Lightweight shelter for nordic countries

[Viktor S]

What’s up BPL, first post coming :D Hoping for some quality advice from the best!

So I am in a massive shelter research run, that pretty much boils down to finding the best large UL shelter for harsh Swedish / Norwegian conditions above the treeline for my girlfriend and I. A typical hike for us is 14 days off trail above the arctic circle with days to the nearest emergency hut or other person, 100% above the treeline, temps ranging between 0-15c at night, winds at their worst hitting 20-30m/s. Add rain and mosquitos on top of that. So we basically need something bomber enough to not risk failing AND be actually nice to hang out in after enduring an entire day of rain. I’m guessing it’s a bit similar to Alaska but less bears.

Today we use a Fjällräven abisko endurance 3 tunnel tent that weighs in at 3030g and has no views :( All our other gear is pretty UL now so it would be really great to switch out our shelter as well. We do however love the space in that thing and have previously had a terrible time in a cramped shelter we had to spend time in during way too much rain.

Requirements

• 2-3 person shelter (ideally at least 130cm wide sleeping space)
• High ceiling height
• Insect proof + bathtub floor
• View(s)
• Ability to store wet gear
• Ability to hang wet clothes
• Ability to cook sheltered
• Can withstand harsh winds
• Roughly 1.5kg or less
• Price is not an issue
• Cuben is a plus just as a personal preference
• My girlfriend is quite cold BUT we are thinking added sleep system weights make more sense than solid inners weight wise

Options

In rough order of preference

HMG Ultamid 4 

With the full inner. I really want this tent. I love it. I’ve almost ordered it so many times. BUT, I can’t seem to wrap my head around not having a vestibule. For one, we cook (boil water) twice a day in the tent usually. Also, we currently almost fill our tunnel tent with wet clothes hanging to dry. It’s also nice to change and store wet packs outside of the inner.

Changing and cooking can be solved by temporarily unclipping the inner to create vestibule space. But with the inner net in place I don’t see any way of solving the clothes drying issue. Also it won’t be possible to get views when it’s raining / open the door when it’s raining.

Getting a half inner actually feels like it would be too small to feel nice to hang out in due to the lower height and quite narrow width. I have toyed around with getting Bearpawwd to custom make a 200x260x190 cuben inner for roughly 70cm of vestibule space, but I’m not sure this even solves the issue of hanging wet clothes. Plus I’ve never seen it done. I know LG makes a 4/5 inner for their Khafra but when sketching it up it is just 50cm of vestibule space with even steeper walls not really giving much space in practice.

Another option I’ve thought of is getting a small flat tarp and pitching it through the apex and a trekking pole in front of the door to create a porch. However, that feels quite finicky and seems like it would harm the wind shedding abilities quite a bit.

Bearpawwd Cuben Hexatent 3

Everyone seems to love the old SL3, but I haven’t seen anyone talk about this cuben version from Bearpawwd. My thoughts are I would combine it with a 3/4 inner to create a vestibule. Seems like a pretty sweet solution for 2 with real vestibule space and real inner space. The drawback being the Hexatent 3 doesn’t look like it has that much of a cat curve, and I don’t trust the build quality of BP 100%.

When I read in the european forums lots of people still seem to go for the modern SL3 variants but in silnylon, but nobody talks about the Hexatent..

Tarptent Stratospire 2

The SS2 seems really great for our needs, but I worry that it isn’t stormproof enough. I also don’t like the fact that it is silnylon and will require retensioning. Cuben just makes me feel nice inside. This might actually be the sensible choice though.

Tarptent Cloudburst 3

Would get it with the top inner. Also seems really reasonable for us seeing as it is a tunnel tent. Added advantage of actually having views and double vestibules. Just I’m not in love with it, feels a bit boring. Probably sensible choice #2.

Zpacks Triplex

Would really like a duplex / triplex but from what I’ve read on European forums it shouldn’t be trusted to handle such harsh conditions.

MLD Trailstar

Seems bomber and great, but not actually comfortable to live in when the weather gets rough. MLD actually makes a BigStar but there is 0 info available on the internet. Plus I’m guessing it’s ridiculously huge.

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Hope you can provide some mental support in this insanely over-analyzed mission :D

[Brad Rogers]

I don’t have a great answer but I will throw in my two cents:

My wife and I have used the Golite Shangri-La 5 and HMG Ultamid 4 with a half inner (custom by Bear-Paw) and they were OK. Pretty storm worthy and had a great vestibule. The half inner made the sleeping area “just” big enough, but headroom was virtually non existent for the person sleeping on the outside edge. I recently sold the Ultamid because it was redundant with the Shangri-La 5 and I just didn’t use it enough to warrant the (opportunity) cost of keeping it.

I have used the Duomid in Alaska, Sierra’s and Rockies and trust it completely in foul weather, but it is WAY too small for two people – its a solo tent in everything but an emergency.

HMG Ultamid 4 – You are right this is a great choice….until you put the full inner with it. With a full inner you have to put it up first, it adds a LOT of fiddle factor, you have no vestibule, and it rains inside the inner when you open the door. A half inner solves those problems, but as I said before is just barely enough room for the person on the outside. You might be able to come up with an inner at a diagonal that solves some of those problems but of course it would be a complicated custom one off to build.

Bear Paw Cuben Hexatent 3 – I would avoid this for two reasons; I think complicated shapes are difficult to pitch in cuben since it will not stretch. Cuben is very unforgiving for getting a stake even just a little off – that’s not an issue on a square or rectangle mid, but on a hexagon, it gets a lot harder. Secondly, Bear Paw quality is pretty bad. He made a net-tent for me and while it is functional, it looks like I made it myself, and that is not a complement. There are numerous stories around about their dubious quality.

Tarptent Statospire 2 – This is actually what I am planning to get for my wife and I to use on trips where we go together. It looks like a great design, and would be my suggestion if you need shelter for two plus bug protection (without bug protection, I would go with something like an Ultamid 2). The trips I would take my wife on probably wouldn’t test it’s limits, but I have tried to read up on it’s storm worthiness anyways, and it seems to fair fairly well on forums like Trek-Lite that have a lot reports from England and Scotland. I am not sure how it would hold up for you but if you go that route, I would love to hear your opinion after you test it out.

Tarptent Cloudburst 3 – This is an interesting choice, particularly with the solid inner they offer, my concern is that while it is a tunnel tent, I am not sure it is particularly storm worthy. I think with some work it could be a solid design with added guylines (and longer guys on the ends), and even a center pole (with a sleeve – not like the one they sell). I would love to hear back on this one too, but from what I have read, the Cloudburst would not be strong enough for what you are looking for.

MLD Duomid – I have never used one, but from all reports they are bomber in the wind, but to me they would have livability issues (that might be worth it for the weight and wind resistance) having to crawl through the “door” and overall not having a bunch of headroom. I’m not sure how much room there really is with the inner for two. I have heard reports of it being a palace, and others of it being really cramped, so obviously different people have different expectations. I would suggest silnylon over cuben here as I have read numerous reports of people discussing how hard the cuben trailstar is to pitch.

[Edward John M]

I am researching for similar reasons and purposes and you already have what a lot of people are recommending for my needs, some of the tents I have been recommended actually weigh more and I am going to be traveling solo

As I have been reminded there is such a thing as Stupid Light and the High Arctic is no place for compromise. You may save a kilo of tent and wind up using 2 or 3 kilos more food and fuel over a fortnite

[Viktor S]

Awesome, I always overdo these types of posts resulting in subpar answers, but this time it worked! I was actually hoping you would respond as I’ve noticed we share similar thoughts on shelters after lurking the forums for a while. Have you ever been to our parts of the world for a trek? :)

Since you kept the SL5, when do you use it, and with what inner (whas it the BP for both)? Would you otherwise recommend a hexagonal mid for my purposes if it wasn’t cuben?  Your thoughts regarding the Hexatent pretty much confirm my suspicions making it a poor choice.

It just makes me sad that a cuben mid isn’t for us. I guess our last option would be a floorless mesh with a bathtub for versatility, but that also seems like it would have it’s own problems. Or maybe that is the perfect solution…

Honestly it all seems to boil down to the SS2 being the best choice. I guess I need to find a way to get excited about that. We will also have to figure out if it is worth it with the solid inner, another reasonable choice but again void of fun by destroying the views. I guess I also need to figure out if it’s actually possible to hang clothes anywhere in there. Lastly, I need to get over the boring color and the sag issues of silnylon.

Now see, for all of the above reasons I’m still considering the Triplex. People do seem to get along with it in Iceland, which should provide a similar setting. That’s probably just the allure of cuben trying to trick me into making a choice that will leave my GF and myself miserable in the drafty and sandy plains of Iceland (we might actually be doing an Iceland traverse this summer if we can find an exciting enough route :) ).

Thanks for your thoughts Brad!

[Brad Rogers]

For the folks (like me) that don’t use the metric system or Celsius too well, the intended usage is 32*F to 5*F which isn’t that bad, but windspeeds from 47mph to 67mph.

[Viktor S]

@edward – where are you headed? :) Any favorites in your tent research so far?

I totally agree with the SL sentiment. The one aspect I however feel I need to change that justifies all of this is the fact that we don’t get any views out of our current setup with the door being on the side of the vestibule. Kind of sucks to have the conflict of choosing between being cozy and removing yourself from the very environment you came to visit.

[Viktor S]

@mocs123 Thanks! To be clear, I specified such strong winds since we are out for long periods of time in exposed mountain ranges / open plains. I don’t think we have experienced winds quite that rough yet but it should be entirely possible.

[Edward John M]

Victor I plan on a trip to the Canadian Arctic in 2020, but I experience winds well in excess of those speeds during my normal ski trip camping here in Australia, conditions here are very much like Scotland, heavy wet snow and high winds I have experienced winds in excess of 100klicks with gusts to double that I have lost a lot of tents over the years and now tend to go heavier and stronger if in doubt.

I use a Macpac Minaret as my solo tent but it is cramped in a 3 day blow

https://www.macpac.com.au/equipment/tents/tramping-hiking-tents/minaret-tramping-tent.html

Two up I use an older 4 pole hybrid similar to the Quasar but a bit heavier and stronger made by the now defunct FairyDown of New Zealand

http://www.terra-nova.co.uk/tents-and-spares/all-tents/expedition-quasar-tent/

[Viktor S]

Henry Spires really should put alt-tags on the images in the tarptent gallery. There are so many beautiful pics there and actually several of a SS in the Swedish wilderness. Unfortunately they will never show up in a Google image search without proper tagging. I think I’m really starting to come to terms with the SS2. It might seem like a quick decision but this is a calm that’s the result of weeks and weeks of intense research. Maybe all it took was structuring my thoughts into a post…

@moondog55 Cool! Seem like bomber shelters that can withstand anything and I guess it’s a different beast if winter camping. If I could dream real big I would have loved one of Roger Caffin’s cuben tunnels otherwise. I haven’t winter camped yet but this summer it sure felt like winter with snow everywhere in the middle of august.

Since I’ll probably be selling the Fjällräven it only seems right to honor her with some pics from our most recent trip. She really is a beautiful tent :)

Pics

 

[Edward John M]

I doubt that Roger will ever get his tents to market but I would like to see them out there.

My High Arctic plans are for winter so bomber tents are the only safe option, otherwise a Cuben ‘Mid in an XL size with CF pole and a good bug net perhaps

I am well over 6 feet tall so I need 8 feet plus to avoid wall contact in a ‘Mid

[Eric Blumensaadt]

I have winterized both my Tarptent Moment DW and Scarp 2 by buying the optional crossing poles and running them under the fly of each tent. See “The Tarptent Thread” in this gear forum for the Moment DW.

Look here in the “Winter Hiking” forum for “Winterized Scarp 2”. Obviously the X-ing poles need to be shortened a bit for both tents to fit under the flys and in the case of the Scarp 2 the exterior pole end grommets had to be sewn inside just above the ^ shaped “PitchLoc” carbon fiber corner struts. But this adds great strength to their anchor points.

You are correct, the Stratospire 2 is not as good as resisting high winds and snow loads as designs that require several dedicated, curved and shock-corded tent poles.

**Also look at the Sierra Designs 4 season Convert 2 dome tent with vestibule and larger Convert 3 version with double vestibules. Vey light and stormproof and high quality. BUT these tents require erecting the inner tent BEFORE the fly, not always a good idea in high winds or rain. Tents that can be set up with the fly and liner tent as a single unit are more desirable. Tarptents are  made this way, thankfully!

[Brad Rogers]

Awesome pictures!!! What time of year is that, July?

We have used the SL5 in Colorado (Rocky Mtn National Park) and in New Mexico (Pecos Wilderness), as well as all over the Southern Appalachians (Tennessee, North Carolina, Georgia, and Virginia) and we used it a couple of times with no inner (which I prefer if there are no bugs, but my wife doesn’t like) and with the same Bear Paw half inner-net (18.5oz). that we used with the Ultamid 4. I also have the factory Golite inner net for the SL5 that we’ve used car camping.

A cuben mid isn’t necessarily out – perhaps there is a more innovative way to make the inner net or perhaps the pole inside the inner – making you put it up before the mid “fly” wouldn’t bother you like it does me. I think a Cuben Duomid (or similar) is the best UL solo shelter, and a larger mid makes a great two person shelter if you don’t need an inner-net, but when you do, they lose some advantages over other shelter types in my opinion. The Duomid XL is somewhat intriguing but my OCD can’t stand the lack of symmetry.

What about a Tarptent Scarp 2? I have no experience with one and they are a bit heavy, but they seem to handle high winds well and be pretty bomb-proof according to the people on Trek-Lite

[Iago Vazquez]

If you are going to go with a custom inner, how about a 3/4 or 4/5 inner? The Golite/MTC SL 5/4 one as inspiration?

[Sam Farrington]

Sometimes the answer is right in front of you.  So am wondering why you did not consider a Hilleberg tent.  Or even a Helsport.  You said you wanted something ‘bomber,’  and many of their offerings qualify.

Here in the US, it is not hard to find places where shelter that is less than bomber will do fine, as even in Colorado, one can find great sheltered tent sites just below Timberline.  But assuming you meant what you said about wanting a bomber tent, you might do much better carrying a bit more weight – not a lot more, just a little more.

There is a long running Hilleberg thread on this site that you should be able to find easily, and it is packed with information.  The gossamer-light tents that work fine in many parts of the US are not really what you are looking for, I think.

[Viktor S]

@iago That’s a good idea, I hadn’t actually considered the corner cut off SL5 inner. I also found this thread which seems to try what I was thinking for the Ultamid 4: https://backpackinglight.com/forums/topic/43063/

Seeing as the SL5 was 2.9m x 2.9m it seems to be roughly the same as the Ultamid 4, so it should be doable. Hmm now I need to do some more research! Do you happen to have any experience with a 3/4 or 4/5 inner?

@danepacker are you saying you think the SS2 is too weak for my needs? I’ll have a look at the winterized scarp 2, I just find it a shame that the inside space and vestibule space is a bit tighter.

@mocs123 It is in mid August, but winter was so late this summer that half of the trip was on snow. One of the lakes I was most looking forward to seeing was just completely iced over and we had to change our route a bit to not risk too many unsafe snow crossings. Was an awesome trip overall though :) Regarding the stock SL5 inner, what do you think of it except for the obvious high weight?

@scfhome As I wrote in the OP I basically have a Hilleberg today, except it is a Fjällräven. It is a 3 person / 3 pole tunnel tent that survives anything that has been thrown at it so far, weighing in at 3kg. I don’t feel like getting a smaller / lighter tunnel restricting our living space, but would like to find out if there are other types of shelter designs I can use in it’s place providing us with views and lighter weight. People use UL shelters here as well, I just need to find the right tradeoffs to make to find something that works for us. Appreciate the sentiment however since a Hilleberg type tent is a really great solution in general for this environment.

Thanks so much for the thoughts so far everyone!

[Brad Rogers]

Well those pictures are beautiful, just my type of preferred hiking. That is a lot of snow to be left over in mid – August, of course the contrast of the snow makes for great photos. Perhaps I do need to plan a trip over the pond one of these years.

I don’t care for the fact that I have to set the stock SL5 inner-net up before I put the SL5 “fly” up. It’s not a big deal car camping or using it on an overnighter with the kids, as we usually wouldn’t go on a weekend with nasty weather, but on longer backpacking trips, you get what you get as far as weather, so it would really be an issue to me then.

I forgot to talk about the Zpacks Duplex above. I actually ran into a backpacker on a trip two weeks ago that had a Duplex and it was a really nice looking shelter. I think it would do better in the wind with a few more guylines (we were in a hardwood forest with no wind so it was a non issue – just thinking about above tree line use). I know some people on Trek Like use them in Scotland. I have read of a failure where the whole corner ripped off, but if I remember correctly, the user said it was in 65mph winds – which is far beyond what the tent was designed for.

I had a friend who had a Golite Hex 3 (predecessor to the SL3) and he said he used it in all kinds of nasty weather in the Northeast. He used it in the winter in the Southeast when we hiked together and though I don’t think we ever used it in high winds, it did see a foot of snow a time or two. The hex shape was a little harder to get right than a rectangular mid, but eh silnylon fabric was pretty forgiving. He didn’t have an inner, but I think you would have to put the inner up first, which would be an issue to me. I do think that the hexagonal shape would shed wind quite well.

After thinking about it I am not sure if the Tarptent Scarp 2 might not be my top recommendation, at least to do more research on, as I haven’t paid much attention to it in the past. I know the Hilleburg Atko is well known for it’s wind worthiness – and in fact I have seen a video of it in 80mph winds – where the user had a wind meter shown in the video. I wasn’t pretty, but I was impressed for such a light tent. I say that to say that many folks on Trek Lite seem to think the Scarp 1 is a stronger tent in the wind than the Atko due to the Pitch-Loc corners, and though the Scarp 2 is bigger, it has the same design so it should fair pretty well too. The Scarp 2 is 1.7kg and you could even add the crossing poles and still be around 2.1kg so while it isn’t light, it is lighter than what you have now, and I think it would hold up to the winds you might expect.

[Brad Rogers]

Looking at your original criteria the Scarp 2 meets your minimum floor width (barely) at 132cm, but it may not meet your height requirement or ability to hang wet clothes. Plus it is a little over your desired weight. Shelters are all about trade-offs and while I feel like I personally have found the sweet spot for a Solo shelter, I have struggled finding that sweet spot for a two person shelter.

By the way – I am so jealous that your girlfriend will do those kinds of trips with you. My wife will backpack with me some, but doesn’t want to do anything that extreme. I did an 11 day trip above the Arctic circle in 2015 and a 14 day trip in Alaska last year and she wasn’t interested in either at all – of course with kids it would have been really hard for both of us to go anyways. I am just thankful that she puts up with me doing trips by myself.

I would love to see some trip reports or photo albums so link them on BPL if you get the chance!

[Viktor S]

@mocs123 Maybe I have misunderstood, but from what I’ve seen with the Ultamid you can set up the fly and then the inner (by shortening the poles). I have assumed any custom option would be able to do the same.

The following sketchup shots are modelled on an Ultamid 4 fly and a 2m (just under 6 feet 7″) (4/5) long inner. It would have 96cm (3ft) top vestibule height and the vestibule would be 73cm long (2ft4″). This should mean you would be able to open the door at least half way without getting rain in the inner. It should result in pretty much the exact same setup as the link I posted earlier in the thread to the custom pyranet 3 in the SL5.

View post on imgur.com

The Scarp 2 seems stable and nice but for all other purposes I like the SS2. My confidence in it increased quite a bit after seeing some of the Sarek shots of it in their gallery.

Regarding trip reports, I haven’t had the time to write one yet. I can PM you a link to an unfiltered photo album and a route :) We actually got into hiking together 2 summers ago and jumped in the deep end straight away without any prior knowledge. It was the best thing we’ve ever done and now it is a passion we get to share together. I think we’ve logged close to 70 nights outdoors together since then, 3 longer hikes and the rest spread out over weekends.

[Iago Vazquez]

@Viktor, sorry I have zero experience with a partial inner. I just thought of suggesting based on your description and previous pictures I have seen on the web. When you go custom, you have the freedom to come up with your own solutions based on your needs rather than be limited by what is available.

Even with a full inner, it seems like it would be easy to unclip a corner to cook and store gear, wouldn’t it?

Personally I am new to mids. Starting to play with them. At the moment I am putting together a setup based on an Oware 10’x10′ square mid with floorless bugnet plus a polycro sheet. It was supposed to be our family shelter for a summer outdoors adventure, but the trip is postponed to 2019, so I stopped working on it.

Finally, I also have a Seek Outside BT-2 with net doors. Happy with it, but I find it a bit tight for two in winter. Summer just alright. I like that I can seal the floor. Dave Chenault has a great review on the Silvertip, which is supposed to be more livable and is also very storm worthy. It can be purchased with the net doors or an inner. Or perhaps the Cimarron for more space. Throwing them as an option in case you haven’t considered it.

[Cherian Thomas]

There is no tent that meets all your criteria. You need to compromise somewhere :)

I have an SS2. While it is a great shelter in many ways, I wouldn’t want to have to set it up in strong winds. Even less so if the soil is rocky or soft. Once up, it can be made perfectly drum-tight and sheds wind remarkably well. But I feel it’s storm-worthiness is compromised by poor stake-holding conditions much more so than other pyramid designs, mostly due to the fact that 4 of the six stakeout points pull rather vertically on their stakes. I always look for big rocks to place over my stakes.

I would go with a pyramid/tipi for an ultralight option given your needs – you can set that up in strong winds fairly easily. But I’d be more inclined to go with a Scandinavian tunnel minus the extended vestibule to save some weight. They are perfect for the conditions you list, and the extra ¬300g per person over your target weight isn’t really worth worrying about. The new Fjallraven Abisko Lite 2 or 3 seems good if you’re not too tall, and you can get some views by rolling up the front and rear in benign conditions. The longer pole is also 9.6mm, so a bit stronger than the usual 2 x 9mm poles. That one has sold out absolutely everywhere, and can’t be had until mid-April. The trusty Hilleberg Nallo would work as well, with views out the front.

[Franco Darioli]

“But I feel it’s storm-worthiness is compromised by poor stake-holding conditions much more so than other pyramid designs, mostly due to the fact that 4 of the six stakeout points pull rather vertically on their stakes. I always look for big rocks to place over my stakes”.

I wouldn’t use the SS2 in open areas without the apex guylines in place.

Those to me are much more important to the integrity of the shelter than all the others except the two supported corners.

 

[Eric Blumensaadt]

Viktor,

While my “winterized” Scarp 2 would withstand the harsh conditions your describe in northern Norway and Sweden it IS a bit heavier than what you want. As for its vestibules, they are entirely adequate for cooking and storage of packs, boots, etc. with one vestibule per person. But if you are looking for a large tunnel tent or dome tent style winter vestibule then, yes, you need to look at those designs.

For your conditions I think you will be best served by a Hilleberg or other Scandinavian made 4 season tent.

[JeroenB]

Viktor, I hike in Norway in similar conditions (Lyngen Alps, Saltfjellet, Dovrefjell etc.). When solo, I always rely on my Trailstar (silnylon, in Cuben it’s difficult to see up). It’s more storm worthy than the Hillleberg Akto I had prior to the Trailstar. I have an Oookworks inner with it, he makes a double inner as well but then you have no vestibule space.

For 2 people I have a HMG Ultamid4. I haven’t used it in high winds yet and frankly I hope I never have to – I know people say it’s very wind worthy but it’s such a *huge* surface to catch the wind, I don’t trust it completely :). I bought mine with just the bug netting, not the full inner. From Oookworks I bought a double bath tub, like this I’m much more flexible. I set the pole a little off centre so we have ample space on both sides. Never had any water in the bath tub.

Forget the Zpacks Triplex, I haven’t used it myself but it’s way too flimsy! And whatever you do, don’t buy a tent that needs 2 trekking poles – they’re almost impossible to set up in stormy weather.

[Joachim R]

Hi Viktor,

Checkout the tent options from Warmlite. https://www.warmlite.com/product-category/tents/

They are comfy big for two persons with winter gear, highly wind proof and lighter than the Hilleberg’s 4 season options.

Cheers
Jo

 

[Scott B]

It might be worth an email to Zpacks to see if they’d build a Triplex in 1.0 Cuben.

that would seem to check all your boxes, with an extra safety factor of strength- if only for psychological comfort (which is important)

[Author]

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