What’s your winter tent?

If I am carrying the tent on my back it’s a BD Firstlight.    If I am using my pulk I use a NF VE25.   I know, this is BPL, but it’s a bomber 10 lb base camp tent that’s feels a lot like glamping and fits two 30″ wide pads.   For most of my winter trips it’s ski or snowshoe in and spent 2-3 nights in the same place with day trips skiing or snowshoeing.   I’d rather pull 50 than carry 30 lbs.

My previous winter tent was a Hilliberg that was about the same weight but needed a huge area flattened out in order to set up and lots of guying out.   Our dry powder makes it a bit more challenging and I like camp tasks to be as easy as possible in winter.

SOLO WINTER TENT-> Tarptent Moment DW, “solid” inner & Crossing pole shortened 6″ and run UNER the fly

2 PERSON WINTER TENT-> Tarptent Scarp 2, two X-ing poles shortened and run under the fly

I’ve used two tents this winter and have a third coming.

The two tents I’ve used are Hyperlite Ultamid2 and Big Agnes Copper Spur UL2.

BA Copper Spur worked great in light wind and no precip.

Ultamid 2 did stand up to a moderate storm below the tree line.  The draw back to the single wall tents is the condensation which is made worse by snow and ice collecting on the tent.  Also the snow loading made the tent smaller and smaller as the night progressed even thought it was guyed out pretty well.  Not having a tent floor also makes keeping everything dry much tougher.  Entering and exiting the tent will inadvertently lead to snow or mud getting kicked up.

I have a Hilleberg Saivo coming, and I can’t wait to camp in that palace.  I’m training for Denali so I don’t mind schlepping the extra weight.  Gonna have a taste of camping in an overkill shelter.

@philip-ak We’re very interested in hot tent camping; however, in SoCal most parks have regulations against having open fires.  So the only heat source will be our liquid fuel / canister stoves.  Need to drive out quite a bit to find places we can burn firewood in the back country.

Saivo is sweet looking tent! I am looking forward to hearing your thoughts on that and seeing it!

I’m training for Denali so I don’t mind schlepping the extra weight.

It’s funny, how people will look at you strangely for carrying a monstrous pack, fully loaded, up a very steep and long incline, sometimes repetitively, all the while appearing as if you enjoy it.

Sometimes when I expect wind and perhaps some snow, and am willing to carry the weight penalty, I carry a Hilleberg Atko but it can be kind of cramped inside. For below tree line camping, a Mid is very spacious and you can walk into it with your snow shoes or crampons on. (Just don’t step on the NeoAir.) And when battened down can be rather weather proof.

Another consideration in reference to a shelter, is whether when the weather is bad you want the option to cook inside the vestibule. A Mid comes with its own “vestibule.” Some of the lightest alpine assault tents have no vestibule.

Exactly how I have been operating for a long time. A mid since the’80s (Chouinard Pyramid) and a MLD TrailStar for the last 10 years. For the past 12 years a Scarp 1, which is very similar to the Hilleberg Atko.

I use a BD First Light if I am carrying it on my back.  If I am pulling it in a sled I typically take my NF VE-25.  It’s a beast but super comfy for long winter nights.

Depending on conditions, I have used a BD HiLite and a Zpacks Plexamid (had to get creative).  Someday I will try a mid but for the last few seasons the Locus Gear Djedi has been my haven.

Here’s my current decision calculus:

1. *Probably* not much wind forecast and camping below treeline, or definitely no wind and above treeline? Tarp and/or bivy.

2. Some wind forecast? A small pyramid.

3. Lots of wind or a severe storm below treeline? Locus Djedi.

4. Severe storm & above treeline? Hilleberg Soulo.

Haha, my “decision calculus” in winter ends up with similar choices but motivated by entirely different criteria. Instead of the severity of the weather forecast, it’s the severity of my laziness, i.e., ease of pitch and comfort in camp, that determines the choice, lolz.

Usually that’s either the Ruta Locura Lonepeak with a woodstove or the Locus Djedi. I’m just too lazy or unmotivated to do anything that might require the Soulo (for which I even have carbon fiber poles and scandium poles besides the alu alloy ones). I dream of severe winter storms above treeline, but just can’t actually get there for one reason or another. Now, if we’re talking severe storms, like typhoons, above treeline in summer, well, that’s a different story. Plenty of experience there.

I’m also full of admiration for the vigorousness of Ryan’s tarp choice. I’m so lazy that a tarp isn’t even on my list, which goes no further than the small pyramid level, if that.

Just curious: in Steve’s picture of the Djedi and the Soulo, only the Soulo is covered with snow. I would have expected the opposite, since snow sticks to DCF (Djedi) more than to silnylon (Soulo). Were they pitched at different times? Or is there some other reason?

@Jon – They were pitched at the same time.  The Soulo was a little closer to the cliff face and maybe had more spindrift and blowing snow.  But my assumption is that because the Djedi is made of a “breathable” material it may keep the surface of the tent a bit warmer.  The fact that I got out of the tent to take the picture some of the snow may have slid off too.  But just my initial thought.  I have never had a huge amount of snow build up on the exterior of the Djedi though.

Come to think of it, neither have I (had snow buildup on the Djedi). But I have had it plenty on the Lonepeak. The DCF used on these two shelters is very different, with the Lonepeak being the traditional mylar based DCF, while the Djedi uses a DCF with an eVent laminate.  Hmmm. I’ll have to pay more attention to the differences moving ahead.

Very spacious for a single person, I’d bring my Black Diamond Mega Light (and did, for a 2-person snow-camping trip in the Grand Canyon last week):

It sheds rain, snow and wind very well (it’s our go-to tent in the Aleutians).  On deep snow, you can dig out passages for standing-room heights, bunks, eating table, bookshelves, etc.  With poles and stakes it is 2.81 pounds.  If you’re assured of trees overhead (or can join two trekking poles), you could skip the carbon/aluminum pole.

@Jon – I never noticed it as well until you pointed it out!  These exact two tents will be in (hopefully!) well below zero temps with lots of snow in a couple weeks, we will definitely pay attention to this and I’ll try to bring back some more details and observations.

All I really remember was that it was down to -23F that night but the humidity was rather high, I was in a hurry to jump out and take care of some business and get back under my quilt as fast as possible at that moment. :)

“it was down to -23F that night but the humidity was rather high, I was in a hurry to jump out and take care of some business and get back under my quilt as fast as possible at that moment.”  = enter my pee bottle!!!

@Dirtbag – oh the pee bottle was in my tent…nothing like a nice poop with a view on a beautiful frosty morning!

Aahaaaa.. thats great yes!!

As requested by @dirtbaghiker, I’m giving my 2 cents on the Hilleberg Saivo. (I feel kinda naughty posting about a 11lb tent on the backpacking LIGHT forum ^_^)

We just used it during our attempt at Mt. Whitney.  It was definitely overkill for the conditions there–we were below the tree line and in non-storm conditions.  This tent is really designed for expeditions where you must be prepared for the most extreme weather.

The tent is heavy at 11+ lbs and requires a large clearing to pitch. We pitched it on what was the road leading down to Whitney Portal Campground.  Not only does it have a large footprint, it also requires even more area to be guyed out properly.  And yes we should use every single one of the 24 stakes if we want to make Bo Hilleberg proud.  Alternatively, we brought a set of 18 snow stakes for this trip as the included Y stakes won’t cut it in deep snow.

We used the front windward vestibule for our two packs and the rear, leeward one to cook.  The inside was spacious for 2 people.  The length was just enough for my 6’2 hiking buddy. His down hoodie and bottom of his quilt were touching the inner tent though.  We had our bear can, waters, and other items between the two sleeping pads and other personal items on the other sides. Each side has 6 pockets so it’s storage for days.

Besides the weight and space required, the  drawback to this dome tent design is that with the vestibules  open, snow and condensation will fall into the inner tent because of its sloping roof line as well as a slanted inner tent door.  We found that we had to hold the inner tent door up and knock off the frozen bits from the outer shell and top of tent to prevent ice / snow from falling in.  The trick we found was to open the inner tent door opposite the side of the outer tent door to compensate for dome geometry.

If I had to do it over again, I would most likely get the Kaitum 3 as a much lighter and spacious alternative to the Saivo for our SoCal winter trips.  The tunnel tents have vertical inner tent doors covered by a little bit of the outer tent lip.  They also offer more vertical space and less poles to put up.  I wouldn’t mind giving up some of the bombproofness for space, comfort, and less weight.  Nothing beats the geometry, aerodynamics, and stability of the dome shaped Saivo, though.

Interesting! Thankyou for posting that!

Wangle

I’m wondering if you consider the Nammatj 3 GT  when buying the Savio? I got to use a Nammatj in December and thought the livability/weight/pitching was pretty good for a winter (one season) tent. It had stove jack installed in the vestibule but we didn’t use it.

@bilbby Yes, I looked at all the Hilleberg options.  I eliminated the GT models because we don’t usually carry that much gear.  Before I tested out the Saivo, my first choice was the Keron 3 which gives the most space due to the vertical tent walls on both ends, two vestibules, and two doors. One person can be cooking and the other can enter and exit.  I would have considered the Nammatj 3 if my hiking partner wasn’t 6’2 and a comfort queen.  It would be a bit of a squeeze for him and he likes to be more independent, hence wanting the second door.  After owning a Hilleberg Black Label tent, I would say the Red Label tents are plenty strong for 95% of what I would be doing.  I could ride out a blizzard on the summit in my Black Label tent but do I really want to?

i’ve used a 10×10 tarp before, last year i picked up an alps tasmania at 7lbs for under $200, although heavy it’s pretty good. i’ve really been looking out for a TT Moment DW with solid interior and cross pole for winter would come in right around 2lbs 6oz or so…. you could probably get by with the mesh interior as well with the cross pole might be slightly colder

i’ve also heard plenty good things about the black diamond 1st light, but too pricey for the amount of winter (or lack of winter where i live) that i do.

The Suolo is obv a strong tent and very popular, but for me it is outperformed by the Unna for a number of reasons:

~ I’m too tall for the Suolo.

~ The dog will have to be in the vestibule.

~ The Suolo is heavier and smaller

The Unna’s old fashioned double pole dome design is very familiar and used all over the world’s mountains. Rab, BD, Locus, Slingfin, and untold numbers of other manufacturers use it.

The Hilleberg iteration is not much heavier than the burly single skin versions, but a lot more than the Firstlight and Djedi.

But at least on paper one of the few Unna competitors that possibly would provide enough length for me was the Rab Latok Mountain 2. Unfortunately the end door, vs side door plus small vestibule, compromises the inner when open in blizzard conditions. This makes it hard to melt snow with a liquid fuel stove without leaving the tent.

Having a double wall is also nice, both for livability and heat retention. And the small vestibule, while no contender to the Suolo’s, is better than most other dome tents with none at all. I can fit my pack, outer boots and still cook with the fly half way unzipped. If it really blows snow, I leave the outer zipped close, unclip a corner of the inner tent and pull it back; and now have a very large cook space.