Ryan Jordan’s SUL Winter Challenge

[Michael Martin]

Jim writes:

>> But isn’t the benefit severely limited when the result is a kit that works for conditions so narrowly defined that they have not happened in almost 3 months of waiting?

I agree. It sort of ended up as a case of the gear determining the trip rather than the other way around.

Still, I think it was an extremely productive (and fun!) exercise. The ideas for stove design, footwear, VB clothing, etc. that this spawned were fascinating.

Cheers,

-Mike

[kevin davidson]

Did I miss something? Congrats, M.

Yes, I think the whole 30 page thread was a fascinating exercise. It helped me reduce my Winter kit
quite a bit—-adjusting for somewhat milder Winter conditions. Along with my relatively light ski set-up, I’m just about the lightest thing in the NW backcountry.

[Michael Martin]

Thanks, Kevin. You’ve got sharp eyes!

It seems the BMW skunkworks needed someone to sweep up all the tufts of 1200 fill-power Eider Down and shards of nano-eVENT lying around…. ;-)

Seriously, I can’t say anything at the moment. But, I suppose Carol or Ryan may comment in due time.

[Bill Fornshell]

“It seems the BMW skunkworks” Interesting word. Amusing how words and ideas migrate around until the orgin is lost.

[Ryan Faulkner]

if only we had 1200 fill power down and NANO weight event…oh well :-(
:-)

I am glad there was this thread, it helped me with the whole winter thing. It is my favorite time to go out, but there is less on going light in the winter than the rest of the year. I learned alot. I just cant wait for RJ to go so we can see if a sane person can really survive with this little gear. ( I am not one to talk, I tried a 50 degree bag at 15)

cant wait RJ. Has your list changed?

[Ryan Faulkner]

we finally hit 30, I was wondering when it was going to happen :-)

sorry for the pointless post.

[Mark]

Bill Fornshell writes: “‘It seems the BMW skunkworks’ Interesting word. Amusing how words and ideas migrate around until the orgin is lost.“

Big Barnsmell… Bill Fornshell…

Hmmm.
-Mark

[kevin davidson]

So, Michael– a Nano framed Wind-Pro w/ an eider down insulated fuel line is in the works. I’ll sell this info to the competition. Mwa ha ha ha.

The Lockheed Skunk works–Kelly Johnson, Palmdale environs. My Papa worked there. U-2’s, Blackbirds, and the like. I think the name came from an old comic strip.

I hope BPL/BMW will follow in the same fine tradition of stealthy wizardry. And KISS.

[paul johnson]

My favorite quote from a former executive at Skunkworks aimed at the then new trend of corporate downsizing as a means of showing short term profit: “You can’t shrink to greatness!” This was from quite a number of years ago. Seems like no one was listening!!

[Ryan Jordan]

The eastern Beartooths will get near/below zero next week – finally. I’ll be off for the SUL challenge. I don’t know if the temps will last for a full 3 days, but we should be getting a solid 48 hrs of cold…Stay tuned.

[Carol Crooker]

Hi folks, I’m posting this for Ryan who is busy with that Skurka (C2C) guy :)

“I was able to get one night in. Everything went great. Cold temps were about five below at night, highs in the day were around 12-13*F. The second day become extremely warm and the VB clothing system totally imploded and was wholly uncomfortable at 25 degrees. I called in for a forecast and mountain temps were expected to continue rising and be in the 30s for the low and forecast for rain. I bailed, because I was in an area of pretty extreme avalanche potential. I was going to head down to treeline for safer conditions but with less snow cover down there and not having a tarp I really wasn’t enthused about spending the night in a one pound down bag and water resistant bivy sack in that mess. Such was the most severe limitation of the gear I had with me.”

And from me –
An official welcome to Mike Martin, the new BPL Sleeping Systems Editor!

Really cool experiment everyone! Thanks for all the input and ideas. Quite a brain trust we have here. Somehow I like brain trust better than skunkworks :)

[kevin davidson]

Nature, of course.

I feel Ryan’s pain. This Winter, I’ve had trouble finding temperatures that were suitable for sleeping comfortably in a VBL let alone walking around in VB clothing.

I hope we get the full report. And a full gear list.
What happened to the live RSS feed scenario?

[Ryan Faulkner]

cant wait to see the list and report

Is there going to be a “Notes From the Field” feature
hope to see some pics as well
I am interested in how to make a snow cave, that would be an interesting Article to read, RJ, want to write one :-)

We are seeing more and more experimenting with SUL, winter today, and tomorow I am going to post a sub 5 pound skin out weight list for the summer.
Its almost done, I will post the list tomorow
It was oddly easy, I just trimmed some weight from my usual summer list and I got a SUL skin out weight, Amazing, huh

[Carol Crooker]

Ryan F –
Off topic – I’m looking for recent photos from Philmont (see forum 2715). Do you have any? Know anyone who has? The photos are for a Philmont Gear List we’ll be publishing soon.

[Ryan Faulkner]

Sorry Carol,

I missed Philmont when my troop went, I was a few months too young, It was unfortunate, because I was the most experienced backpacker in the group.

[Carol Crooker]

Hey, YOU don’t have to be in the photo. Just some Scouts :)

[Douglas Frick]

>I was able to get one night in.

A ‘failure’ is at least as useful as a ‘success’. Looking forward to the p.m.

[Jeremy McDaniel]

i could dig some up from the late 80’s when i went, although you did say recent.

[Carol Crooker]

Thanks Jeremy, but I’m looking for 2001 or later.

[Phil Barton]

Deleted

[Anonymous]

Dear Ryan; The Inuit have been doing this for ten thousand years, so please show respect and call this a journey of RE-discovery. Here is my list:
1) snow saw 3 0z.
2) Oil lamp 2 0z
3) flint fire starter 0.5 oz
4) cooking cup 2 0z.
5) half lb of pemmican 8 0z

Total weight 15 ounces

This is’nt a joke I’m quite sure you could do this safely Everitt

[kevin davidson]

Yep, the Inuit have long trapsed that land and learned to do it well (no one could do it better).

Sir, I think about your list that ata, sulorsimavutit.

You forgot the 30 pounds of furs and skins from various endangered species that would make up Inuit clothing like a Atigi, Karlik and Pauluweet as well as being shod with Kamiks. Not to mention several pounds of Akootok for calories (8 oz. is a little skanty), a Kakivak to hunt fish with and perhaps a Nuiq for birds. Lets also include the weight of the Qaat to sleep on and a Qipiik to sleep under.
One would need a Qamutiik to carry all that weight. But you would need dogs to pull it and stay to relatively flatter terrain.

You also forgot the weight of the seal oil for the Kudlik. And special permission from the Dept. of the Interior for a non indigenous person to use marine mammal products. Not to mention the afore mentioned furs and skins.

It’s tough for a European to emulate the Inuit. Today, with changing climate and the temptations (or intrusions) of modern life, it’s tough for an Inuit to emulate an Inuit. The traditional ways are going and that’s no joke.

[Brian James]

Was there a followup/debrief/post-mortem discussion to this that I missed? Could someone graciously post a link?

Thanks!
Brian

[Gene .]

I'd like to see the outcome remarks from Dr J's trip here..what went right, worked; and what went wrong, and did'nt.

[Carol Crooker]

To repeat Ryan's quote from above:
"I was able to get one night in. Everything went great. Cold temps were about five below at night, highs in the day were around 12-13*F. The second day become extremely warm and the VB clothing system totally imploded and was wholly uncomfortable at 25 degrees. I called in for a forecast and mountain temps were expected to continue rising and be in the 30s for the low and forecast for rain. I bailed, because I was in an area of pretty extreme avalanche potential. I was going to head down to treeline for safer conditions but with less snow cover down there and not having a tarp I really wasn’t enthused about spending the night in a one pound down bag and water resistant bivy sack in that mess. Such was the most severe limitation of the gear I had with me."

[Author]

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