Hitting a weight wall

It really depends on the pack.

22lbs in my UL pack is far less comfortable than 22lbs in my McHale.

***Edited to fix typo***

Is that a typo?  I’d expect that a 22lb load is way worse than a 2lb load, even if the packs differ by ~4+Lb ;)

To try to explain better what I’m seeing – I did 8.5mi ( a personal daily best) Saturday with a Patagonia Ascensionist 45 @21lb and felt pretty darn good at the end of it.

I just did 3 miles @27.5Lb tonight with a pack that hauls weight far better (Exped Thunder 50) and my knees are barkin’ and I was pretty tired after just the 3mi.

Was the terrain and you caloric intake different on each example?

Thanks for the reply K T,

They were both about the same – simple rolling meanders typical of the outer Appalachian ripples found in Western PA.

They were just handy examples of a general thing I’ve noticed as I’ve experimented with carrying more weight than ever before (in advance prep for carrying water in the desert :/ )

Are you new to this? To me it sounds like you are not in backpacking shape.

Three factors:
1. Some packs carry a LOT better than others.
2. After getting into backpacking shape you will carry a LOT better.\
3. Mental. If you are used to 40lb packs a 30lb pack seems like a feather. But if you are used to a 20lb pack a 30lb pack seems like solid lead!

Advice: You need to get yourself into both mental and physical backpacking shape. And select the right pack for the load.

billy

Billy,

Yep I agree with the logic.

1.  I’ve noticed.  I’ve had the GG Gorilla (hated the straps but carried loads pretty well), all 3 Patagonia Ascensionists (25L, 35L, 45L) – they carried not well at all, and the Exped Thunder 50 which is supposed to carry heavy loads absolutely great due to the suspension.
2. Working on it!  Seeing solid gains but I’ve always had shoulder and knee issues to overcome.  Generally I’m in pretty decent shape (good BMI, frequent day hiker / kayaker), but the office has been killing me slowly.
3. That’s probably right but I think there is a point where my knees just refuse to carry any more weight.  Crappy as they are, they seem to be the weak link where going over a certain weight just reduces my hiking ability right away.

I agree it’s probably just something you need to build to.  When exercising with weights over many reps a 5 lbs. difference really adds up.  I believe the same holds true for backpack weight.  I’d love to see some backpacking specific advice on how to increase carrying tolerance.

“…advice on how to increase carrying tolerance.’

It’s like any other physically strenuous activity… start small and work up. Gradually more weight and more distance. But you need to do it regularly to build up.. 3x per week if you really want to train and build up… every other day is a good way… workout day and then rest day… hard to do it as a weekender…

But if Kodiak has bad knees there may be a limit to what can be achieved. too much weight and pounding on some knee problems and they will get worse; not better. In that case, just have fun on shorter hikes and be thankful you can get out at all. And, yes, Kodiak… the office/sitting is very bad for the body…

Billy

For you city folk, it is possible to train/build up by carrying a pack on a treadmill… though your legs and knees will not ready for the down hill trail pounding of a trail…

billy

Kodiak… do you use trekking poles? They can be helpful for knees. Get poles with a rounded or soft handle top that feels comfortable when the top is in the palm of your hand… when you go down large steps in the trail just reach the pole in front of you and down and ‘palm’ the top of the pole handle and ease the weight onto your knees rather than pounding down the trail…

billy

To try to explain better what I’m seeing – I did 8.5mi ( a personal daily best) Saturday with a Patagonia Ascensionist 45 @21lb and felt pretty darn good at the end of it.

I just did 3 miles @27.5Lb tonight with a pack that hauls weight far better (Exped Thunder 50) and my knees are barkin’ and I was pretty tired after just the 3mi.

How well hydrated were you on both of these trips?  I usually get a pretty steep increase in joint soreness and stiffness while backpacking or exercising when I’m not properly hydrated.

also flights of stairs are good for city training… up AND down

Biggest thing is getting into hiking shape.

Yes, it was a typo.

I agree with what others say, getting in shape helps a lot.

Yup, getting in shape is a spring chore for me. It always takes about a month before I am really ready for 15mi a day.

I could never use the Gorilla for loads over 20-25 pounds. It became real painful on my shoulders. By the same token I can use a Murmur easily at 23pounds. Or an old MiniPosa at 30pounds (often used for canoeing.)

Hey Kodiak – check out my blog post about getting your knees in shape for hiking:

BackpackerPT

Really working on those stabilizing muscles will help – and it helps even for folks who DO have good hills to train on.  These are some of the best exercises you can do to prevent or fix the vast majority of knee problems you can have while hiking.

“I’m just now starting to put the miles on but I’m wondering if this is a number that will continually be able to be pushed outward or if everyone has a wall where they just become really unproductive at weights beyond that number.”

I don’t think there’s a hard ceiling, but I do think the rate of gain gets less as you go higher.  For me five years ago, 30 pounds was a heavy load.  In the years since that kind of load has become routine, thanks to things like skiing, packrafting, and carrying gear for others.  While hunting I’ve done a number of packouts in the 60-90 pound range, which helps put things in perspective.  These days I can do 30 mile days with a 35 pound pack only marginally slower than with a 20 pound pack, which I wouldn’t have thought possible five years ago.

The best training for hiking with a heavy load is hiking with a heavy load.  Start slow and be patient with your body.  Have a multi-year plan.  Make it a routine thing.  Add an extra ten pounds of water on dayhikes.  Keep this extra weight on board for both up and downhills to build holistic strength.  Even when carrrying a 90 pound load down a 3000 foot descent my knees never hurt (my quads and the soles of my feet are another story..)  To me knee pain that gets worse with a heavy load is evidence of inadequate strength leading to poor hiking technique.  Hiking plenty will get you that strength, but doing yoga or other exercises to build core strength is a good shortcut to having the strength and technique necessary to not thrash your knees while carrying a big pack.

Trekking Poles: These have made a huge difference in my knees when going downhill.

PT & Training: I’ve seen a Sports PT for a couple issues with my knees/IT over the last few years. Each time we focused on strengthening the hips/ankles. The problem for me was that other parts of my anatomy were not contributing enough which put too much strain on my knees. In both instances (one while playing capoeira a few years ago and more recently from hiking) I was able to get a ton of relief within just a few weeks of work.

+1 on the trekking poles and training for knees and hips. Two other things that have helped my knees, hips and ankles are reduced sugar consumption (including highly processed food) and taking daily antioxidants (Astaxanthan and Meriva Curcumin). Dozens of times I’ve experienced the benefits of both these long-term measures after slipping on my diet and supplement regimen, then adding them back in. On a short-term level, I’ve found that four Meriva Curcumin capsules work about as well for me on joint pain as 400mg (two tablets) of Ibuprofen or more. Of course, YMMV, as with any diet or supplement change.

Every one of these responses are great.  This is why I still love BPL.  Thanks everyone – I’m working out a good plan based on all of this.

Around this time of year I start to train. I fill up a backpack with rice or potatoes, really what ever my wife will let me take that’s heavy and I take my dog to the park. This usually ends up as more weight than my backpacking kit so when I load up with my 15lb summer setup I am ready to go.  Also running. I do 2-3 miles 2 times a week and 5-8 either Saturday or Sunday.  It’s really helps get into shape. I have friends that do satirs and such but running seems to work well for me.  I live on upset NY so I am familiar with central Pennsylvania and its got some steep sections. I’ve done the Black Forest trail and all you do is go up and down on rocky, slippery terrain so dont forget what your dealing with.

I fill up a backpack with rice or potatoes, really what ever my wife will let me take that’s heavy and I take my dog to the park.

+1

I use a 20Liter day pack and “plates” from a dumbell set.  It’s not as conspicuous as my Ohm. Start low and work up over at least 4 weeks.