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New windshield system for canister stoves: Simmershield


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Home Forums Gear Forums Gear (General) New windshield system for canister stoves: Simmershield

Viewing 25 posts - 1 through 25 (of 34 total)
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  • #3652201
    Doug Coe
    BPL Member

    @sierradoug

    Locale: Bay Area, CA, USA

    I just saw a link to this over on Reddit (r/ultralight). It comes with a handleless Ti pot with lid, stove, cozy, and the cool new windscreen they came up with. Looks interesting. Simmershield.

    #3652209
    SIMULACRA
    BPL Member

    @simulacra

    Locale: Puget Sound

    I feel as if that looks like something DanY was working on here last Fall/Winter. Similar like. Does look interesting though

    #3652287
    James Marco
    BPL Member

    @jamesdmarco

    Locale: Finger Lakes

    Interesting, but losses are still a problem along with awkward usability. The heat shield WILL get HOT.

    #3652395
    Stormin
    Spectator

    @stormin-stove-systems

    Locale: East Anglia

    YouTube video

    #3652571
    David Gardner
    BPL Member

    @gearmaker

    Locale: Northern California

    Any idea how weight and performance compare with Flat Cat’s Ocelot windscreen system?

    #3652574
    Jon Fong / Flat Cat Gear
    BPL Member

    @jonfong

    Locale: FLAT CAT GEAR

    Hey, I can’t even come close to the Simmershield efficiency.  They claim that they were able to boil 13.5 liters with a 4 oz. canister under ideal conditions (that works out +28 two cup boils).  That and they did it with a BRS 3000t!  It looks like the bar has been set pretty high!  My 2 cents.

    #3652577
    David Thomas
    BPL Member

    @davidinkenai

    Locale: North Woods. Far North.

    I saw that 13.5 liters boiled with 4 ounces butane claim in their Reddit post and I’ll wait till someone confirms it independently.  They claimed “twice the efficiency” and I’m not seeing it, unless they get to use a low throttle, indoor, no wind, 70F water and the benchmark is outdoor, wind, 32F water and full throttle.

    #3652582
    Jon Fong / Flat Cat Gear
    BPL Member

    @jonfong

    Locale: FLAT CAT GEAR

    Of course, YMMV!

    #3652603
    R
    Spectator

    @autox

    They list boil times from 5 – 10 minutes, stating, “SimmerShield’s boil time is more similar to an alcohol stove than a typical integrated canister stove.”

    I just did a test boil on my BRS3000 with a 10cm Imusa pot (about the same size as theirs), starting with 500g of 70F tap water in my kitchen (also 70F), no wind.

    I used a low throttle, boiling in 10:15, burning 8g of fuel.  No heat shield or cozy, just a lid.  They’re claiming ~4.3g, so even under ideal conditions, that’s still a big improvement.

    Looking around BPL for wind screen performance in still conditions, I could only find one thread on a lower screen giving a 3% improvement, here.  Everything else compared still to windy.  I do recall a thread from several years ago measuring efficiency improvements of insulated lids.  It focused on winter temperatures. I think the results were around 10%, but I can’t find the thread now.

    #3652605
    R
    Spectator

    @autox

    Just found this old thread form Jerry: https://backpackinglight.com/forums/topic/68713/

    He got a 15% improvement from a screen around the sides of a wide pot (I bet it’ll be higher for a narrower pot since there’s more hot gas going up the sides).  Add a lower screen and cozy and you’re around 30%.  Simmershield claims 46% over what I just measured.  Starting to sound plausible.

    #3652612
    Cameron M
    BPL Member

    @cameronm-aka-backstroke

    Locale: Los Angeles

    In a windless condition I get a 13% improvement with no cozy and no bottom shield.

    I am still trying to make a new design work with no bottom shield, but I doubt it adds that much for heat direction/retention.

    #3652615
    bradmacmt
    BPL Member

    @bradmacmt

    Locale: montana

    Just get a Jetboil…

    #3652646
    Jerry Adams
    BPL Member

    @retiredjerry

    Locale: Oregon and Washington

    How much improvement does a Jetboil get?  That’s a real heat exchanger.  How much does it weigh?

    Yeah, my halfway heat exchanger gets 15% improvement.  1.4 oz.  That’s hard to beat for performance vs weight

    #3652726
    J-L
    BPL Member

    @johnnyh88

    4.3 grams for a 2-cup boil would be impressive, especially with the terrible BRS stove. My Jetboil averages about 5 grams under real conditions, but I usually don’t do a full rolling boil.

    Jetboil could easily lighten up their whole system (ditch the plastic and galvanized steel), but they seem more focused on marginally faster boil times. I’m guessing that sells better at REI.

    #3652731
    Jerry Adams
    BPL Member

    @retiredjerry

    Locale: Oregon and Washington

    yeah, equipment manufacturers not so much into the last bit of performance – weight for example, especially if there’s a chance there could be failures and unhappy customers returning it

    more into stylishness.  Youtube videos with groups of happy people using the product

    #3652735
    Jerry Adams
    BPL Member

    @retiredjerry

    Locale: Oregon and Washington

    do you also need a windscreen with a Jetboil?

    #3652736
    Ken Larson
    BPL Member

    @kenlarson

    Locale: Western Michigan

    Jerry…..”Yeah, my halfway heat ex changer gets 15% improvement. 1.4 oz. ”

    Could you refresh our memories concerning your ex changer with a picture and more?

    Thanks

     

    #3652739
    Jerry Adams
    BPL Member

    @retiredjerry

    Locale: Oregon and Washington

    I described it in https://backpackinglight.com/forums/topic/107187/page/3/#comments

    People are saying “great, you’re just encouraging Jerry to talk about his heat exchanger… again…” : )

    #3652877
    Roger Caffin
    BPL Member

    @rcaffin

    Locale: Wollemi & Kosciusko NPs, Europe

    >> terrible BRS stove
    Only the cheap clones. The real genuine BRS-3000 works very well. I have several, and use them.

    Cheers

    #3653213
    Eric Blumensaadt
    BPL Member

    @danepacker

    Locale: Mojave Desert

    Be nice if Simmer Shield offered a few different sizes of INSERTS to make the shield wider for different pots. No?

    #3655052
    DAN-Y/FANCEE FEEST
    Spectator

    @zelph2

    I got this kit in the mail today, bought it for my wife. 3/4 windsheild fits the notorious BRS3000t. My favorite Sierra bowl fits perfect.

     

     

    #3655064
    bradmacmt
    BPL Member

    @bradmacmt

    Locale: montana

    Looks like a lot of bother to,avoid what the Jetboil already does…

    #3655073
    DAN-Y/FANCEE FEEST
    Spectator

    @zelph2

    Looks like a lot of bother to,avoid what the Jetboil already does…

     

    Yes, get a jetboil….they are nice.

    #3682215
    SimmerShield
    Spectator

    @simmershield

    Locale: SimmerShield

    Hey all,

    This is the SimmerShield team dropping in to participate and answer questions and expand on some points.  Consider this our “commercial disclaimer” as outlined in the forum rules.

     

    James Marco: Interesting, but losses are still a problem along with awkward usability.

    It is a bit fiddly, at the first few times you put it together.  Once you spend some time with it, it’s pretty quick and easy.

    James Marco: The heat shield WILL get HOT.

    We recommend running the burner at quite a low output for best efficiency.  At those throttle settings the shield doesn’t get too hot.  You can poke at it to adjust it while it’s running without burning your fingers.  Because the shield is so thin, there just isn’t much thermal mass; you can comfortably grab the shield wall to remove it from the cup immediately after turning off the burner.

    David Thomas:  I saw that 13.5 liters boiled with 4 ounces butane claim in their Reddit post and I’ll wait till someone confirms it independently.  They claimed “twice the efficiency” and I’m not seeing it, unless they get to use a low throttle, indoor, no wind, 70F water and the benchmark is outdoor, wind, 32F water and full throttle.

    The 13.5L number comes from our “Perfect” condition lab testing, so yeah the big numbers are low throttle, indoor, and 50F water.  The other systems (benchmarks) are under the exact same conditions.

    We tested to simulate both dead calm and windy conditions.  The “windy” test consisted of a fairly powerful box fan pointing at the stoves, with a wind-block in between.  The intent was to simulate windy conditions where you are able to partially shelter the system behind a log or similar object.  Under these conditions, we boiled about 10L of water with our system, and about 5L of water with a conventional canister burner.  That’s where the “twice the efficiency” claim comes from.

    We can now offer some better real-world data.  This past summer we spent about two months hiking in the Canadian Rockies with our SimmerShield, tracking data the whole time.  In those conditions (cool ambient temps, plenty of wind, very cold source water, etc) we were consistently able to heat a bit more than 11L of water per 4oz fuel canister.

    bradmacmt: Just get a Jetboil…

    These are good products, but are meaningfully different than our system.  They are are faster and (arguably) a bit easier to set up.  SimmerShield is lighter and more compact.  The efficiency levels are pretty similar, maybe a little bit better for our system.

    John: the terrible BRS stove.

    Haha, yeah the BRS by itself isn’t the best burner out there, especially in windy conditions.  However in our system it works just fine; any other option would be bigger and heavier with no compensating upside.

     

    Thank you to Doug Coe for posting here about our little product.  We meant to get back to this earlier but it’s been a busy summer and we’re doing this as a hobby.  One of our goals was to avoid car-style advertising and just tell people the facts and see if they like it.  Let us know if you have any other questions :)

    #3682234
    obx hiker
    BPL Member

    @obxer

    any other option would be bigger and heavier with no compensating upside.

    Question not challenge. A man’s gotta know his limitations and I know I don’t know squat about stoves; but it seems you’re saying the efficiencies are only realized with the BRs3000? Is this something to do with it’s ability to really simmer at some um-matched low fuel consumption rate?

    These are good products (jetboil), but are meaningfully different than our system. They are are faster and (arguably) a bit easier to set up. SimmerShield is lighter and more compact. The efficiency levels are pretty similar, maybe a little bit better for our system.

    I have an old jetboil and my completely unscientific results on efficiency seem to roughly match your statement I appreciate the transparency and restraint on hyperbole but /and also note that to me the “lighter and more compact” part might in many situations more than compensate for the “faster and (arguably) a bit easier to set up.”

    Thanks for adding to the discussion and for pushing the ball forward so to speak with this nifty wind screen.

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