2022 Bob Open

Well, I’m out this year..again but will Jealously follow the updates. I have to work Memorial weekend through Monday. But, I may take a delayed start Tuesday and see where I can get to in the short week.  That or I may try an Upper Middle Fork Flathead float out to Schaffer, which is something I’ve always wanted to do and needs to be done with early season for flows I hear.

If you chose the yo-yo would it be legit to dump gear at a location knowing you would be back there on the return trip?  Thoughts on this….

That’s my plan Tom. My route will be a figure 8 and I’m planning to leave a food drop at the intersection on the way down and pick it up on the way back.

“Take everything you need, and leave nothing behind but footprints.”

-Bedrock and Paradox

But then again, there has never been a checkpoint! Curious on Dave’s take.

this has come up in the past in regards to bikes/rafts/gliders/etc- it was always if you’re carrying it, you carry it the entire way

granted we’ve never had an out and back either

Hmm. For whatever reason the food/gear drop idea doesn’t sit that well with me, also curious to hear Dave chime in.

Glad I could spark some debate on this thread its been lacking content!!!!!

This will only be my second go at the Bob Open and I’ll be shooting for the Rattlesnake finish, so I don’t speak on the food/gear drop debate with much authority. I’ll just add that the Open appeals to me because of its lack of dogma and regulation. I understood the rules to be in place to prevent formalization (no set course/ no aid stations), allow for creativity (hike, ski, paddle, whatever…), and to preserve the Bob Marshall (pack out your trash).

Dave would be the final authority on this, but that’s my two cents.

MMC, I too enjoy the freedom of the Bob Open. I like this conversation and through my own lens I try to think of it in terms “in the spirit of.”  Would I feel the same way about a food bag if it were a bike? Probably not. Someone rides from this year’s start to the Benchmark TH. Stores the bike at the TH, heads to the confluence checkpoint then back to Benchmark TH to retrieve bike and ride back to finish? Creative? Yes. But I’d vote you gotta carry that bike :)

So long as its not pre-cached, I don’t understand the problem. You’re still self sufficient and LNT. I think I would carry that thought through to Kyle’s bike example. I am personally not interested in biking my Bob Open, but so long as the means of travel adheres to the wilderness rules then it seems like a legit option and a clever way to approach this years route. You’re still finishing with what you started with. If there was a wilderness rule that prohibited food caching then I wouldn’t advocate for it.

:)

Totally understand the pro-caching arguments, and I hope this is taken in the spirit of friendly discussion. Here are two reasons why caching doesn’t sit that well with me. Although I should say that it’s really just a gut reaction and these reasons may be an attempt to retcon a justification for that reaction.

1. FS may not be very happy about food caches in particular and given that they tolerate us fairly happily right now I feel like we should avoid stepping on their toes. Which is maybe more of an argument against publicly caching per se.

2. It seems to me that the purpose of introducing a checkpoint for an out and back is just to diversify the route options given the limited number of trailheads and increasingly long run of the event. Maybe also to introduce options which don’t require a shuttle. To me that means that the checkpoint option should change the event, in spirit and in  practice, as little as possible. One of the things that makes the open different from other backpacking trips is the collective experience- even when you’re out there alone at 11pm hiking your last miles of the day by headlamp you’re still doing it with other people in some sense.  This is true even of some people are going to rattlesnake but you’re going back to blackleaf. It feels less true if some people have cached stuff and others haven’t. Ultimately it’s public land so anyone can go do whatever they want out there over Memorial Day weekend, and the lines between who is “doing the open” and who isn’t will always have some degree of haziness and subjectivity to them. But to me caching begins to push that line.

Just fyi there actually is a regulation within the wilderness.

• Storing or caching equipment, personal property, or supplies – (57(f)).

This wouldn’t apply towards the bike option :)

I very much appreciate Will’s reluctance to introduce anything that could alter the Open in practice or in spirit. We are all drawn to this event because of that spirit and we should take care to safeguard it. I am libertarian in nature and appreciate the diversity of approaches that people bring to this event. Second only to participating in the event itself, the coolest part of this thing is seeing what people put together and pull off. It’s the point where where ambition meets creativity. Will’s huge second day last year that took him from Benchmark, up and over the Green Forks headwall, and then down to the Blackfoot with just enough time to send a torrent of IV/V haymakers before dark still blows my mind; even now I don’t understand how that’s possible, especially with a bum knee. I understand any game needs some restrictions for the game to be interesting. Playing chess where every piece has the power of the queen would be a way less interesting game. The trick is to not be overly burdensome with rules so as to restrict creativity. A chess game where every piece had the power of a pawn would be equally uninteresting. I guess my point is I would prefer participants in the Open to feel free to  fully use their creativity to come up with inventive routes, assuming that their choices comport with wilderness regulations. And it looks like Tom has done his homework and discovered that caching is a prohibited practice. Given this, I will reluctantly not cache my food.

Only a FYI, I have no dog in the fight. Unattended Food storage is prohibited in the Bob except as allowed by current Order # R1-2022-02 (under authority of  Title 36 C.F.R. § 261.58(cc)) Allowed if a bear resistant storage method is used including approved bear cans, enclosed hard-sided vehicles/trailers/structures, electric fence, hanging (10′ H, 4′ from trunk. Order expires 12/31/2022.

Never mind,  can’t figure out how to delete a post

I too appreciate the pro-caching arguments. Good points Rob! I’ve loosened my original viewpoint on the bike idea :)

Yeah Rob your point about creativity is well taken

not a fan

Good discussion.  That’s all I have to say on the caching subject ;)

We’re taking a family trip to Isle Royale and getting back a few days before zero day, so I may or may not be there.

Enjoy!

Unfortunately my first Bob open will not be in 2022, but I will be living through you vicariously through your trip reports and wish you all luck and fun!

Route planning and creeping BPL forums are my favorite pre-Bob Open activities.  The forum was off to a slow start this year, but luckily the cache debate gave it a good shot in the vein. Much appreciated Tom M!

Any chance any Helena folks have an extra packraft they’d be willing to loan me for this year’s Open? Would be greatly appreciated!

Anders,

Sent you a d.m.

This years routes are not lighting any fire for me. Mike M presented a chose your own adventure route that starts at black leaf and ends north through some country I haven’t explored so that’s where I’m heading.

Thanks Tom! Does anyone know what Rock Creek is like this time of year?

Just curious for you rafters.  Does anyone ever use a separate pair of shoes for rafting or just not worth the extra weight since your feet are already soaked…