Dysfunctional Pack Design :)

John,

Your comments on aesthetics were cogent and resonated for me. I made a living as a designer for over twenty years and cannot abide ugly gear, of which I see much. Thanks for your comments.

Question: In practical terms how does the capacity of your NF Veto compare to your Murmur?

On lids: lids are functional, in that even without a pocket they serve as compression devices and provide a handy place for a jacket or poncho, or even a wet tarp. If they have a pocket, that pocket is a handy place for a map or notebook and can be reached, by me, while walking and without removing the pack. A simple lid weighs no more than six inches of roll top.

As far as I can tell, Ray Jardine started the current fad for roll tops, although, yes, they've been used as climbing sacs for years. For daily use I find a lid highly functional. To replace the functions of the lid he added the large net pocket on the back, which has it's advantages and disadvantages, aside from aesthetics, and a simple top strap, which does not work as well as compression device as a lid

Jim

Jim,
Thanks for the comments.
I've PMed you about your question so as not to hijack the thread.
cheers,
fred

…

"And why is it so hard to get inside the main compartment? Why, because the ^&*(% lid pocket is in the way."

Ahahaha…. so very true. Once I took the lid off of my pack I tasted freedom.

Mike W

It'd be nice to see what your "zippered pocket" solution looks like. Would you so kindly take a few pictures and upload them for us to see? Thanks.

“It’d be nice to see what your “zippered pocket” solution looks like. Would you so kindly take a few pictures and upload them for us to see?”

Covered in this thread.

Thanks Doug.

Neat idea. I wonder how easy it is to use this when the pack is full though?

I was packing for a trip and remembered this thread. Here are some pics of my pack with a lid. It is connected with 4 small MLD caribiners. One could sew it on permanently if they wanted.

"Ahahaha…. so very true. Once I took the lid off of my pack I tasted freedom."

Just to show how much of a difference each individual's needs are, I find the opposite to be true. My McHale is a stuff-sack style pack with a drawstring top, plus a side access zipper with a removable shelf separating them. I also have a lid on mine, which is also removable.

I find that this setup allows me to put my monorail, lenses, film, and filters along my back in the top compartment, and I usually stuff my shelter on top of them (so the photo gear is between me and my tarp). Layers go in the bottom part where the side access zipper is, and smaller things like a Steripen, some snacks, bug repellent, and headlamp go in the lid for easy access.

So for me the lid is useful, but obviously that's not going to be true for everyone. :)