Has lightweight packing really caught on?

[Lynn Tramper]

"The alternative is stop increasing the number of areas open to backpacking, and to lose some we already have."

Given that one of the biggest tourist attractions to this country is our wilderness scenery, I doubt that this will become a local issue. Thankfully most of the tourists never leave the roads, and those that do venture into the backcountry tend to stick to the most popular tracks.

[Roger Caffin]

Why this great cultural cringe over the word 'elite'?

Elite: "Someone who is among the best at certain task"
Wiktionary

I would like to think that the word might suit quite a few BPL members, especially when it comes to 'lightweight backpacking'.

Cheers

[Nick Gatel]

It is at least "catching on" because I have more equipment options.

Other than that, I could care less. I usually don't hike with others and generally do not talk to those I meet on the trail. As a matter of fact, if heavy packs keep most people away from the remote sections away from trail heads, that is best IMO.

[Lynn Tramper]

"Elite: "Someone who is among the best at certain task""

That is only one of many meanings of "elite", and I'm pretty sure it's not the meaning being used in this thread.

[Ken Thompson]

Elitist is not so nice.

noun
a person who believes that a system or society should be ruled or dominated by an elite.
• a person who believes that they belong to an elite

[Arapiles .]

"Lightweight gear should also equate with relatively slow and short, but pleasant, simplified and pain-free, hikes."

+1
+1
+1

Exactly: UL and "fastpacking" are not the same thing. I'm quick but I'm not interested in competing or rushing.

[Arapiles .]

"If you look back over the content of this thread, I think you will find it riddled with subtle remarks of feeling sorry for those with heavy packs, a touch of elitism about that fact, and a general attitude that these folk somehow haven't, but really should, "catch on"."

There's an element of truth to that observation – but given that most people doing UL started out doing the conventional thing and thought to themselves "there has to be a better way", when you do see people using the same gear you moved away from the response is probably understandable.

About 15 years ago I was up Mt. Bogong with a big load (think 110 l Lowe Alpine pack, 2 kg synthetic sleeping bag etc) and some kid demanded to check my pack because I was on my own – I wonder how they would have reacted to my current pack?

[Arapiles .]

"2 weeks ago we went on a trip in which we encountered 220kph wind gusts (~135mph) and 240-280mm of rain (8-11 inches) in a space of 24 hours. No UL tarptent that I know of could have withstood those conditions, and even good raingear wets out with that kind of rain hitting you at those speeds"

Lynn – NO tent would stand up to winds like that, UL or otherwise. Lucky we don't see it that often, hey?

[Dale Wambaugh]

DW wrote: "About 15 years ago I was up Mt. Bogong with a big load (think 110 l Lowe Alpine pack, 2 kg synthetic sleeping bag etc) and some kid demanded to check my pack because I was on my own – I wonder how they would have reacted to my current pack?"

Someone could demand to see the contents of your pack? This was a ranger of some sort or just a self-appointed nitwit? It prompts the desire to give ummm…. instructions to the person making the demands.

[Arapiles .]

He was a self-appointed nitwit.

Someone else did much the same thing on that trip – she was in the local SAR and wanted to check my pack but then got a bit excited about my "ultralight" gear. From memory it wasn't particularly light, and what was odder was that she herself was tarping.

[Lynn Tramper]

"Lynn – NO tent would stand up to winds like that, UL or otherwise. Lucky we don't see it that often, hey?"

Agreed, though they do occur in places like Mt Everest with some regularity, and you want a pretty beefy tent to take on a mountain like that. Those speeds I mentioned were in exposed places, and we did find some sheltered places behind rocks and under trees. But the rock shelters had no flat ground, and we were too scared to sleep under trees in that kind of wind. Just another good reason to carry a bivy bag IMHO (which we always do). Thanks goodness we made it back to the hut. 1200 sad skiers were trapped at a local snowfield for 24 hours because of the wind, virtually sleeping on top of eachother. We had the hut all to ourselves :) As it stood, little sleep was had as the noise was ferocious and we feared the windows would blow in or the hut would blow away…anyway, my pack will always be heavier than a UL devotee somewhere like the Sierras, and honestly I wouldn't want to see newbies going into our mountains with UL gear. Then again, when he weather turns that bad, I wouldn't want to see a newbie at all. It's not as if a PLB or sat phone would have got you out of a sticky situation in those conditions, and too many people here drown because of impatience and lack of knowledge about when it's safe to cross a swollen stream or river.

[Bob Gross]

Way back in 1983, there was an American expedition attempting to climb the West Ridge of Everest. They had 18 tents that were custom designed and made to withstand 140 mph winds. In the process of being up there and getting hit by storm after storm, 15 out of 18 of their tents were destroyed. That kind of makes ordinary tents look like junk.

–B.G.–

[Diane “Piper” Soini]

I do not try to convert people who do not ask me first. I do find, however, that my mere presence having my small pack and visibly not struggling like other people puts people on the defensive.

On my last trip in the Sierras I wouldn't be doing anything at all. I might be just walking along or stopped and eating a snack and unbidden people would start making excuses for their heavy packs. I asked them about their hikes, I asked them if they were hiking the whole JMT, I only tried to make conversation and if they were JMT thru-hikers, I wanted to express my awe. But they were defensive.

I got the sense that people know about lightweight hiking but for some reason are not willing or able to try it. I wonder why that is. It can't be money because I saw a lot of people with brand new gear and GPS and all kinds of stuff I don't have.

When I've talked with people about lightweight hiking I've always tried to stress how much of it is NOT about buying expensive stuff. I try to stress how much weight can be saved by making your gear from scavenged stuff or leaving stuff out or taking smaller quantities. I find it hard to feel like an elitist when I advocate basically backpacking with garbage.

I admit that I can be quite competitive and I do enjoy blowing by people struggling up some high mountain pass. That's the way I try to make my point about carrying less weight. Maybe it's too snobbish. Oh well.

[tommy d]

Piper – I think you really hit the nail on the head in you post here. You have some great points.

I really think that when looking at this issue you have to look at the two major types of "heavy weight" backpackers. With "new" backpackers, it seems that they just don't realize that they should take pack weight into consideration. It may pop into their heads when they're loading the pack and I fear that's when important items get left behind. I was talking with a grad student yesterday who said she hadn't been hiking all summer, because she needed new boots. I pointed out that she could have just worn the trail runners she was wearing. I saw a light go on when she thought about it for a second.

The other type of backpacker is the more established one. They're aware of lightweight backpacking options, but they are in a state of inertia. They seem to be pretty resistant when pack weight is discussed, even though in my experience on the trail, they're always the ones to bring up the subject.

Another funny thing about accusing UL backpackers of being elitist is that based on my experience, most of us recognize that our packs are NOT perfect and are exploring and trying new ideas. I like things to be light, simple, and cheap. The people who say "I've been hiking these mountains for 30 years with this, that, and the other thing and I won't change" are actually the people who seem to think what's they're carrying is "perfect in any situation."

UL backpackers start by realizing that EVERY piece of gear or hiking route or whatever is a compromise. I'd venture to guess that all gear has limitations and weaknesses in certain conditions. Adapting and changing as you learn new things is a rather humble way to live, while insisting that you know your gear is bomber is a rather prideful statement to make.

At the end of the day, everybody makes their own choices, but I hope people carry gear that keeps them safe and enables them to enjoy themselves in the wilder spaces of our world.

[Steven Hanlon]

i never subscribed to the "bring it all just in case" mindset instead choosing to arm myself with knowledge, not gear. i was part of a core group of four guys who went on trips once and sometimes twice a month for over a three year period. the other three guys would go on expedition type trips with me joining them for our local weekend trips. when i first hooked up with them (2005), i was just getting back into backpacking for the second time with gear purchased a few years earlier (2000-2001). of the four of us, two guys carried massive packs, i carried heavy stuff in a heavy pack, and the final guy, well, he turned me onto this site. his base pack weight was around 9 pounds.

our trips would typically have 7 or 8 people, some who would do a few months worth of trips and others who we'd only see once or twice. over the years it was probably 20 different people who came and went with the core. i saw all manner of heavy packs for 3 days in the woods. i saw a very petite girl lugging a cast iron skillet that she used to cook eggs and bacon on the first day and then never use again up 1800' of elevation in 2 miles. yes, she waited for me at the top. typically a bunch of gadgets would surface in camp for a few minutes and then be put away to be never used again. one guy carried canned food, not soup or tuna, a canned ham and the large can of skinned potatoes!

during my time with this core group, i started to replace items as they "wore out" with lighter alternatives (that's the official story given to my wife). i moved to a custom pack and that is the heaviest item at just over 3 pounds. i switched to a canister stove and changed my mindset on the tent and extra clothes policy. i switched from Nalgene hard plastic bottles to 1 liter canteens and ditched the filter in favor of chemical treatments. i shed about 8 pounds by just replacing items with lighter versions – not doing without. but the two other guys in our core continued to carry tons of stuff and everything was the mega version, built to last. i thought it was insane, they knew better. if i could reduce my pack down to 12 pounds, there was no reason they couldn't do the same.

i asked one of them about one night when we shared a tent one trip. he told me he carried all that gear to keep his body in condition for expeditions. seems he did a bunch of month long adventures with massive peak climbs. the other guy was in training to do the same thing.

i made the suggestion that instead of carrying all that extra junk, why not just bring the essentials and replace the weight with water in the pack. the very next weekend trip, both guys informed us that the group of seven didn't need to carry water, they were each carrying 3 gallons. 25 pounds of water to replace all that other stuff, i was dumbfounded.

[James holden]

Lightweight … Yes its catching on … Just look at the sucess of golite and the osprey talon/exos

UL … No … And i doubt it will soon … Durability, features and comfort take precedence

[Steven Hanlon]

saw about 2 dozen people while out for my trip this weekend. i did a very well traveled section of the AT in Maryland. the weather forecast was mid 80's Saturday with clear skies and overnight low of 56, Sunday more of the same but a daytime high of 94.

i saw exactly 2 people that i would have consider UL and maybe 2 more that were lightweight. i passed two guys who told me they were only going to the site 5 miles up trail for an overnighter. i saw a poncho, a rain jacket, a sweater, and a pair of winter gloves attached to the outside. be prepared indeed.

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