Yosemite beyond Budd Lake….

[Paul Wagner]

We're just back from a wonderful trip to the southern side of the Cathedral Range in Yosemite. Because there are no marked trails through here, this area gets a lot less traffic than trails just a mile or two away. And the scenery is simply spectacular.

We were hoping for an early start, but roadwork on Tioga Highway help us up and we didn't hit the trail until about 11 a.m….

We started up Budd Creek (no trail, although there is a trailhead for this route, and there is a use trail that starts further up the Cathedral Lakes trail) and simply followed the creek for about 3-4 miles up to Budd Lake. Nothing complicated about the navigation, but this route goes pretty much straight up from the beginning, and doesn't stop climbing until just below the lake.

That's Budd Lake above. At the lake we ran into a couple of biologists who were netting the trout out of the lake, as well as a large clan of marmots.

From there the route skirts the very southwest corner of Echo Peaks, and then heads straight down some steep granite until you can traverse over to the base of Matthes Crest. From there down, it's pretty easy hiking all the way to the lake.

And the views going over Echo Peak are fabulous. If the weather had been a little better, we would have been tempted to stay longer up there. But the clouds were gathering, an darkening. We kept moving to get down off the granite and into the canyon.

The photo above gives you an idea of the scenery…and the skies that afternoon.

That evening we met a couple of climbers who were going to climb the crest the next day…so that added to our entertainment. So did the thunderclouds that threatened us. We heard thunder, saw lightning, but never felt a raindrop. Gusty winds, but no rain. And by nightfall the threat of rain had disappeared.

After enjoying a very peaceful night at Echo Lake, we got up the next morning and headed cross-country to Matthes Lake, where the views are equally magnificent. Again, the navigation is pretty straightforward. You skirt the southern end of Matthes Crest, and head up the canyon. You can't miss it. Stunningly beautiful. And despite our worries, we didn't see but a few mosquitoes during the whole trip.

And then, after lunch and a nap, we climbed up a small ridge to the west of Echo Lake to enjoy the views of much of the western half of Yosemite National Park. The route to the top was simple–we just headed up Echo Canyon until the trees would lead us up most of the way to the top. Then it was simply walking the ledges to the summit.

Meanwhile, the climbers were up on the top, and working their way north along the crest in perfect weather. We have a few photos of them in our Picasa report on this hike. That link is here: https://picasaweb.google.com/balzaccom/Yosemite2014BuddLakeAndBeyond#

That evening we enjoyed the blue skies, congratulated the climbers on a job well done, and took a few photos around sunset–like the one below.

Day three had us hiking up Echo Canyon to meet the John Muir Trail at Cathedral Pass. As we did, we took one last look at Matthes Crest, and saw two climbers working their way back and forth on a hire wire act between the two high points of the northern crest.

Insane!

Here's a link to the first of those photos:

https://picasaweb.google.com/balzaccom/Yosemite2014BuddLakeAndBeyond#6038251253350404434

We saw more people in the first ten minutes on the JMT than we had seen in the last 48 hours, and so the hike back to Tuolumne Meadows was a bit of a culture shock. But the drive home, with memories of those fabulous peaks, put us a good mood for many hours.

[Gordon Gray]

nice pics. I would kill to be out there now instead of at work.

[Bob Gross]

It's interesting to explore the area to shortcut between Echo Lake and Matthes Lake. There are several lakes around there which have no trails, so you get somewhat more solitude than fighting the foot traffic nearby on the John Muir Trail.

–B.G.–

[Jacob D]

Nice report and photos, Paul.

Some friends and I did a similar hike a couple of years ago… Budd, Echo, Matthes, Nelson, Reymann. It's beautiful out there!

[M G]

Nice trip report. About a year ago while on a bus. trip to San Jose I did a similar loop heading in via Elizabeth Lake, looping around over the Mathes crest and coming out over Cathedral Pass and Budd Lake. We stayed the night at Echo Lake. Brings back some nice memories.

[Bill Law]

Thanks, Paul, for another great trip report.

I have a question about the route up from Budd Lk. It sounds like you headed southwest to the saddle and then south past the base of upper Echo Pks. Is it possible to head to the saddle closer to Cathedral Pk, west-northwest of Budd Lk, then drop down to Cathedral Pass, then descend the Cathedral Fork from there to Echo Lk (the reverse of your exit route)? Do you think that might be a bit easier terrain?

I don't know what restrictions there might be on the Budd Lk TH wilderness permit (aside from the normal Tuolumne Meadows 4 mile zone). It seems like one could go up Budd Creek and over to Cathedral Lk and legally camp there, but that seems too easy (too easy to avoid the permit quotas and demand for the normal trail to Cathedral Lakes).

Not to get too sidetracked from your trip report, but what are the rules vis-a-vis TH entry point and where you are allowed to hike? With a Budd Creek permit, are we prohibited from setting foot on the JMT beyond the turnoff up Budd Creek? Or are we simply prohibited from camping anywhere except within the Echo Creek drainage (or points beyond?)?

[Bob Gross]

There is no Budd Lake Trailhead, and there is no official Budd Lake Trail, so there is no Budd Lake wilderness permit. There is a permit and quota for the Cathedral Lakes Trail. If you know exactly where to cut off, you can head to Budd Lake from there. There is a visible usage trail most of the way.

You can cut over to the main trail behind Cathedral Lake, but I have done that only on cross country skis and never in the summer season. I always found it better to stay high nearer to Echo Peaks and then descend directly to Echo Lake. It is quicker to take the main trail. However, there will be lots of foot traffic.

Wilderness permits are easily confusing. There is a daily quota for most trailheads that enter into a single area. However, you can move freely from one area to another with or without a trail. The whole idea of the daily quota is just to prevent a hundred backpackers from going to the first good camping spot beyond the four-mile limit such as Cathedral Lakes and spending a cozy evening camped on top of one another.

–B.G.–

[Bill Law]

Thanks, Bob.

I discussed this with the Wilderness Center today. They had screwed up my permit and suggested "Budd Lake" (they may have said "Budd Creek," but same difference) as an alternative (the only one available). I declined at the time, because I was unfamiliar with this route and didn't know if it was a viable option.

I called them back later, after reading Paul's trip report and deciding that this would get us to Nelson Lake as well, and asked for a permit via this TH, and was told that there was one available (for Saturday). I declined it as I needed 3. In hindsight, I should have taken the one; then I would only need 2 walk-ins (this would have cost me another $10, though, and I hate to throw good money after bad).

My impression is that "Budd Lake" is just like "Nelson Lake," permit-wise. Not on any lists, but exists.

Despite numerous online trip reports (and discussions such as this), there is no "official" sign of *either* of these THs (that I can readily find; I do recall maybe seeing one Yosemite page that did mention Nelson Lake). But I know one can get a permit for "Nelson Lake" trailhead, because I have one sitting right in front of me as I type this.

Unfortunately, it is for last Saturday, not this coming one :-(.

Based on the two calls to the Wilderness Center today, my impression is that "Budd Lake/Creek" is like that one. Maybe it is a relatively new option? I do see a mention of it in a trip report from 2011, however, so not that new.

Maybe Paul still has his permit and could tell us what it says (although he may well have had a permit for "Cathedral Lakes" and just took the detour)?

[Bill Law]

Again, apologies for hijacking Paul's thread…

However, you can move freely from one area to another with or without a trail. The whole idea of the daily quota is just to prevent a hundred backpackers from going to the first good camping spot beyond the four-mile limit such as Cathedral Lakes and spending a cozy evening camped on top of one another.

These two sentences seem to be a bit at odds. I can "move freely" from the Budd Lake "area" to Upper Cathedral Lake? But the whole idea is just to prevent me doing exactly that?

Maybe this is all just part of a scheme to bypass complaints from the Wilderness police if they tried to raise the quotas on the popular trails?

[Bob Gross]

"My impression is that "Budd Lake" is just like "Nelson Lake," permit-wise. Not on any lists, but exists."

I haven't checked lately, but I think that Budd Lake falls within the four mile range from the Tioga Road. Therefore, no overnight camping there.

Nelson Lake is much farther out, so it is legal. To get there, go up to Elizabeth Lake and then keep going. No official trail shows up on the map, but the unofficial trail goes over "Nelson Lake Pass" and then down to Nelson Lake.

When you are off-trail there, the maximum group size is eight people.

–B.G.–

[Bill Law]

Sorry, Bob. I was referring to the "Budd Lk" and "Nelson Lk" *trailheads*, not to camping at those lakes. I thought that was clear from the context of my questions.

Which, still, remain unanswered…

Possessing a permit with either of those as "entry trailhead," where can one hike? Where can one sleep?

And for the pedantic, *on the first day/night.*

Nelson is more rhetorical, as it is much more effort to get from that route to other "areas" (to use your term). If folks prefer, these questions can be boiled down to one simple yes/no question: is it legal for one with a permit for the Budd Lk entry trailhead to take the alternate route I suggest via Cathedral Pass?

Assuming it is legal (see question 1), is it *easier* to take the alternate route I suggested from Budd to Echo Lake?

I am guessing that Paul is off on another trip so he won't be able to reply until next week.

[Bob Gross]

According to the map, there is no Budd Lake Trailhead. Part of that is because there is no official Budd Lake Trail. I've been on the unofficial Budd Lake Trail, and it shoots off from the Cathedral Lakes Trail.

http://www.nps.gov/yose/planyourvisit/upload/wildernesstrailheads.pdf

There is no overnight camping allowed within four miles of the Tioga Road around Tuolumne Meadows. There is no requirement to stay on trails.

–B.G.–

[Dave Ayers]

Bill, If you camp at or near Cathedral Lakes the 1st night they will require you to get a Cathedral TH permit. Generally, the 1st nights intended camp spot is the main determinant of which TH permit you need. If you get a "Budd Creek (cross-country only)" entry permit, you will need to go up the Budd Creek drainage and camp somewhere beyond 4 mi from 120, but not in the Cathedral or Elizabeth/Nelson vicinity.

I would think you could camp the 1st night at Echo Lake on a Budd Creek entry doing mostly X-country, but it's probably best to call them and ask. Or just fax in the permit form with a Budd Creek entry and 1st night at Echo Lake and see what happens.

I don't personally know if the route you suggest is easier — but it sure looked that way to me from the JMT side when I was there a few weeks back.

The only place I've seen Budd Creek, Nelson Lake, and Rockslide entries listed is on the Yosemite permit application form (cross-country trailheads group at the bottom of the pull-down list).

[stephan q]

Howdy,
Budd lake is a designated entry point and has a daily quota. 2 years ago when i pulled a Budd lake permit, I was told there is no camping in the Budd lake watershed. Mileage is not considered. I was going over the crest, so it didn't matter to me.
I think the NPS keeps these "trailheads" listed for those of us who can handle "cross-country travel".

stephan

[Paul Wagner]

Exactly right, Stephan.

Our permit gave us access to the whole backcountry, provided we entered the Budd Lake watershed and did not camp in the Cathedral Lakes area.

The ranger specifically noted that on the permit.

if you are comfortable with cross-country, it's a pretty straightforward hike to Echo Lake…and from there the park is your oyster!

[Bob Gross]

http://www.nps.gov/yose/planyourvisit/upload/wildernesstrailheads.pdf

Where does any Budd Lake Trailhead show up here?

Answer: it doesn't

–B.G.–

[Bill Law]

Thanks, David.

If you camp at or near Cathedral Lakes the 1st night they will require you to get a Cathedral TH permit.

Sounds plausible; I'm not sure how they communicate details like that, but I'm sure they mention it when you pick up the permit and that likely makes it enforceable. We would descend to Echo Lk, regardless, so no matter.

I don't personally know if the route you suggest is easier — but it sure looked that way to me from the JMT side when I was there a few weeks back

Perfect. As usual, if we go that route we will adjust to the conditions we encounter.

The only place I've seen Budd Creek, Nelson Lake, and Rockslide entries listed is on the Yosemite permit application form (cross-country trailheads group at the bottom of the pull-down list).

Brilliant! That would be the definitive list, I'm sure. I never filled out the form to mail/fax it in, always called. Even looking at it, it isn't obvious that clicking there shows the list. But what else could it do? One of life's great mysteries solved.

[Bill Law]

Where does Nelson Lake show up there?

Like you said before, Bob: Wilderness permits are easily confusing.

[Bob Gross]

Nelson Lake doesn't show up anywhere, except on the topo map, because there is no longer any official trail that goes there. You can get only as far as Elizabeth Lake on an official trail, and then the trail dissolves. On some years I have gone over Nelson Lake Pass following rock ducks. Then the trail picks up again in the flats.

Wilderness Permits are particularly confusing since the permits are issued by the NPS rangers, yet the permit reservations are made by the Yosemite Conservancy. NPS makes the official maps, but the Conservancy collects its own fees for the reservation system.

If something turns out wrong between the reservation and the permit, then whose fault is it?

Thirty years ago, we would simply show up at a permit station, get the permit, and go.

Incidentally, once the official trails run out, and then once the unofficial trails run out, there are still lakes in the Cathedral Range that are off-trail and uncommonly visited.

–B.G.–

[Dave Ayers]

Bill, Once you've download the permit application form from http://www.nps.gov/yose/planyourvisit/upload/wildpermitform.pdf , open it in a reader. Go to the 2nd page for the form itself. Look at the 1st blue tinted row where it says "Entry Trailhead". Click on the pulldown arrow at the right, then scroll to the very bottom of the list. The "Cross-County Trailheads" are listed in this group at the bottom. The 3 entry points are Budd Creek, Nelson Lake, and Rockslides (which is in YV). To get a permit, you are required to select entry and exit points and also to fill in the 1st Night's Camp Location — that's how they check that you are getting the right TH. If you get it in person or via phone, they are supposed to ask you what your 1st nights camp is and do the same check.

I haven't found anyplace where the quotas for these 3 cross-country entry points are listed. I'd appreciate it if anyone has a link for that.

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