MYOG: Knotless PCT Bear Bag Hang

I watched a group hanging their food in Yosemite's Lyell Canyon one time (before bear canisters). This was a group of 12-14 people, and they were going to Red's Meadow, so I think they were out for 5-6 days. That's a lot of food weight. Anyway, they had two regular size Army duffel bags filled with food, and they had a line up over a steel cable between two trees. Three or four guys were tugging away strenuously trying to get those heavy bags up. I couldn't bear ( ! ) to watch, so I just hung up my own little stash.

–B.G.–

A clove hitch in and of itself is not hard to tie

There are two kinds of people in the world …
1) Knot People
2) those who are not
Group 1 people need only see a knot tied once or twice and it's their for life whereas it is near impossible to teach group two how to tie even a simple clove hitch … and don't even think about showing them a bowline on a bight or the crown of an end splice!

Actually that was a stuff sack not my rock bag and I use that stuff sack on occasion to hang food.

Oops. Thought you were referring to my vid.

Off-topic digression here …

Group 1 people need only see a knot tied once or twice and it's their for life whereas it is near impossible to teach group two how to tie even a simple clove hitch

You are right. In some cases I think it is just a matter of how good a person is at visualizing things. In other cases, I think that the person could do better by being taught better — more logically.

Even people for whom knots are hard, though, can learn them. For example, I cannot believe all rock climbers are gifted with knots, but they darned sure learn certain knots if they want to be safe.

You can go surprisingly far by thinking of bights and loops.

* A square not is just two intersecting bights, as are a bread knot and a granny knot. The difference between the square knot and bread knot is just which side the ends are on — that matters in many knots — square knot, sheet bend, and bowline are common examples of that.

* Both a sheet bend and a bowline are a loop and bight intersecting. Cut the big loop in a bowline and you cannot tell which knot you started with.

* A double carrick bend is two intersecting loops.

* A half hitch is just a loop around something. Two of them, around the standing part, is two half hitches. Two of them around a stick is a clove hitch.

* A "slipped" or "slippery" knot is just making the last step be pushing a bight through instead of the end. Such knots generally hold as well, and are far easier to untie.

* You tie shoelaces with a double-slipped square knot (or a granny knot, but the square will stay tied better).

As an example of thinking this way, consider a trucker's hitch. The easiest way to think about how to finish it is that you tie the end through the bight, formed by the initial slip knot, as a sheet bend — or, my preference, a slippery sheet bend (so it will be easy to untie). It is far easier to remember a tucker's hitch as a slip knot, finished with a sheet bend than to try to remember it a one big knot.

Making it easy to remember is not just a gimmick — I find a trucker's hitch much better for tying things down (including guylines) than any of the slipping knots (such as a tautline hitch). Done in the slippery way, it is easier to get really tight, just about as easy to adjust when needed, and far more secure.

etc

–MV

So, to the extent that the PVC idea makes it easier for non knot people …

Agreed. But does it? I guess so, at least for the OP. I must say that I tried tying it around a rod and I found it (a little) harder than a clove hitch, because it is (a little) more complicated. A clove hitch is just two half hitches around the stick.

Delay's version of tying the clove hitch under a load is still not as easy as mine (published right here in July '09 btw

I agree that he was a little clumsy. How about posting your URL?

–MV

Tying a "clove hitch" in the middle of a rope on a stick is no more than "throwing two half-hitches" around the end of the stick–roll the rope between thumb and fore-finger and it builds the loop, then drop it on the stick, cinch down and repeat=done. Just the way the driver would do with all those reins on the stage coach. Watch more westerns or grab a boy scout handbook. Cowboy

B.G.,
Do you know of a video or good text resource for that method?
Thanks,
BL

Thanks Josh, I like it. Being ex U.S. Navy, I don't have much difficulty with the clove hitch, but I think your method is a good idea. Where I go backpacking (Northern California), an approved bear container is required much of the time, so I use a Bareboxer Contender (1.6 lb), odor proof sacks, or a combination of both even in areas that don't require a bear container. It weighs a little more but on the other hand it makes life simpler because you don't have to spend time finding the right tree, which is impossible above timberline, and risk snagging your food 15 feet in the air. Hanging food is definitely the lightest way to go, however.

Brilliant, Josh! And that's a great instructional video. You're really good at explaining and demonstrating. You'd be a great instructor. Thanks for sharing!

There are some places where the Ursack is not acceptable. Yosemite National Park is an example.

–B.G.–

Thank you, Frank. Your directions make better sense to me than any I've every seen.

Stargazer