McHale pack or Zimmer pack?

E-mail takes time. Time is money. Who here does not charge for time? Consultation fees?
While some are lucky or skilled enough to work in a field that we all view as a hobby, it is still work and they should get paid. They still have bills and mortgages like the rest of us they have to pay. That means that they have to get money from somewhere and someone. That leaves the actual customers that know where babies come from and plan for and around them. They are the ones who actually pay. That would not be fair to them or me.
I have noticed that most of the popular cottages, after the first one or two e-mails, stop replying. I've come to expect it. Tarptent, Hmg, Six Moons…Zimmer was out for a couple of weeks, but was probably the best at replying. I'm the same way. I hate dealing with some customers. They charge for their time, yet they want mine for free.

Quite frankly, if you are UL, you can carry what you need in just about anything, …even a cuben sack with shoulder straps.

McHale packs are legendary, but not in the UL area because they simply arent required.

I dont find the website bad, but then again I have no complaints about dirtygirlgaiters.com website, and some blast her for the worst website on the web,as if it really matters.

A lot of folks get a custom item made, and then its up for sale shortly after too. I think many folks "custom" ideas dont really work out for them long term, whether shelters or packs. Its also amazing the number of people that get a custom pack made, and then sell it claiming its too small. Ive seen what I regarded as some hideous custom packs on here, whether in terms of just colors, or pack options.

Scree wrote,

"E-mail takes time. Time is money. Who here does not charge for time? Consultation fees?
While some are lucky or skilled enough to work in a field that we all view as a hobby, it is still work and they should get paid. They still have bills and mortgages like the rest of us they have to pay. That means that they have to get money from somewhere and someone. That leaves the actual customers that know where babies come from and plan for and around them. They are the ones who actually pay. That would not be fair to them or me.
I have noticed that most of the popular cottages, after the first one or two e-mails, stop replying. I've come to expect it. Tarptent, Hmg, Six Moons…Zimmer was out for a couple of weeks, but was probably the best at replying. I'm the same way. I hate dealing with some customers. They charge for their time, yet they want mine for free."

The difference is that the other cottage makers haven't sent you demo gear to try out, decide on options and perfect the fit. You are supposed to email Dan Mchale with pictures, videos, and questions. The process is very well defined in his website (unless that has been edited as well) and is expected to take a lot of back and forth through email. Given the price of a Mchale pack, it is a reasonable expectation that emails would be included in the price of the pack. The consultation as you put it would be included. But if not, we have all learned something.

What are you asking Tarptent? The length of the shelter? Whether you can get their products in cuben (you can't, BTW)?

Zimmer was replying to your emails consistently because the dialogue must be extensive and ongoing if you are having him build you a custom pack.

Regarding babies, yes, we should all plan better. LOL

"For high end packs are you really getting something worth paying for?"

Depends on how much you use it, I suppose.

I have read complaints about paying $800 for McHale custom packs. Well, that price is a pretty generalized statment. I believe that those who are taken back about the cost are comparing these packs to production packs made outside the U.S. . They are not in the same league, such as it would be foolish to compare Merrell custom boots ($1200) to those off the shelf. To me, they were a bargain, and I wanted to get the different models now before Dan retired.

One of my McHale packs, a Merke, cost under $500. Another, a Chasm, cost around $950. Of course it was full Dyneema. My large pack, a SCMII, cost around $950, and it is a Dyneema/Dyneema grid construction.

In my Merke, I carry weights anywhere from 10 lbs to 50 lbs and it can handle it. The weight of McHale packs have never concerned me. I always choose durability first before counting ounces, in packs, as well as tents, as I commonly camp at or above timberline in the Winds and the Uintas.

McHale packs are built to last, the stitching is impeccable, as well as the fit. The suspension is amazing.

I have never regretted my purchases from Dan. I am confident that these three packs will last me the rest of my life.

I'd like people to know that the real reason Squid Face is chasing me around here and in the cottage consumption thread is because I got tired of 'working' with him. I made the personal conclusion that something was wrong with this picture and that somehow he just was not the normal sincere customer, this after giving him another chance after trying to ignore him. I told him to go and find another pack maker to play with. He can fill you in on the details of what I actually told him……..something about circles and jerks…. I tried to escape him by ignoring him but that did not work. He is already an 'AMBASSADOR' for HMG, and he's probably on the most valuable player list at Mystery Ranch. He's up for grabs. Anyone want him?

David Ure is trying to make a big deal of me charging for emails when this was the only time I have done it – I doubt he would bring it up if he knew that. It's strange that David has been in contact with this person. David has located the only customer I ever charged for emails. I have to wonder about that. The reason I charged for the emails was to make a statement to a person that seemed to have no concept of the amount of my time he wasted. He did not even consider it, and it was quite a bit of time. The money I charged was purely token, and the person did not even understand that. I was in contact with this person for 4 months and his intention from the beginning was to get a pack.

Thanks you two for the glowing example that people aren't perfect.

"I'd like people to know that the real reason Squid Face is chasing me around here is because I got tired of 'working' with him. I made the personal conclusion that something was wrong with this picture and that somehow he just was not the normal sincere customer, this after giving him another chance after trying to ignore him. I told him to go and find another pack maker to play with. He can fill you in on the details of what I actually told him……..something about circles and jerks…. I tried to escape him by ignoring him but that did not work. He is already an 'AMBASSADOR' for HMG, and he's probably on the most valuable player list at Mystery Ranch. He's up for grabs. Anyone want him?"

Be the bigger man and let it go.

Yes, I did want to talk to you about your after sales service….

Folks, I won't fill you in on the packs fit issues and certainly not the offensive emails from Dan Mchale, as this is not the correct forum. Some find no fit issues; some do. If you look back at every post I have made, I have never said a bad thing about a Mchale pack. In fact, if I look at my very first post on this thread it recommended a Mchale pack. Yet my character has been attacked, my family attacked (that post was edited, LOL), etc.

In any event, caveat emptor and all that. Last post on this thread from me.

Yet the "non serious" customer did buy a quality pack. you probably have enough customers anyway. So what if you have to eat your own pot roast?
Buy a Lawson.

You might be right…

> … I think maybe he just wasn't aggressive enough??

Are they worth it? How much is it worth to you?
How often will you use it compared to other things in your life? A $200 pack may well do, meaning that you could possibly spend $300 on other gear or possibly food for the baby. For me $500 was too much. If I spent more time on the trail, or was a guide, or had greater income, it might be cheap. For myself, I really could only excuse around $300…and then stretched it. I'm very happy with what I have. I'll probably die before it wears out. Just buy the best that you can afford. Regardless of what you carry 20-30 pounds in, it will still be 20-30 pounds. You can't buy your way out of it unless you hire a Sherpa.

Charles' post is a good one. Go back and read it.

I don’t know the truth of what happened, but from what I have read, it’s not inspiring me to become a customer of McHale.  If I ever needed a custom pack, I would call Dan and talk to him and make my own conclusions based on our conversation, but I would definitely bring up this thread. It would be anxiety provoking for me to work with someone on a custom project who can be so attacking, even if the customers in question were egregiously entitled and inconsiderate.

@asolthane I have the exact opposite view — I have no need for a pack but I like Dan McHale more because of this thread.  I do not like people wasting my time and I do not like wasting theirs, especially when money is involved.

You pay for what you get with a McHale pack, and yes expensive when comparing to store packs! Getting a McHale’s pack is a dialogue process…phone or email. The process normally is a 2- 3month process…. yes that long and maybe longer.

The Demo Pack he sends you is based on the information you have sent him via his site, and is the the initial step of fitting that you have ample time to use the pack and manipulate it in different configurations to finalize the fit and what you desire. When this and only then you can move on to  the items that you desire in your pack.

Dan’s method is to assure the pack that you desire will fit you first, and when you BOTH are satisfied by the use of pictures, email and/or phone conversations and wearing the pack for many trials, then and only then, you can proceed  to the next step to include what items you want included before it goes into production!   His process you must take a active role in the fitting with the communications you have had with Dan.

Dan can design and make a pack that is light and will serve your needs. The process takes time as he passes/suggestions items for you to think about and try. While the process is long you must understand that you enter into a custom pack fitting process and purchase from Dan has been in the business for quite some time with many customers, and has the experience to make you a pack that will serve your needs as the wife and I can tell you from experience.

You pay for what you get with a McHale pack…..and something you will wear with confidence for many years!.