Lightest 2 Person 3 Season Double Wall Tent Alternatives to Evolution 2P?

I think the closest competitors are:

Light 2 person wedge-type double wall tents:
Tarptent Scarp 2
MSR Hubba Hubba
BA SL3
SD Lightning
REI QuarterDome T2

Light 2 person hoop-type double wall tents:
Hillenburg Nallo (2P ?)
Warmlite / Stevensons 2R

Hi EJ,

There are very few genuine contenders in the same weight class.

If you want 2 doors, comparable space, no heavier, and free-standing then the competition is precisely zero. Believe me, I've gone through the exact process you are now.

If you are willing to go a bit heavier, or lose the double entries, then John's suggestions above are good options.

If you don't want to go any heavier (depends on whether you get the porch fly for the evolution 2p), and are willing to not have a freestanding tent, then you should look at getting the Scarp 2. That is what I have settled on. The Evolution 2p needs to be well staked down most of the time anyway, and the Scarp will be sturdy with fewer stakes. Plus the Scarp is cheaper, and comes from a well-respected cottage maker with an excellent history of service and support.

Can someone post a close up pic of the corner struts — or provide a link please?

http://summitandvalley.blogspot.com/search/label/Scarp%201

towards the bottom of the page. Sorry Ben, I can't remember my html coding.

Thanks, Daniel. Pray tell, what are the struts made of and how are they held in place? Stick, nylon sleeve, and velcro perhaps? Anyway, here is the HTML.

To convert, type this:

‹a href=”http://summitandvalley.blogspot.com/search/label/Scarp%201″›HERE‹/a›

EJ: Sorry for the tangent. OK, now back to lightweight double wall tents…

The struts are a carbon fiber pole section, the same as you have as cross strut in your Rainbow. Those are sleeved inside a folded grosgrain1.5" "sleeve".
( that is what they look like to me….)
Franco

Thanks, Franco.

LOL full circle – when I saw the Scarp 2 on the "What's New" section of Henry's site, I got excited about it, but I thought about it as a little lighter winter tent (even though you could use it without the crossed poles and with mesh instead of fabric inner walls – I just wasn't thinking flexibly).

According to Henry (from email), the full weight of the Scarp 2 will be:

1) with mesh interior without crossed poles ~ 52 ounces
2) with mesh interior + crossed poles – 68 ounces (poles are about ~ l lb)
3) with silnylon interior + crossed poles – 71 ounces (the solid interior will have the same material as the Scarp 1 interior: calendared 1.1-ounce ripstop nylon. It's breathable but highly water resistant. Weight is ~ 3 ounces more the mesh version).

I'm not sure if that includes stakes and how many stakes. Anyone know? How many stakes will the tent require in free-standing (with poles) and non-freestanding mode?

Did you have these weights in mind when settling on the Scarp 2?

Also, do you plan to get the Scarp 2 with mesh interior for 3 season use?

Do you plan to use it without crossed poles for 3 season use?

I've read so many comments about carbon hiking and tent poles being brittle, particularly at the joints – don't you worry about this? Can anyone comment on the durabilty of Tarptent carbon poles? Franco?

> LOL full circle

Ha, yes, I seem to remember suggesting the Scarp 2 in one of your first posts? =-)

> I'm not sure if that includes stakes and how many stakes. Anyone know? How many stakes will the tent require in free-standing (with poles) and non-freestanding mode?

The weights quoted don't include stakes. But the tent will come with stakes. I'm guessing you would need a minimum of 6 stakes in non-free-standing mode (although you could possibly get away with 4 in a pinch). Best to check with Henry. In free-standing mode… depends how well you want to peg it down.

> Did you have these weights in mind when settling on the Scarp 2?

Yes. Basically I was after the lightest weight tent I could find that I also believed would wind resistant enough for 3 season alpine conditions. The Scarp is designed to turn into a four-season tent (when you add the poles and solid inner) and in 3 season mode it should be extremely sturdy. The struts are an important difference here between the Scarp and, say, the lunar duo. You can also use trekking poles to add extra stability when needed.

> Also, do you plan to get the Scarp 2 with mesh interior for 3 season use?

Yep, mesh interior. I'm only intending it for places where I'll get an occasional dusting of snow during the night. If I was expecting driving snow and spindrift I would definitely get the solid inner instead. But most of the time I don't get snow, and I appreciate the cool ventilation of mesh in summer. The great thing is though, we have the option of two different interiors. So if I want to get into winter camping later on I'll buy the solid inner.

> Do you plan to use it without crossed poles for 3 season use?

Yes, the poles are unnecessary for 3 season use. In conditions where it is really windy, trekking poles can be used to provide extra support. You only need poles if you are expecting heavy snow loading.

> I've read so many comments about carbon hiking and tent poles being brittle, particularly at the joints – don't you worry about this? Can anyone comment on the durabilty of Tarptent carbon poles? Franco?

No problems here. The main arch pole is alumninium. The carbon bits are just the small struts on the end of the tent. The brittleness of carbon poles arises when they are bent sideways (like when you arrange them into a long, curved pole). The struts are not bent when they are in position so there is no danger of them breaking. Completely different situation.

HTH!

Cheers, Ashley

CF poles can snap when subjected to excessive lateral pressure ( there are many variables her but generally this is the case) They do however work very well with vertical pressure.
There are no joints in those "single" pole sections…
Example of mostly vertical pressure (no trick involved but DO NOT DO THIS)
Franco

Well actually that is very much lateral pressure, note that i am leaning into not onto, but you get the idea, maybe.

LOL GREAT photo. Thanks again for clarifying that about the straight struts versus the center aluminum curved pole. I've already emailed Henry.

Found a friend of a friend who will also let me pitch a Lunar Duo and see what it's like without having to buy one for now.

Given what we're looking for, I think the Scarp 2 will work great.

Thanks again for all the excellent advice.

I'm just trying to find out the number, weight, type and length of stakes that come with the Scarp 2. Please let me know if you find out. I emailed Henry as well.

Unlike some tents , the Scarp in free standing mode is really freestanding, no pegs required. Of course if you are not particularly keen to see how it performs as a kite (IMHO if you remove the inner it should do rather well) it takes 6 pegs, supplied with 9" long Easton. (about 90g total, 3.17 oz) I would recommend installing the guylines on the main pole , so that will require another 2 pegs.
Franco
I was prodding the tent and was particularly impressed by the stability of the corner struts, so I wanted to come up with something that conveyed that idea.

IMO the closest thing in weight, size, function and price is the Big Agnes Copper Spur 2. In fact, I think I'd prefer it over the Evolution 2P due to the interior "half-height" fabric design, which could be really super for providing privacy while still a perfect option for stargazing on warm dry nights.

How does the Copper Spur 2 differ?

"I would recommend installing the guylines on the main pole , so that will require another 2 pegs."

Do you mean just securing guylines around the main pole, or requesting custom guylines for the main pole or adding them on your own? Could you elaborate on where you would secure them?

Do not overlook the Warmlite (Stpehnson) 2r. around 3lbs and spacious.

Att David G:
Judging from your avitar, you might like the Archwood Flextrek 37 Trill zxyvr Backpack. Scroll down to the Yu-Tube explanation video:

http://lighthiker.wordpress.com/

EJ
The tie out point is already attached to the sleeve, you just need to add two guy out lines, one on each side.
(I had the Scarp up because we were getting some good wind gusts, first it was up without and the pole was deforming so I pegged that guyline down and then the pole still flexed but just enough to notice)
Franco

Franco, is that a Scarp 1 or Scarp 2? I'm assuming Scarp 1 because 2 isn't out yet. If that's a Scarp 1, looks roomy. I'll check out the specs.

How do you like the Scarp 1 without crossing poles versus the Rainbow for a sturdy 3 season solo shelter?

I'd like to stay at 2 lbs or under per person for 3 season shelters – for a 2 person tent the Scarp 2 makes it, the Scarp 1 is a little heavier than I'd like but the Rainbow makes the weight cut. I'll probably give the Rainbow a shot to check the venting and condensation.

I believe he is referring to the fact that the Copper Spur does not have a full mesh inner. Here is a pic of my Copper Spur 3.

With the Scarp 1 and 2 is there a way to use trekking poles for extra support in the event of severe weather?

Raymond, looks very nice. Does the half fabric make it any hotter than full mesh inners you've used, when used with the fly?

How much does it weigh without the fly?

With the fly?

How's the interior space?

How stable is it in stronger winds?

Franco, have you modded your Scarp in any way or do you have any suggestions for worthwhile mods?

Do you use a ground sheet with the Scarp? I'm leaning toward using 1.1 oz Silnylon from Thru-hiker which should weigh near 3 oz based on a suggestion by a BPL member in another thread. Either that or a GG 1 oz Polycro sheet, which will probably be harder to work with and less puncture resistant (though a good sheet is not a substitute for site inspection).

I have the Scarp 1, but the 2 looks exactly the same but wider. ( the first picture I saw of the Scarp 2 I had to be told what it was cause it looked like the 1 at first glance)
My Scarp has only seen backyard tests , however I never used a groundcloth with the Contrail or the Rainbow, personal choice.
The only mod I did was the one to get the freestanding inner and that is the same used to put the poles inside.
You can use the trekking poles to support the end (to me the boxed end is strong enough as it is…) , can be used outside to support the hoop pole (again I thing a guyline only will do the job) but can also be used inside in my "Scarp Light" version or to support the hoop pole . To do this last bit just position them next to the inner and have a sock or something like that to keep them in position.
Note that most of my mods involve having the tents up with some tension in the first place, fans of floppy set-ups do not apply…
Franco
The first picture, the one with a flat ridge, is the Scarp 1 using trekking poles only, just in case you forgot the hoop pole, or just want to go lighter or as in my case, because I can.
See pic of the Scarp 2 in the snow) pole inside set up.