Zpacks, the end of my love affair

[Ralph Wood]

An MLD Burn costs $180.00, and in cuben its $240.00.

[Cameron M]

“Now that the Arc Blast is 21 oz, it no longer reigns supreme over its rivals.”

You have to ask WHY it is is 21 oz, and the answer is probably not “selling out”. It can carry 35 lbs now, and I suspect also that it has been improved to last longer. Certainly Joe is hyper aware of the weight of items. I enhanced my ArcBlast to carry more and I ended up at 21 oz. I think that it is a sign of integrity and not of selling out that Zpacks keeps improving their product. There are not many proven 21 oz packs out there that can carry 35 lbs. ZPacks is still worlds away from commercial vendors.

[Mark Jones]

Here is an interesting interview with Joe Valesko from 2015. I ran across this about a year ago. As a long time customer and user of ZPacks gear I was quite surprised to discover the scope of his operation revealed in this interview, especially that ZPacks has sixty employees and runs its operation in a gymnasium.

Joe Valesko interview

[Chad “Stick” Poindexter]

When I was at the ATKO last month (March 2017) and talking with Matt, he said that they now have over 90 employees! They have grown quite a bit over the years…

I am excited because later this month I will be going to Zpacks and getting to take a look around. Hope I get to meet Joe as well while I am there…

As for the change in gear, and business… I think it’s safe to say that it was pretty obvious that as they grew, in time all the customizations would eventually fade away. That time has now come. It’s a bummer that I can’t get an Arc pack without the hydration port (for example), but I understand that this is just how it is. However, on the flip side, I really like how fast they have become with their orders. I have placed 3 orders with them this year. The first was a new Hexamid Solo Plus tarp. It was to me in a week of placing the order. The second was their new rain gear. It was to me in 2 weeks (this was because it was a brand new item). And now this past Tuesday I ordered an Arc Haul. It will be delivered today! That is fast!

I still continue to experience stellar customer service, and my emails are responded to in a very reasonable time frame. As for their gear, it just works for me, even without the customizations… as someone said above, their standard pieces of gear are great pieces and will be fine for most of their customers. I am excited to see what else comes from Zpacks in time… :)

[John Rowan]

I’m in the same boat as a lot of the folks who like the idea of being able to customize things, but don’t necessarily have a ton of need for it. (The only real exception is that I would love to be able to eat the ~2ish ounce penalty on a lot of beltless UL packs and at least have the option of a padded hipbelt.)

Honestly, as someone who’s had to compromise on specific gear choices in the past because I couldn’t afford to wait 4-6-8 weeks for something for a trip, it is kinda nice to see some of this stuff become more readily available, and I think that it’s an interesting shift in the market for some of the cottage shops (EE is the other obvious example here- it’s amazing to see what they’ve grown into since I started paying attention to their products in late 2012).

Also with Zpacks in particular, I do wonder if some of the weight creep on some of the items is ultimately reflective of the information gained from a few years of having these things in the wild. I remember the first time I encountered the Arc Blast on-trail in 2014- I was very interested in the pack, having almost bought one myself, but in my anecdotal conversations with the people wearing them, I was struck by the fact that no one seemed to really LIKE it. Most of the people thought it was *fine*, but there just wasn’t a lot of enthusiasm for the thing, and there were a fair amount of durability complaints (again, anecdotal and not a massive sample size).

Some of these changes that boost the weight a little bit might ultimately be a happy medium that create a more “mainstream” product that’s a little hardier, while still keeping the ultimate goal of a very low weight. If you’re running around with a 5oz pack made of .51 cuben, you understand that you’ve made some compromises to get that weight, and it’s something you live with. If you’re dropping $325 on a pack, the average user probably wants it to live a little longer. At the end of the day, a full-featured framed pack at 21oz is still pretty awesome.

[Yoyo]

@Cameron

By “no longer reigns supreme over its rivals” I certainly did not mean to denigrate ZPacks in any way. I still stand by their stuff and continue to tout its UL characteristics.  I suppose I meant that ZPacks no longer holds the title as the lightest pack with a frame as it once did.  I think other outfits like KS Ultralight have packs under 21 oz with a frame.  How good are they?  I have no clue, I haven’t tested them.

Personally, I think the original Arc Blast (mine is circa 2013) is plenty durable enough if you take care of it.  I’m not sure that the newer iterations have increased durability.  I think the weight increase was primarily due to 3D spacer mesh for padding and the adjustable torso.  Someone correct me if I’m wrong, but I think the new Blast uses the same 2.97 oz / sq yd. cuben for the body of the pack.   I’m tempted to try one of the new Blasts to see if I like it, as I’ve never really used mine (just taken it on day hikes mostly) due to a fit issue.  At 21 oz, it’s still much lighter than my HMG Southwest 3400 at 30 oz.

I’m glad to see that Joe has made his business grow by leaps and bounds.  It just doesn’t the have the “mystique” that it once had.  (Equipment sold to fringe enthuasiasts and the initiated, people willing to push the boundaries of UL).  That’s OK, though, nothing inherently wrong with that.

 

[Michael Gillenwater]

For what it is anecdotally worth… I have a first generation arc blast and “love it”.

[John Rowan]

^ hence my caveat. Talking to ~15ish JMT/PCT hikers does not a universal opinion make.

Also, now that I think about it, I did hike with Redbeard for a spell when I was on the PCT in 2015. If I’d asked him, he probably would’ve said he loved his. I hope so, anyway.

[Chad “Stick” Poindexter]

I bought my Arc Blast in 2014, so not right when they first came to the market, but soon after. I ended up loving my pack, and I still do. However, since the hip belts are really just wings sewn to the pack on that model, it barely fits me now since I am thinner than when I bought it… This was my justification for buying a new Arc Haul… can’t wait for the mail to run today! :)

As for my Arc Blast though, it has been used a good bit, but still in great condition. I would have no issues with using it for more years to come, if it just had a little smaller hip belt…

Also, I watched Matt bend an Arc Blast in half at the ATKO this year, and the stays flexed with it, then right back out. (They are now fiberglass as opposed to carbon fiber stays.) I must say, this impressed me a good bit!

[Yoyo]

Chad,

That’s interesting to hear that they now use fiberglass.  Do you think perhaps this could be part of the weight increase?  I do appreciate that the newer packs use 3D spacer mesh for padding. I’ve never liked the all-cuben straps that much, since they are slippery and don’t grip well.  I bought my pack in 2013, I think, around the same time you got yours.  I am tempted to try an updated Blast…

[Chad “Stick” Poindexter]

David,

I don’t know for sure, but I wouldn’t say that the fiberglass stays add much weight, if any. The fiberglass rod is round, and much smaller than the older flat carbon fiber stays like on my pack. I would imagine most of the weight gain is in other area’s…

I agree that the cuben straps were a bit slippery… that is why I ended up putting a DIY sternum strap on my XS cuben Zero. The straps kept wanting to slide off my shoulders.

By the way, I got my Arc Haul in this afternoon… it is a nice pack, and I can tell a difference in the way it sits vs my older Arc Blast. This one does feel more stable, and like the weight is actually on my hips. I can’t wait to get it out on a hike now to see how it does… unfortunately though, now that it is getting warm, it will be a few months before I get to take it out… I’ll have to go walk around my neighborhood with it loaded up…

[Ian]

Someone made a comment here the other day saying that they thought Zpacks quality of construction is a step below MLD’s, which I thought was highly inaccurate.  I’ve owned gear from both companies and think they are both top notch.

The problem with being in the fringe is having to compete with other hikers who understand that a few ounces is a worthy penalty for a performance upgrade.  I very much like my Twin but after touring a couple Duplexes, they are clearly a much better shelter.  I can’t speak for their packs as I’ve never owned one.

Either way, congrats to Joe for turning Zpacks into the company it is today.

 

[Cameron M]

FWIW, those 60-90 employees are 60-90 people employed in the USA. Additionally, ancillary businesses and spin-offs tend to happen when new products are designed and fabricated all in one country. Worth noting and supporting IMHO.

 

[HkNewman]

Growth means no more customization as we’ve found, ..but I’m also finding small niche retailers are getting UL items on a shelf. ULA mostly but the other companies listed in this article (plus others like “Superior”) are a growing presence. Even Stretch vans of UL goodies will follow each hiking bubble on the big trails this year.

Still wishing for some additive customization though.

[USA Duane Hall]

Zpacks site shows a week wait, I received notification the next day that my new Duplex was shipped.  Interesting they have so many employees now.  Looking forward to packing with my new pup.  Will try to be pc this go round with a dog.

Duane

[jimmy b]

Duane, congrats on the new Duplex and if you get a chance post a few pics of your new trail buddy.

Loving my Zpacks Duplex. To me its quite custom even in its off the shelf configuration in comparison to most other offerings out there. I am also quite impressed to hear how many Joe is employing. That’s truly the story here if he keeps to the spirit of his original designs. Adding an ounce or so to a shelter can be considered acceptable IMO if it adds equal reliability. Also IMO as others have stated is the longevity factor. If he builds his business model to be around for the long run we will all benefit from having the products we have come to appreciate available for replacement…. if we are lucky enough to have enough trail time to wear out the originals.

[Scott Kilcoyne]

I ordered a Solplex last week because of this thread. It’ll be here today. My Duplex was lonely and wanted his little brother to come hang out.

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