Warm and Compressible Down Sleeping Bag

I would recommend enlightened equipment. Most people go with quilts from EE, but they also sell sleeping bags. These don’t have the mummy hood, however they are VERY well made, pack down more, and much lighter than a typical sleeping bag. For the “hood” you can either purchase a down hood from them or just wear a hat.

What is your budget?

As you probably have realized, Women tend to sleep colder than men and because we have no standardized sleeping bag rating system in the US, bag manufactures can put whatever “rating” on a bag they want to.  Even reputable manufacturers label their unisex bags at “mens” ratings.

Europe has a standard, the EN 13537 standard.  This rating gives you a comparable standard against comparable bags.

The standard measures three temperature ratings:
Comfort (WOMENS)— the temperature at which a standard female can expect to sleep comfortably in a relaxed position.
Lower Limit —(MENS) the temperature at which a standard male can sleep for eight hours in a curled position without waking.
Extreme (IGNORE THIS)— the minimum temperature at which a standard female can remain for six hours without risk of death from hypothermia (though frostbite is still possible).
These ratings are taken assuming that the subject is using a sleeping pad, tent and is wearing one base layer of thermal underwear.
For the purpose of these measurements, a “standard man” is assumed to be 25 years old, with a height of 1.73 m and a weight of 73 kg; a “standard woman” is assumed to be 25 years old, with a height of 1.60 m and a weight of 60 kg.

You want to make sure you are looking at the Comfort (Women’s) rating.  These bags will have considerably more down than a man would need at that temperature rating.

Marmot doesn’t seem to list the EN Ratings or even down fill of the Phase 20 bag – I know they have EN tested them so they have the data, perhaps I just can’t find it.

I’ll use the REI Magma bags as an example:

The Women’s version of the Magma 15 Sleeping Bag for a 6′ size (just for an apples to apples comparison of weight and down fill to the men’s version) is 2lb 6oz and has 24.5oz of 850 down fill.  It has an EN Comfort (Women’s) rating of 17*F but a EN Lower Limit (Men’s) rating of 3*F. – Yes effectively this is a Men’s 0* bag!

To contrast the Men’s version is 1lb 15oz and has 15.9oz of 850 down fill.  It’s EN Comfort (Women’s) rating is 28*F and EN Lower Limit (Men’s) rating of 16*F.

Long story short if you get a bag for 20*F you either want to get a bag EN Comfort Rated to 20*F or if you are looking at unisex bags hat are not EN rated (say Western Mountaineering), then you would be looking at a Men’s ~0-5*F rating (with WM I would go with the Antelope perhaps with overfill).

You may also want to revisit your sleeping pad?  What are you using and what R-Value does it have?  If you have an inadequate sleeping pad, it can make you just as cold as an insufficient bag.

The Women’s Phase 20

Brad’s comment is pretty thorough, but I’ll add that many big-label U.S. bag manufacturers now test their bags to the European norm (EN) standard.  There was a big push for this a few years ago, and while not perfect it helps when comparing similar bags.

And I don’t know why Marmot is making the EN rating for the Phase so hard to find.  If you look at a picture of the bag, you can see the colored tag on the inside of the draft tube, and they state that it is EN-tested. If you are looking at the W’s version of this bag, the 20 degree temperature rating should be the W’s Comfort Rating i.e. fairly accurate.  But if you go with the men’s bag, the comfort rating for most women would be approximately 30 degrees, and  you would likely be getting a bag that is for a 6-footer.  It is also odd that Marmot’s website doesn’t state the length of the W’s Phase:  typically, a W’s regular fits up to 5’6″, while a W’s long fits up to 6′.  Perhaps I missed something.

Anyhow, this could be a really nice bag.  I have a W’s 15 degree Marmot Xenon and love it, have found the temperature rating to be spot on.    You might also look at the REI Magma 15 and Joule 21:  both are down (duck or goose) and are quite light and compressible.  You actually have many nice choices.

“I am tired of being cold.”

what kind of sleeping pad do you use?

Any conversation regarding “being cold” in a sleeping bag should also include a discussion about the sleeping pad being used, especially since all the major sleeping bag manufacturers establish their temperature rating based on a fairly descent amount of insulation underneath. (around R-5 if I recall).

what bag are you using currently?

do you have an idea how many degrees colder it needs to be?

everyone is different so absolute temperature rating is difficult but relative is easier to determine what you need

Well standards for testings were changed in 2001, 2005 and 2016. ISO adopted standards pretty much the same as the older EN standards. Roughly they require a base layer, socks, hood and R4 pad to be effectively tested.

As far as I know, an R4 is also needed for 20F to sleep fairly comfortably at 20F, but I would like more, being somewhat of a cold sleeper. I usually have a combination of a NightLite and NeoAir Xlite or around an R2.5 and an R 3.2 for a total of around R5.7. I usually also wear my down sweater and a hat/balaclava under an EE quilt. This is about the limit of the 20F quilt, though it is perfectly comfortable at that temp. I carry a down sweater because it weighs 12oz and doubles as evening/morning warmth, lets me make a midnight trip without fumbling around for a jacket, as well as a little extra insulation at night. The quilt doesn’t have a hood, hence needs a hat. The NightLite pad doubles as a sit pad while hiking and as a camp chair leaned against a tree or log. At 20F, this is the limit for me with any quilt, it has too many drafts, even though I use a wide width. I prefer a 0F bag for lower temps. At any rate there is little weight difference between a quilt (20oz), hat(3oz), and extra pad (6oz) vs a sleeping bag. I prefer the warmer pad for other reasons, but a sleeping bag supplies an R1 or so, making the entire bag/sleeping pad good to 20F at R4.2.

Anyway, the Marmot looks like a good bag, likely good enough for the AT in Baxter in late spring/summer/early fall. Make sure you get a womans model. A lot of complaints about the small zipper/snags but you can get used to using them.

WM makes the Alpinelite that is a little wider for around 2oz more. FF also has the Egret 20 YF in a woman’s size. Both companies can be tasked with a couple ounces of overfill making them closer to a 15F rating. All within a couple ounces 1#13. Both are a bit wider, I think. I really cannot find the width on the Marmot site, but I know the old ones had the stretch sewn baffles. These let it expand pretty well, but you loose a bit of insulation when you do that. They allow a jacket easily, though.

Nancy, I highly recommend LL Bean down bags. They are high quality (I have their -20 F. bag) and use a DWR (Durable Water Repellant) called Down Tek on their down. This DWR helps the down absorb 30% less moisture than untreated down and dry 60% faster. There ae several DWR brand out there and all perform about the same.

Also Bean’s down bags are a very good deal for the money, with free shipping and the excellent LL Bean guarantee.

Try to find an air mattress or self-inflating mattress that has at least a 3.5 R value if you sleep cold in 3 season weather. I like REI’s FLASH Insulated 3 season air mattress (15 oz.) with the Sea to Summit compatible inflator/dry bag. Don’t inflate with your mouth – ever. Ruins the insulating value and puts bacteria into the mattress which becomes moldy.  But you likely already know that.