jet with a pricker. Would a IsoPro/WG stove need different jets?

I kinda like the roar caused by flame spreaders too ;)

I have a WindPro II, which is a little heavy, but it works well. I use it sometimes in colder weather. For snow work I still use a WhisperLite.

 

[Roger Caffin]

>> Would a IsoPro/WG stove need different jets?
There have been stoves on the market which offered this. One of them provided two different jets (ie with different sized holes) for the different fuels, and another one provided a control over the air inlets to adjust the fuel/air mix. White gas and kero need a LOT more air than butane, due to the differences in the number of carbon atoms in the molecules.
None of these stove was really commercially successful.

Me, I am scared of white gas stoves. I have used them in the past, and I have seen a number of accidents. Safety when cooking inside my tent in a storm is more important to me.

Cheers

[Jerry Adams]

I had one of those, whisperlite international

It worked good for years, just gave it away so someone could make use of it

I tried kerosene once, replacing the jet with the one for kerosene.  That stuff is even smellier than WG.  Everything in my pack was stinky. Didn’t do that again.

They have a built in jet pricker.  You turn it upside down and shake, and it cleaned the jet.

Upright butane – much better, never turn back.

[Nick Gatel]

Me, I am scared of white gas stoves. I have used them in the past, and I have seen a number of accidents. Safety when cooking inside my tent in a storm is more important to me.

I have read stories of canisters exploding. User error. I think you even posted one.

I have read more stories of WB stove accidents. User error.

Also stories of big fires from alcohol stoves. User error.

Yes, it is easier to have an accident with a white gas stove. I use them in my shelters, but don’t light them inside, unless a large pyramid. I rarely get a “soccer sized” ball of fire when lighting them. Actually I wrote a couple posts on WG stoves on my blog recently and had to light my stoves several times to get a soccer sized ball of flame to take a picture. They are just more convenient for me and fuel is easier to come by on long trips.

But yes, they are inherently more dangerous if used improperly.

I have had a few gas stoves: Gerry/Hank Roberts, Optimus 731 Mouse Trap, GAZ GlobeTrotter, Gaz Bluet S200, and a Gaz TriStar. The one problem with all of these stoves is the canisters became obsolete. On the other hand, The first backpacking stove I bought is 48 years old and I am still using it. It’s a WG stove, a Svea 123. Besides, stoves are a hobby of mine, they’re just utensils.

I no longer read stove reviews, because I’m never going to buy another stove, unless California outlaws WG. But I do enjoy a lot of the articles on BPL about the science behind the stoves and fuels, and I enjoy threads like this.

 

[David Gardner]

Jon Fong is testing his new Ocelot Cooking System for canister topped stoves using mostly-empty propane bottles with BRS 3000T, Fire Maple Wasp/Hornet, and Pocket Rocket 2:

Flat Cat Gear

[Roger Caffin]

>> I have read stories of canisters exploding. User error. I think you even posted one.
Deceptive stuff.
I have seen videos of canisters exploding – when thrown into a fire by teenage males. This is not a ‘user error’; this is user stupidity. But I have also seen videos of teenagers with autogas …

I blew up one canister myself – under carefully controlled conditions with safety precautions – I was hiding behind a steel barrier and there were NO naked flames anywhere.

I too can light a white gas or kero stove inside a tent, but it takes a fair bit of skill and experience, which novices do not have.

But each to his own. HYOH.

Cheers

[Jerry Adams]

The best thing to do is run WG stove to get it hot, then turn off, then turn back on.

Since it’s hot, the WG will vaporize.

Ignite and you get nice fireball.

(Dont really do this, dangerous, you have to let it cool off first)

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