PFC bans are set to change the face of all waterproof garments

ahhhh… I see this is redundant with the thread https://backpackinglight.com/forums/topic/what-rain-gear-are-you-guys-using-these-days/page/2/

a link to a slightly different article in cyclingnews

The people who make our clothes and the people who work in retailers like REI, they shouldn’t have to be exposed to so many experimental chemicals in their jobs. It really makes me sad that most of the attention is put on the effects to consumers and the environment, but rarely do I see any concern for the people handling this stuff daily for work. Does a sewing machine allow said chemicals to become airborne? Sewing machines are violent things on a small scale.

I think they need to be looking more into the physical structures of the fabrics and how they are applied, than on the chemical-level.

I’ve personally created a type of fabric system that is waterproof-enough and totally breathable in all conditions, if somehow wetted out, becomes unwetted out in less than 1 mile of hiking. And extremely UL. I’ve been using my first prototype upper for years now.

I’m just some schmuck who knows little of fabric technology. LOL

One of the major fabric makers could easily do what I am doing and do it vastly better.

I am certain there are many avenues left unexplored for breathable rainwear that are minimally impactful.

ahhh… chaff is back : )

yeah, I agree, workers shouldn’t be subjected to dangerous chemicals.  Or the environment.  I totally support the move away from PFOA.

What’s your waterproof system?

I think it is difficult to find a system that’s waterproof and breathable.  And non toxic.

Also curious. Multiple breathable layers of varying thickness/density?

Good to see these steps being taken. Maybe flame retardant will be next.

same article posted on 12/4, but it does need its own thread.

https://backpackinglight.com/forums/topic/what-rain-gear-are-you-guys-using-these-days/page/2/#post-3766840

Any examples of this for rain gear?

Will it change the face of my plastic emergency poncho?

I was really looking at the ShakeDry stuff for my bikepacking kit.  I’m sure I could use my helium shell, but I can appreciate the extra protection while riding versus hiking.  I wish there was a place to try them on locally.  If I thought something similar was around the corner I would wait.

if you want shakedry, according to that article, you better buy it quick before supplies run out

My system uses mini shingles, in a way, like roofing. That’s a gross oversimplification, but I am still in the process of seeing how I can make it into a product I can sell, at which point, anyone can make their own. I even plan on having instructions on how to make your own, on the same page as selling them.

Not only did I find a way to do this, I also found a way to make it near-ZERO waste on my end of construction. Only a tiny amount of dust and fibers are created from cutting.

I’m still pretty baffled by how I managed to stumble on a pretty much game-changing system, design. I do spend a lot of time bushwhacking, around 3-4 days a week, so I wanted a system that can go from total submersion swimming across a swamp or stream, to virtually dry and warm in less than a mile of hiking. With no intervention other than just keep walking. I was out last week walking through water up to my chest in 34* F weather, with near full humidity and rain/snow. It was like putting in a video game cheat code. LOL

The top and bottoms together weigh less than 9 ounces for XL.

Also, the airflow rate can be adjusted on the fly from close to full open and windy to completely sealed from wind and rain. But at the same time, the resistance to rain/water intrusion remains very high even when wide open for max airflow. Like really max airflow, close to alpha direct in CFM.

YoPawn,

Are you just messing with us?

Get this to market ASAP so you can start enjoying retirement. Sounds impressive if you can deliver on even half of what you describe. I keep waiting for a “just kidding” but it is a little late for April Fool’s Day.

Good luck.

What you describe should be patentable . The army — of every country — would be a customer.  Licensing would pay the bills while providing you the opportunity to pursue other interests. Maybe you could hike and bushwhack rather than manage a business and sell product 80-100 hours a week.

I didn’t invent any fabric. That’s the stupid funny thing about what I discovered. In fact, many people on this forum already own the product I made, but mine has critical parts removed. Once I show what I made, you can make your own in a couple minutes using a pair of scissors.

I’ve taken an already widely-available fabric and just used it in such a silly way, that I think a lot of people are going to feel stupid for never seeing the potential literally right on their own bodies.

What I discovered is more of a complete paradigm shift in how we approach clothing systems and layering, than any sort of magic fabric.

The magic fabric has already been around for years, and widely used. All the real magic has been done for me.

I’m just the guy who learned to wield this magic. ;)

What you are claiming is novelty in use through invention; and, therefore, the concept is patentable in principle. Claiming the invention’s usefulness here is a curious alternative to seeking advice from a patent attorney. Producing an easy to replicate and useful new product without having patented it first is a fast way to lose any cash invested.

I would be a patent troll, to be 100% honest.

I’ve written/prosecuted my own patents, so not like I’m not familiar with that area. :)

LOTS of people are going to think I’m pranking them when I reveal this “magic” fabric that costs less than $15 a linear yard.

It’s also not something that can be used by the general public. It requires some special attention in some areas that eliminates 80+% of the population from seeing this as a viable way to dress.

The novelty will come from those big companies who can turn this into a product that can be sold to the masses without the compromises imposed by my system.

Also, a patent means nothing, at all, unless you have lots of money to start with. I would get eaten alive in litigation expenses.

I also don’t have the physical ability or capital to start a big enough company right off the bat.

Even though it would be nice, I’m fully expecting to never get any sort of monetary reward for this work or discovery.

Heck, I don’t even have my own house to even work in. I have to make all of my stuff on the floor of someone’s bathroom, and on their washer and dryer.

What’s most likely to happen, is that in a few weeks, I will just post an article on my website showing off this new system and spread the word out everywhere I can. I could put a link for donations on my site, but I’ve done that before and in my experience, nobody ever gives money on the internet, no matter how useful your service is. I’m sure BPL owners know that all too well. ;)

What YoPawn has described could well work under certain circumstances – like zero wind or low wind. Once the 100% waterproof ‘shingles’ start flapping it might be a different matter. Yes it could work for backpacking, and yes it could breathe very well.

Back in the days of horse carriages drivers often wore multi-layer capes in the rain. You had to be rich to be able to afford a 6-layer cape. But the idea did work, and the very rich SET the fashion trends in those days (or did not care what the plebs thought). For reference, try Regency novels like those by Georgette Heyer.

Where the concept ‘fails’ (and the word has to be taken in context) is in consumer acceptance. I imagine a lot of us backpackers might be willing to give it a go, but ‘backpackers’ are a very small market. Nearly all clothing mfrs rely mainly (99%?) on sales to the general consumer, the tourists, the yuppies, the trendies and the fashion field. I have some doubts that the concept would be accepted there. Us poor guys are just not worth worrying about.

Cottage industry? Maybe.

Cheers

If you take an uncoated, uncalendered and pretty breathable nylon or preferably polyester fabric, and put a somewhat light coating of silicone on it (via silicone caulk thinned in naphtha), then put a non woven polypropylene* semi breathable fabric under that, and then something like Monolite under that, and sew it all together at the edges, you get a pretty lightweight, durable, and effective WPB composite that is more truly breathable than most stuff out there.   Taking it a step further, then you make a poncho out of this combo, it is extremely breathable.

The trick or “secret” is two, nearly permanent DWR and truly breathable layers of fabric together. The first layer of DWR fabric absorbs most of the energy of the rain, and whatever gets through that, won’t get through the next layer of DWR fabric.  The Monolite is just an extremely breathable layer that protects the center/inner layer from body oils, abrasion, snagging, etc. and allows that inner center layer to heat up quickly with body heat to drive out any liquid moisture on the surface of same (because heavier rain will invariably get through that first layer of siliconized fabric).

As long as these fabric layers are sewn together as panels, they don’t really need to be bonded to one another–that’s just another way of decreasing the overall breathability.  You will need to treat any sewn areas with a thicker silicone though–sort of like seam sealing a silnylon tent.

This is fairly easy to MYOG if you can sew.  I’ve tested similar combos and it works well (the above would work even better than what I originally made and lost awhile back).

* Note, I prefer polypropylene over polyethylene for this inner/center layer because PP is significantly less thermally conductive than PE and thus condensation is less likely to form on the inside of the fabric. Its also harder to find more breathable PE nonwoven fabrics–the various tyveks are not that breathable.  Meanwhile, there are various nonwoven PP fabrics out there that range in breathability and usually more breathable than tyveks.