Ecopak EPL/EPX Ultraweave
Sep 25, 2021 at 12:43 pm #3728138
I got a Ultra 200 bag in black – was used for 350 miles is what I was told. The fabric doesn’t look that great after just 350 miles – sure the guy may have not taken great care of it, but, my HMG in black looks like new with that kind of mileage. Of course, my MLD prophet in 210d gridstop nylon looks new as well after similar use. I don’t know – turned off actually by how this fabric ages.Sep 25, 2021 at 12:51 pm #3728141
forgot to add that my XPAC VX21/X33 combo looks like the day I got it after more than 400 miles…..of course heavier than Ultra 200.Sep 25, 2021 at 5:00 pm #3728150Roger CaffinBPL Member
@rcaffinLocale: Wollemi & Kosciusko NPs, Europe
Such delamination will be a general failure of the adhesive used in constructing the fabric. When it starts to fail in one place, the rest may follow soon after. If this happens quickly (less than a few years), I would say the fabric is not fit for the purpose. Sad.
CheersSep 25, 2021 at 7:13 pm #3728151StumphgesBPL Member
The issues here are 1) UHMWPE is super slippery and hard to glue things to, and 2) bias instability of the slippery woven fabric ends up putting more strain on the glue/waterproofing film, right?
I just listened to BPL podcast#2, about DCF, and I think it was the DSM rep who mentioned a DCF variant with woven Dyneema as the outer layer (rather than the typical woven polyester outer layer used on the DCF used for packs for many years). This would seem to be ideal, as the non-woven Dyneema strands in the center of the composite could be oriented on the “bias” of the outer woven fabric, stabilizing the composite in those directions (45 and 135 degrees), thus reducing strain on the glue and waterproofing film (TPU or whatever). That podcast was from 2018, I believe. I wonder why DSM has not gone big with that DCF variant.
BTW, I would think Ultra 100 would be where it’s at. The 200d product has so much better abrasian resistance than competing products, that 100d would still be tougher than anything comparable, and even lighter.Sep 27, 2021 at 7:58 am #3728219Dan DurstonBPL Member
@dandydanLocale: Canadian Rockies
@Murali: What do you mean by it doesn’t “look great”. Do you mean there is damage? Or is just looks used. Woven UHMWPE fabrics do get a bit of a wrinkled look faster than some others so it may look old sooner, but the actual durability in terms of tear strength and abrasion should be far ahead of your HMG and MLD bags.Sep 27, 2021 at 9:03 am #3728223
Yeah – it has that shriveled look that looks almost like the 2.92 osy DCF with folds developing where your back touches the bag/roll top. Of course this is a frameless – so, perhaps more amplified compared to a framed bag which is stretched by the frame. Somehow like the look of the 5 osy DCF or X21/X33 or 210d nylon bags.
I think people have used MLD’s 210d bags for 5000 to 8000 miles. Same with 5 osy DCF. Sure, the Ultra 200 may last longer – but, I usually change bags much more often that 2000 miles or lesser:-) Which is probably true of most people as everyone is searching for that elusive “perfect” pack.
Of course, this material sounds too good to be true – lightweight, extremely durable, waterproof – time will tell.Sep 29, 2021 at 3:48 pm #3728420Michael SchlesselmannBPL Member
@mschlessLocale: Southern Los Padres National Forest
@Murali: Do you have pictures of what the fabric looks like?Sep 29, 2021 at 7:06 pm #3728433
I have couple of images I will share here which I took to show the defects in the bag that was sold to me. I returned the bag to the owner as he didn’t tell me about the 4 holes on front pocket, bottom pocket, 200d fabric and a cut on the webbing connecting the shoulder strap to bottom of pack. I think the guy probably abused the bag. Anyways, take what I say with a grain of salt.
You will have to zoom into the black 200d pictures – the first 2 to see the wrinkles etc. The guy said that he has 350 miles on it. Who knows! If it is really 350, I guess I was surprised by how bad it looked. The fabric feels thinner than 2.92 osy I think. The roll top had lot more wrinkles/folds – even the top edge of the roll top was folded in some places like a piece of paper. I mean its not a big deal….mostly aesthetics I suppose. But, I think I like the XPAC and the 5 osy DCF or the 210d gridstop much better.
I also included pictures of my MLD Prophet in DCF (3.5 osy) – has 535 miles (has some wrinkles/folds). MLD Prophet in Wasabi green (210d) – 300 miles including 175 on SHR. OrangeBrown VX21/X33 camo which I used on most of CT – has close to 420 miles. All are frameless.Oct 1, 2021 at 6:38 pm #3728628HkNewmanBPL Member
@hknewmanLocale: Western US
A little more on this from long distance hike website “the Trek” if you weren’t doing anything Friday night:.Oct 1, 2021 at 8:18 pm #3728630
Nice article….especially the part about using recycled materials.
Interesting that Atom packs is using mostly EPX200 instead of Ultra – at least on their website – even custom options seem to have only EPX200 in the few that I tried. Even Waymark seems to be using EPX200.
Amazing that majority of the industry is moving to these fabrics so quickly.
I do have a Ultra400 bag on order from SWD:-) hopefully this fabric is a little thicker than the Ultra 200.Oct 3, 2021 at 11:29 am #3728726baja bobBPL Member
When I get a chance I will get some photos of mine together. It’s seen far more abuse than Murali C’s pack. Mine is 400 Ultra.
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