Difficult to shop for ultralight gear

The only option here is to buy gear, try it, and return it if you don’t like it. All of that shipping gets expensive but it’s the price you pay for having a selection of gear many times greater than what a store can stock.

Agreed.  I’ve probably tried on at least 15 backpacks over the years.  Like many, I started out trying packs at REI but eventually ponied up the cash and ordered about 5-10 packs from online cottage manufacturers.  There is no way around this.  I have heard of people even traveling to places like Florida to get fitted in person by ZPacks.  If you are serious about going UL, you will eventually end up buying and returning/selling stuff until you hone your kit

Don’t forget how much time and money you can spend driving around looking at stuff. Welcome.

If you can find a shop that sells to thru hikers you can touch and feel and try on gear.  I know one shop called Mount Laguna Sports and Outfitters, near San Diego on the PCT.  They stock ULA, HMG, lots of Montbell and others.  Dave’s great, but don’t look for him there later in the summer.  He heads out hiking himself once the PCT pack passes through.  There should be more shops like this.  If anyone knows of one, let us all know!

I also got to try on packs at the PCT day zero event two years ago.  That was the last year they held it.  I know there are other trail day events so depending on your location you could search those out.

Eventually you get used to buying sight unseen from vendors or used on the forums and returning our selling what you don’t like.  There are so many videos and reviews and most will answer direct questions given a few days to respond.

I used to say I had to see anything I bought over $100, usually twice before pulling the trigger.  3x I’d it was over $1000.  I still do that for most things, but I’ve bought great gear now online and haven’t looked back.

Another option is to post here on BPL to see if anybody in your area has the gear you’re considering buying. You’ll likely find someone within a few hours drive willing to let you visit them and try on their pack and look at their tarp. Of course this may be easier or harder depending on where you live.

In the end, there’s no substitute for lots of research, much of it on this forum because it’s so full of valuable information. First consider what you want in a pack or tarp (part of the country, seasons of use, preferences, hiking style, load carrying preferences, volume and weight of your gear, etc). Then research packs or tarps that many folks feel have those characteristics. Next make a short list of specific products and post on BPL with questions you may have comparing them. Using this method combined with lots of time and patience, I’ve been happy with nearly all of my sight-unseen UL purchases.

Be aware that products change frequently year to year, so the MLD Burn of 2014 or 2012 you read about in the forums may be different than the 2017 model in some ways. Also, as you become more experienced, comfortable and skilled in UL and your gear changes, your preferences will likely change also (i.e. going from a LW tart tent with inner net to a shaped tarp only, or going from a 2.5 lb framed pack to a 13 oz frameless.

well the two items that MUST fit perfectly are shoes and packs …

the shoes are covered … retailers will stock em and online retailers often have free return shipping

packs … well if you want a “UL brand” pack youll need to pay for return shipping if it doesnt fit … however theres quite a few mainstream packs that are used and can be considered fairly light, even UL, which you can easily try on or get free return shipping on … you just dont hear about em as much on BPL

shelters … again plenty of shelters that can be considered quite light from mainstream manufacturers that you can return with free shipping … and honestly as long as the shelter fits you alot of the shelter stuff is preference and nitpicking

clothing and sleeping bags…. again mainstream companies make alot of light gear that generally has a better warranty anyways, with free return shipping

in the end its only if you want “UL brands” that this becomes an issue …

with mainstream brands these days you can easily be UL and have everything be returnable with free shipping

;)

Welcome! The folks on this site have been great at helping me to lighten my load and refine my gear list. It’s really tough for me to know what gear will work out until I put it to the test. I think that’s why the gear swap forum is so popular. Like many others, I’ve researched items, read the reviews, and purchased the pack, tent, or quilt thinking it was the “one”. Then, after using the item for several trips, decided it just didn’t work for me or that it worked best for a specific type of trip or weather condition. I’ve bought and sold several tents and packs before settling on the ones that work best for me. It is not the most economical way to put a kit together but it really helped me understand the differences in design and the advantages/disadvantages of a particular piece of gear.

Attending a BPL GGG is probably the best way to see/touch/try on a wide range of items.  If you can make it to one, chances are that somebody will have the items you are interested in.  Asking ahead of time increases the chances (since many have a choice of which pack/shelter/etc they bring).

As people said, try then return.

Sucks to tie up the credit card but I know ULA, Katabatic and Zpacks are all totally ok with you trying it on in your home, weighting it and returning if it doesn’t work for you. I’m sure the other companies are ok with it too, I just haven’t specifically asked them.

I personally find that most of the high end gear is so well thought out that it all fits me pretty well and has similar feature sets. The nuances only show up when you get a week or so on them. For instance, one of my packs was super comfortable but though it fits just like the others, it makes me sweat like crazy and holds stink like nothing I’ve ever used. Not really something you’d realize until getting some miles on it.

I agree with Eric, the pack is probably the hardest to pick online, especially with great reviews of people that have switched from mainstream brands to cottage vendors (ULA, Zpacks, MLD, HMG…the list goes on).  Even if a reviewer switched from ULA to HMG and loved or hated the new pack – your experience may differ greatly.  For sure all these vendors will spend time on the phone or replying to email about options or which pack might work better for you.

I’d also add, that while you can read a lot, you really need to try a pack before you know if it will work for you.  HMG said I could return my pack unused – and I understand why that is, but unless it fit horribly or I didn’t like something in particular on inspection, I’ll have to take it on a few trails before I know if it works for me.  There’s just no getting around the trial-n-error, even if you go with mainstream brands.  REI will let you return within the year, so if you are not sure – try their stuff first.

BPL member Nick Gatel put this list together

. You Can Get An Ultralight Backpacking Kit At REI! .

Hello and welcome. My suggestion, as someone who just got into UL in the past few years, is read a LOT before you buy anything. This website has tons of info on pretty much all the good UL gear. And it has Gearswap, which can save you a ton of money if you are patient. I got both my packs used and both my sleeping bags used. I could easily have gotten my tent used as well, and should have. The only thing I chose not to buy used on purpose was my air mattress because I wanted the mfr warranty. The beauty of buying used on Gearswap or similar sites is that you can generally sell what doesn’t work for you at the same price you bought it for and you’re not out much of anything but your time.

First, where are you geographically?

Given that everyone says it takes time to really, really know – you could also buy these second hand, then resell if it’s not working for you.

I look a variables and observations from reading this site over time:

hmm, ULA seems to work for a whole lot of people, odds are good I will be one of them. and I was.

Other ULA Ohm lovers seem to like their Element Horizons packs even more. Maybe that’s one for me for higher-volume (w/kids) trips?

A Seek Outside Divide is also on my wish list, but oh no, a guy suggests they might not fit women well. OK there’s a woman who loves hers, all hope is not lost! (and I’m lucky enough to have a retailer local for that)

The one time I tried a pack with any arc to it I hated it! So much for airflow, no Zpacks Arc for me, though many love theirs.

Then there are those Katabatic enthusiasts! Maybe I need to stop thinking so much about gear….

Those two you’re looking at are frameless. Do you have any experiences with frameless packs? (they are not for me).

I would favor MLD over GG.

One thing that I’ve also done is (creepily) message people who have the product I’m wanting info about. For example, if someone’s posting a pack for sale, or even if it’s sold, I’ll pick their brains. Or if someone’s mentioned in the forum somewhere “oh yeah, my wife and I have used the Duomid,” etc., I’ll message them and ask details about it. Just another strategy.

I’ve done two meetups so far–one via BPL and another via MeetUp–to look at gear. Also a possibility.

This is exactly why I MYOG.  If that is not your thing, I suggest checking out Zimmerbuilt.  If that is still not your thing, and you don’t want to deal with the buy it, try it, return it schema that some are suggesting then keep in mind that gear from the cottage industry tends to retain its value even after it has been used; within reason, of course.

I’ll take the contrarian view. If you spend enough time backpacking you should be able to determine what features and benefits you are looking for, assuming a piece of gear you currently have doesn’t meet your criteria. Once you know what you need, you should be able to research products and find what fits your criteria. I have never bought a piece of gear to figure out if it will work or fit, and I have never sent something back. Not to say I have never bought a piece of gear that didn’t work out; but that is really the exception.

I bought my last backpack 6 years ago and last my last quilt 5 years ago. 6 years ago I bought a Hexamid to replace the Wild Oasis purchased in 2008 because it was less than 1/2 the weight with similar coverage. 4 years ago I bought a Trailstar for those trips in really bad weather. 2 years ago I replaced my Hexamid with a Deschutes CF because I wanted a larger shelter and the design was similar to the Wild Oasis and Hexamid, which I like. I still use my 2010 NeoAir and my 2013 NeoAir Xtherm for cold weather. I also bought a NeoAir Xlite in 2013 for those trips where I really want to go fast and light. Other than upgrading my Caldera Cone system last year (Caldera Cones have been my go to stoves for about 10 years), my last stove purchase was 5 years ago — a WindPro 2 for snow trips that replaced a 2 year old WindPro 1 that was a hassle to invert the canister. My last clothing purchase was in 2012 when I bought 2 pairs of Patagonia Baggies to replace my worn out ones. I haven’t bought shoes in 5 years — I bought several pairs of Mizuno Wave Universe 4 shoes in 2012 and still have 2 unused pairs left.

Use lwhiker.com to set some alerts if looking to buy used stuff.

BPL Gear Swap is one of the monitored forums.

“If you spend enough time backpacking you should be able to determine what features and benefits you are looking for, assuming a piece of gear you currently have doesn’t meet your criteria.”

I agree with Nick, but many or perhaps most people turn to this forum because they do not have much experience, or are completely new to a UL approach. For sure, the “difficult” part of buying your gear is not holding it in your hands at REI, it is taking it out and using it, and that takes time. You learn over time that there is no one perfect kit, and as you gain experience you may find yourself taking different items on different trips- long vs short, alpine vs desert, dry vs wet. My son has eight surfboards, same idea. It helps if you are an engineer or are otherwise OCD! So do the research, take your best shot, and then learn to enjoy the process of defining/refining what works for you.

folks …

it doesnt matter how much “research” you do …

if the pack doesnt fit … it just doesnt fit

you can have 2 BPLers with roughly the same weight and body measurements … and a pack might fit one perfectly and not fit the other one at all …

;)