Best Free Stuff?

Nick Gatel wrote…

"I don't think so. A moral code is comprised of abstract principles. Each individual must choose his/her own set of values, create a hierarchy of all the components sorted by importance, and then apply them consistently to his/her life.

If I invite you to my house, and I have to leave for a day, I may say, "Go ahead and help yourself to anything you want to eat or drink." Most rational people would understand that my intent is for you have enough to eat or drink while you are staying with me. If you decide to load your car with all my food and drinks, you have taken advantage of me. It is not a legal matter, it is a moral matter. You have taken advantage of me. Again, where do we draw the line as individuals? It has nothing to do with the surplus, economics, or the legal system. It is about what values the individual has and do they consistently apply them to their life.

If someone needs condiments beyond what they will use with the food they purchase, I think they should go to a store and buy their own inventory. The businessman provides them with the intent that you will only to use what is needed on the food you purchased. To me this is crystal clear. If the businessman intended you to take more, he would post a sign that says, take all the stuff you want… no limit.

The ability to devise a moral code is probably the greatest intellectual power human beings have."

You've summed up the point I was trying to make, perfectly. Thank you. Glad to see that I am not the only one who thinks this way.

Lol…..in college I had a roommate who had tons of bum friends, er I mean "urban scavengers". I learned from day 1 to never ever eat anything they made. You had NO idea what dumpster it came out of ;-)

Of course with food safety these days it was still safer than half the crap sold as "fresh" food!

The ability to devise a moral code is probably the greatest intellectual power human beings have – except Americans seem to have lost the bearings out of our moral food consuming compasses. We are a society of excesses, happily leading the planet as the number one obese people.
If I go to Taco Bell and order a burrito they will always ask if I want hot sauce to which I will reply "please, just one." When I open the bag it will range from 3 to 7. This has become such a source of amazment that my mates and I play a game of Taco Bell lottery trying to guess the total number of packets of salsa in our order. I try to save the unopened packs until they are spilling out of the work truck paving the highways of the Pacific Northwest in red goo.
Then we have the otherside of the coin where the consumer dips his or her mitts into the bin of packets removing tenfold their requirement.
To fulfill the role as scavenger on our planet is the noble endeavor of crows, ravens, coyotes, and ultralight backpackers everywhere.
I am pleased to find your moral compass intact.

…."Glad to see that I am not the only one who thinks this way."

Oh, get over yourself already.

Nick is right on, on this and "the other" forum, as far as I am concerned, but you displayed much more than that.
At least some are "honest" about how they rationalize their actions. If all our daily rationalizing ( including work ethic and personal dealings) were displayed as openly on this forum, then it would really be " illuminating". Just observe, don't condone, but observe what we are capable of, see how it applies to you, and try and learn from it .

This thread was about condiments and where to find them etc. Now this has turned into a morality debate. I bet each and everyone on here has done an immoral thing or two in their lives. Folks get over it.

I take condiments from fast food establishments…big deal.

AND I buy things at minimus too.

To clarify a few points.
I have no problem with threads taking a different direction than originally intended, it can be a really good thing.
I think bringing up the morality of any behavior benefits us all.
Calling in question the morality of taking condiments from establishments, was a legitimate and initially positive endeavor. The posts that called the behavior into question, were probably a no brainer to some, a reminder to others and an eye opener to a few. I take issue with the " moral outrage". That is a whole other animal and I am treating it as such. To imply that now we have been" enlightened" about the morals of some BPL members, and that some disclosures have been very " revealing" and that luckily were are not alone on our moral highhorse………thas is what I take issue with. The moment I hear expressions of moral outrage:
* You unfortunately lose a lot of the people that would have benefited from some insight.
* You open yourself up to some serious questioning

Nothing wrong with morals in every thread. Expressions of moral outrage? …..you are asking for it.

you can preach about morality every single day .. just dont wake me up from my nap

every group in america seems to be against some morality crusade … pro gun/anti gun, pro abortion/anti abortion, people against any drinking, people against pre marital sex, etc …

they all want you to believe that their morality will be YOUR laws …

the simple fact is that taking a few extra condiment which are left in the open and CLEARLY meant to be take is not a crime

if you think it is … go arrest the nearest person you see doing it … or call the cops on them

you have a MORAL (lol) duty to report crime dontcha ;)

next thing you know backpacking with over a 10 lb base weight will be immoral !!!

and a crime =P

I am still waiting for one of the pro condiment crew to say something that examplifies the needless hoarding in Nick's analogy:

"… you decide to load your car with all my food and drinks, you have taken advantage of me"

Who on a BPL site is going to load themselves down with garbage when TP is often skipped?

Passing judgement so vehemently, about matters of this magnitude, must surely be given some priority within someone's "moral hierachy". Moral superiority is truly a double-edged sword.

I take issue with the nonchalant use of the words "thief" and "stealing". These are strong words which describe a crime. Offending someone's morality does not equal breaking the law. Saying that I am a thief simply because the accuser does not agree with my behavior is slanderous.

Just as in the given example " If you decide to load your car with all my food and drinks, you have taken advantage of me. It is not a legal matter, it is a moral matter."

Being rude is not a crime. Vilifying a person's behavior by saying things like " Call it pilfering or stealing… it is what it is" is libelous.

I am not concerned with the morality side of the discussion. For instance, if someone gets caught driving 70mph in a 55mph speed zone, they have clearly broken the law. Are there moral implications to speeding? You could talk about the safety of the driver and other drivers and the moral implications therein. However, a law, pertaining to the speed limit, has been broken and the moral implications are irrelevant in the writing of the speeding ticket.

To imply someone is a thief because they helped themselves to three condiment packets instead of two is inaccurate. No crime has been committed, therefore the terms "thief" and "stealing" do not apply.

If you disagree with someone's behavior I'm sure there are better ways to articulate your disgust without resorting to false accusations.

This is why I listed the definitions of "steal," "morals," and "ethics" several posts up. Morality does not necessarily equal right or wrong, legal or illegal.

Why do you think attorneys and judges are asked to recuse themselves periodically? Many times because of MORAL interference with the law, which the law does not provide for.

As disgusting as it seems I have quite a fondness for those fake honey-butter packs from KFC, in the same way that taking a shot of olive oil in the winter seems weird but works the appeal of the honey spread grows exponentially to the distance from the trailhead.
While in college I would make a tomato soup with a couple of squirts from the condiment dispenser in the engineering cafeteria mixed with water and zapped, topped off with 5 or 6 pickle chips for a vegetable so I've been at this thieving, immoral pursuit longer then many of the members have been around [1968]. And I suppose I should recuse myself from this thread because of it.I always intended to buy a burger but never could put the 20 cents together to get one. Does intention weigh into this?
There is a very real increase in theft in our area that can be correlated to the economic times,with 100,000 families being foreclosed from their homes every month it may be time to bring back the depression era cookbooks to feed the roving bands of condiment hoarders.

Ketchup soup with saltines. My Mom lived on it after college for a couple years.

;-)

FWIW, that article that was linked to says that McD's no longer uses mechanically seperated chicken (aka this pink goop) in their nuggets as a few years ago. I'm sure the cheap nuggets you buy at the grocery store are made this way.

Soylent Green!

–B.G.–

My two favorite sources for free snacks are costco and whole foods. If they are giving it away that's their choice. And if I liberate ten paper cup samples each of handmade english cheddar, peppercorn crusted cabernet salami, macadamia nuts and chocolate covered goji berries to fuel my wanderings I could be saving some obese person from a heart attack. How's that for morality. Like Robin Hood I snitch from the free samples of the rich and obese and give to the poor and skinny.
Namely me.

No doubt I'm worked into the business model somewhere.

Also very fond of taco bell hot sauce. I always ask for ten packs at the drive through.

"FWIW, that article that was linked to says that McD's no longer uses mechanically seperated chicken (aka this pink goop) in their nuggets as a few years ago."

And you believe that? For 20 plus years Mcd's serves you crap and suddenly they have a conscience.

Jeff, out here on Sundays instead of going out to lunch after church, everyone goes to Costco – to shop n' nosh. Sunday Samples are the best. They had chocolate covered berries last week. Soooo good ;-)

While at it check out the yber cheapie snow traction devices they are selling – two pairs for under $15 and light as well!

Fortunately they still sell toilet paper by the hundred roll packs.

OMG … u guys are going to STEAL condiments after church?

thats soooooooooo evil ….

I can't believe you folk are getting wound up about the morals involved in a sachet of pepper.

What about countries in the Middle East that you can't spell the name of, but you have no scruples about taking their oil?

I better go stick on my hard hat. :)

I can too spell Scotland!

My post was not one soliciting for opinions. Do what you want and I'll do what I'm comfortable with. I have asked for extras from businesses and taken them backpacking. I don't care what you consider right or wrong. If you like getting condiments with your meal and using extras on the trail, post your ideas. Never would I have imagined this much opinion b.s. Bottom line is it doesn't matter. If you have any ideas post them. I've never seen so many people inserting opinion where it wasn't asked. That'll teach me huh?

Edward I agree with ya! Some of the responses have been rather silly

..sometimes I just can't help it..

Silly yes, but Larry has untapped talent. Lol!