dual water treatment with aquamira first, then a filter

[Buck Nelson]

NOLS has found the number one issue with students getting “sick” and picking up unwanted critters while in the backcountry, and after their adventures,  were associated with…….Bathroom Hygiene:  Hand washing

Do you have a citation for this? I hear similar claims but have yet to see a study that bears this out. Somebody at NOLS may have SAID it, but I need to see data. :)

What NOLS HAS found is that water treatment, hand washing, and dish washing together have made a big difference, what relative difference each makes is a different issue.

For the original question, I think the conventional wisdom is to filter first, then treat.

[AK Granola]

I just tried – at home – prefiltering tap water with pantyhose, and cannot for the life of me figure out how this could possibly work. I just bought the cheapest hose I could find (first purchase of those nasty things in 25 years!) and stretched it over the nalgene and tried to pour water through it. The water pooled up and not a single drop went through. I waited several minutes. Nothing. Then I thought maybe the toe area is too reinforced, so I tried using the calf part of it. Same deal – those suckers are completely water proof. They’re just ordinary everyday stockings. They are impervious to water.

Normally I don’t prefilter, or I use the prefilter that came with my Steripen. But this time I’ll be filtering from tundra puddles, so scoop and pour through. I used to just not worry about the wigglies, but it’s be nice to exclude them just so I’ll be inclined to drink more water. I tried an old bandana here at home and that works great. Maybe good enough for a prefilter? I’ll zap with Steripen afterward and bring some Crystal Light in case of weird mossy flavors.

Any other ideas from those of you filtering from minuscule tundra ponds?

[Jerry Adams]

I always store untreated water.  Water that I boil I don’t treat.

The other day I was pouring water into the pot to boil and I noticed a wiggly.  I just made sure he didn’t go into the pot, then went back to the stream and let him back into the stream (catch and release).

[Howard Clapsaddle]

Karen, I have no experience with tundra pools but once had an aquarium and a little net. It was like a tea strainer and could be used, among other things, for dipping and removing crud from the surface of the water.

Here’s a wild idea I just had: how ’bout tying a yard or so of string to your water bottle, then swing it around and around, casting the wigglies to the bottom of the bottle? Then you could decant the clear water into another bottle.

[MJ H]

What NOLS HAS found is that water treatment, hand washing, and dish washing together have made a big difference, what relative difference each makes is a different issue.

I don’t know if this paper is what NOLS is citing or not, but it says the same thing. It looks like washing your hands after you urinate is more important than I have been considering it.

[Ken Thompson]

I use a piece of noseeum as a pre filter on occasion.

[Bruce Tolley]

Cotton bandanas work. Sometimes you need to fold to get several layers of cloth if you are trying to remove algae, for example. Dual use! Coffee filters work, the gold kind like MSR sells. Dual use. The cheap plastic filters sold for coleman fuel also work.

[John S.]

Another prefilter. https://www.amazon.com/Camco-51050-Fuel-Funnel-Screen/dp/B00C7I4XXS

[ben .]

once it’s saturated with water, this kind of thing works well: https://www.amazon.com/10-Pack-Pool-Skimmer-Socks-Skimmers/dp/B01GW1JXOY

[bradmacmt]

I’m skeptical of anecdotal evidence of four cases of giardia infection.

My own view is that symptoms could easily have been caused by something other than giardia, including a stomach bug from poor hygiene.

 

[Buck Nelson]

I’m skeptical of anecdotal evidence of four cases of giardia infection.

My own view is that symptoms could easily have been caused by something other than giardia, including a stomach bug from poor hygiene.

Here’s what he said:

the last two times i’ve noticed something funny within a week, and gone to the specialist. over the years he has prescribed a couple different antibiotics

The OP was diagnosed by a specialist at least two of those times. Beyond that, we know these things:

The CDC estimates there are over a million giardiasis cases a year in the United States.

The CDC says those among the greatest risk of contracting giardiasis are those who drink untreated water from lakes, rivers, springs, ponds, streams.

All, or nearly all, backcountry giardiasis outbreaks have been traced to water.

We aren’t catching giardiasis from ourselves.

Handwashing is still important

[William N]

While hiking in Dorset England early April this year, I filtered and treated water for three days. I got diarrhea about 36 hours after I last drank my treated water.  My water sources were all fast running, clear water. The first was a narrow creek more like a ditch, second day was right next to, but upstream, of a road ford (right through the water), and the third (and fatal?) water collection was from a fast running stream down stream from sheep pastures and a small village. Each time I collected water in a collapsible bucket dedicated for that purpose, I pumped out of it with an MSR Sweetwater filter, two years old, used two years ago. Cleaned out, dried out as instructed, stored in the freezer, into another collapsible (very different so no mix up) where I treated it with Aqua Mira (chlorine dioxide), then left it to sit for about double the recommended time. I’ve had salmonella food poisoning before, this was not as bad, but I spent a lot of time on the can. What I’m curious to know more about.

1. Is there a collection of scientifically considered water filter/treatment fails? (Where everything seemed to go as it should but…. and what happened?)

2. What does it take to make you sick? When we smell poo, those are particles of poo. We don’t get sick because we smell it. We often have less than clean hands.

3. How likely are we to transfer enough pathogen with our hands, a small inadvertent splash? (Another way of asking this question is: What are those minor things that have big consequences?)

4. Clearly we swim in water we wouldn’t drink but we usually don’t get sick.

5. My MSR Sweetwater filter when I bought a couple of years ago was marketed and reviewed as 99.5%, the best thing ever… This year when I was getting ready to go on my trip I looked into water filters a bit and saw a whole new crop same hype. It’s like the perfect filtration system finally! has been invented this year, and the next this year. I don’t want to beef on MSR, they make good stuff, but until I have a good idea what went wrong– I’m very suspicious of all of it.

6. Aqua Mira seems like good chemistry, but I was annoyed by the tiny amounts needed to be mixed for 5-6 liters of water and no good way to do this. (I assume using slightly more than listed, and getting the A:B mix off by 30% shouldn’t be a problem.)  If I only had the Aqua Mira or the pump, based on instructions for both I could’ve used either and the water would’ve been safe.

7. I think we’ve all had days when we catch a whiff of our water bottle and it stinks, but it’s hot, it’s our only water, we drink it anyway….I’ve never ever had a problem from that.

8. Diagnosis: how do we know what’s actually wrong and the time frame we swallowed the pathogens? I ate a large meal of meat the night before it really hit me, but I don’t think this was the problem. I’ve always figured, based on two bouts with restaurant food poisoning that it’s about 8 hours, then whammo, cramps, horrors.

This is primarily a data download. I’d like to know more, I’m betting a lot of us do; but I also think just chatting about it won’t accomplish much.  thanks for reading.

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