The JB Stash performs well in 4 mph winds?

[David Gardner]

Surprisingly, according to these guys it does. Doesn’t seem to be the consensus with people in the know so I’m wondering how they did it.

[Kevin Babione]

As a Guthook subscriber I too was surprised when they said it works well in a “simulated 4 mph wind”.  I would describe that as a light breeze…Not “windy.”

[Jon Fong / Flat Cat Gear]

My experience as well as Fossil Bluff (trek-lite) is that at 4 mph the stove performs as expected.  That being said, above 4 mph, it falls off a cliff.   At 5 mph, the boil time shoot up towards 30 minutes and fuel consumption went to about 28 grams.   The Pocket Rocket and Soto WindMaster were able to boil water at 5 mph but sill used a lot of fuel.

[Michael Sirofchuck]

Just looking at the setup, I figured a wind screen needs to be part of the set up.  Impressive numbers in flat calm conditions.

[Jon Fong / Flat Cat Gear]

IT turns out that a simple “Ocelot” (partial) windscreen does not work well.  If you use a windscreen, it will need to be a full height, 3/4 loose wrap windscreen.  My 2 cents.

 

This doesn’t work well in high winds (>5 mph)

[Paul Wagner]

I have to wonder who would want a backpacking stove that doesn’t work at 5mph winds?

[Jon Fong / Flat Cat Gear]

IMO, all basic canister topped stoves (excluding some integrated stoves like JetBoil & MSR Reactor) really don’t work above 5 mph.  They need a windscreen of some sort.

[Brad W]

Camped with someone who had this. Very light breeze-less than 5mph. We all had our water boiling long before the Stash. Most had MSR Pocket Rocket, BRS 3000 and Soto stoves. The Stash barely had any output-shockingly bad.

 

 

[Jon Fong / Flat Cat Gear]

BTW,

Jetboil Stash at 5 mph wind

 

PocketRocket Deluxe at 5 mph  (and yes, the stove came slightly tweaked)

[JCH]

I’m gonna say it again…Soto Windmaster paired with a 130mm 0.9L Toaks pot.  Best setup I have found.  Looks alot like Jon’s photo of the PRD when used in the wind.

[Jon Fong / Flat Cat Gear]

To me, The Soto WindMaster and the Pocket Rocket Deluxe are basically the same stove: both perform well in the wind.  A close second would be the Soto Amicus (an unregulated stove).  My 2 cents.

[Brad W]

My Amicus mopped the floor with the Stash. The output really was abysmal. I don’t know what Guthooks is using for their test, it wasn’t the production Stash. One of the worst stoves I have seen.

 

 

[Jon Fong / Flat Cat Gear]

Guthook Analysis – that dog don’t hunt.

They never mentioned the starting temperature of the water.  Assuming that it started at 70 F and was at sea level, 3.6 grams of isobutane translates to about a 98% efficiency.  Unlikely.  My 2 cents.

[David Gardner]

“Our tests showed you can boil 2-cups of 72°F water at 5,280 feet in 1:55 with just 3.6 grams of fuel.”

So maybe only 96-97% efficiency? In their dreams!

[Michael B]

It’s pretty easy to park something (like a bear can or food bag) in front of the wind in most cases. Just sayin.

[bradmacmt]

To me, The Soto WindMaster and the Pocket Rocket Deluxe are basically the same stove: both perform well in the wind.

I’ve been doing some preliminary boil tests lately with the Soto Windmaster, Pocket Rocket Deluxe, and Jetboil Ti (the Jetboil Ti is generally using 40% +/- less fuel).

With both a small diameter pot (3.7″) and medium dia pot (4.5″) I’ve been using in conjunction with the Soto and PRD, the Soto has generally edged out the PRD by using around 1 gm less fuel to boil 16 oz’s of 42*F H2o @ 5,015′.

I’ve yet to do wind tests with the three, but when the PRD gets back from a trip to MSR to fix its pitiful piezo igniter, I’ll give those a go. I’ve also developed a 2nd Gen 1 oz Ti windscreen for the PRD so will test that too.

All in all, the Soto Windmaster sits 2mm closer to the pot bottom than the PRD… I wonder whether this is helping fuel usage and if it makes it marginally better in the wind than the PRD?

I do know the PRD’s igniter sucks, whereas the Soto’s has never missed. I’m really growing attached to the Windmaster with its 3 prong pot support.

As to the Stash, it looks like a poorly thought-out corporate attempt. And regarding the referenced test, I’ve never found 72*F water anywhere at over 5,000′, unless it’s been in a bag in the sun for a good long time. I prefer to use 42*F water to get a better real-world result.

Anyway, just some rambling semi-related thoughts.

This is a good thread.

 

 

[bradmacmt]

It’s pretty easy to park something (like a bear can or food bag) in front of the wind in most cases. Just sayin.

Well, yes and no. I typically find this strategy only sort of works. Wind in the mountains typically swirls quite a bit and this practice, while somewhat helpful, is of limited efficacy IME.

[Chris FormyDuval]

If I did the numbers correctly I get about 88% efficiency given  2 cup, 72 degrees and 5280 altitude. Seems like the numbers are maybe half a gram off? Just not sure of the wisdom in telling people they’ll get 27 boils out of a 100gram canister.

[Jon Fong / Flat Cat Gear]

@Chris FormyDuval I concur with your analysis.

My biggest concern is that Guthook’s article comes across as rigorous and almost scientific.  There are a few flawed assumptions with respect to performance in the wind (not taken to a high enough level) and the energy efficiency is not credible.

That being said, the JetBoil Stash is a fine “fair weather” cooking system.  It will do a great job in calm conditions.  Yes, you can block the wind with your body or other items, it is just one more thing to think about.  5mph is not a very strong breeze at all.  It is not the lightest system out there and it is certainly not the cheapest option.  REI and Amazon will help them to sell a bunch of units.  my guess is that after a year, JetBoil will come out with an improved version of the Stash.  My 2 cents.

[Chris R]

I may be wrong but according to the lines they plotted, the stoves they test all use the same amount of gas to boil the first two cups of water as they do to boil the last two cups.

Idiots doing science? Lazy? Or deliberately misleading?

[Brad W]

@jonfong “the JetBoil Stash is a fine “fair weather” cooking system.”.

From what I saw, I would argue against this statement. In calm conditions the Stash performed worse than everyone in our groups setups. The user was a bit embarrassed at the low output of the stove. I can’t speak to the pot/lid but the stove itself was very poor and took considerably longer than everyone else. Someone else had the Stash, reported the same poor performance and returned it the week prior.

 

 

[Jon Fong / Flat Cat Gear]

@Brad W – interesting. I have a JetBoil Stash and in calm weather, it works as advertised.  I have also compared it to the Soto WindMaster, Pocket Rocket Deluxe, Soto Amicus, PR2 and others.  In calm conditions, it has great fuel efficiencies.  With wind up t 4 mph, it’s not bad.  It is also super fast and super efficient.

Above 4 mph, the WindMaster and PRD are far better.

I have an experimental Ocelot HX for the Stash and was able to boil 2 cups in 15 mph wind in under 4 minutes.

[David Gardner]

My larger concern after reading this review is whether Guthooks is credible in general. I had thought so previously, but now I’m wondering how much commercial interests are influencing their content.

[David Gardner]

Jon – tell us more about that experimental Ocelot HX for the Stash!

[Brad W]

@jonfong How loud was the Stash at full output? Maybe there was a bad batch because the one I saw was about 1/5th the jet engine sound of a typical isobut stove. The user that returned his said he had the same weak output.

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