MYOG Tramplite/Deschute Inner Debate

[Hoosier T]

I live in the buggy Midwest. Ticks are very prevalent so bug protection is needed for a good part of the year. I just finished the tarp and I’m having a really tough time deciding what to do. Considering trying a bug bivy but I’ll literally have to use it for 6-8 months out of the year. That being said, should I just skip it and turn this thing into a single wall palace? Easier to set up, palatial bug free space, and still very light weight. It’s probably between those two I suppose. A serenity net tent would work but I lose a lot of space, add weight, and all just so I can use the tarp without an inner for a few months when it’s not buggy. Please let me know your thoughts. I have a bit of time and money in this and want to get it right.

[bjc]

You have listed all the benefits of a one piece SW shelter. I have tried both types and came to realize that for me the SW larger space is what I prefer. I found that the flexibility of a component based shelter just wasn’t as useful as the interior volume of a SW. I must admit I also did not like the fiddle factor of a component system.  It cost me too much money to find out my preference. I suspect if I was doing my hiking in certain environs it would lesson my need for an enclosed SW shelter, but having one shelter that I can quickly set up and use most of the time and keep the bugs out is what works for me. Confession: I keep going back to my Lunar Solo after trying bug bivvies, inserts, etc. with a tarp.  26 oz. in the sack with stakes, used all over Colorado, the AT, and the Adirondacks.  A cuben version might be nice!! Packed volume of the cuben might be an issue though. ;)

[Greg Deitrick]

My reason for going modular was my wet and dirty dogs.  Otherwise the Zpacks style SW tents looked like the way to go.  The MLD site mentions partial mesh flooring sometimes having problems getting frozen into the snow.  So if you aren’t taking messy dogs or camping in serious snow I would try the fully enclosed SW tent route.

[Hoosier T]

Thanks guys. I think I really wanted to make this SW from the start. I was just having doubts and once I got it done and sat under it, I was in love with the amount of unobstructed space. I’m truly envious of the folks who live/hike in fairly bug-free places and just throw a piece of polycro under a huge tarp and stretch out with all their stuff laying everywhere. I wouldn’t even have to try to stay organized under my tent! But, it should still be roomy. The design permits a rectangular bathtub floor of 42×90″ so enormous for a single person and well under 20oz (projecting ~17oz). Although the Zpacks method looks tricky to get it right on my first go. I’ll probably just do a suspended floor like the SMD Lunar by sewing the mesh to some cuben and slapping it up with tape. The vertical mesh in my YMG  Cirriform didn’t cause any issues with condensation running down to the floor.

@bj-clark-2-2 has this ever been an issue for you with the mesh being vertical and suspending the floor? As far as condensation running down the fly then the mesh and onto the floor?

[bjc]

Never had a problem with condensation ending up on the floor as a result of the vertical mesh. I even tend to pitch the tent a couple of inches higher when weather is nice which raises the mesh even a little straighter.

[Hoosier T]

This is only my second pitch so it’s not perfect. I have the mid panel tie outs made but haven’t put them on yet. Overall happy with the results.

[Hoosier T]

It is all 1/2″ taped seams and taped patches of 1.43 cuben for the reinforcements.

[jimmyjam]

Hey Hoosier, nice work on the tarp!

[Justin Baker]

I have been going through a similar debate. I figure that a single wall shelter with integrated bug netting and an integrated floor is not going to be much heavier than a floorless shelter with a separate ground sheet. The netting used is minimal, specifically I am planning on getting a six moons designs lunar solo. A separate inner has a lot of wasted mesh and material. I am not interested in trying a netting floor because of freezing issues.

The question you need to ask yourself is if you want to be able to leave the door open and retain bug protection, which would be more weight, or if you want to do more of a perimeter netting thing.

I don’t deal with bugs nearly as much as you. The times I deal with mosquitoes are a couple months out of the year in the high sierras. At the lower elevation places I camp, I rarely deal with mosquitoes.  Our wet season is also our cold season and late spring through late fall is very dry. I am also in a much better position to tolerate mosquitoes without protection because I get no reaction to mosquito bites, I can let them bite me without worry. All of that being said, I think that integrated mesh makes more sense for me even though I often won’t need it, rather than carrying a separate inner when needed which is very heavy.

I also own a duomid which I could sell, but I strongly prefer floorless (non bathtub) shelters for moisture manage in cold/wet enviroments, and I also like the larger size for relaxing in extended bad weather. So I may just keep my duomid in addition to the lunar solo.

[d k]

Beautiful job, Hoosier!  That looks really great.

I am pretty sold on SW shelters.  If you wanted to make it floorless, you could just have walls of netting suspended from the tarp, and lift the big front wall to enter/exit, or tie it up when not needed.  But then you have to fuss with a separate floor, or suspend it clipped to the corners, or something like that.

[Lydia K]

That is a fantastic looking tarp!

[Ryan Smith]

Well done Hoosier!

[Hoosier T]

I got my door tie backs and mid panels tie outs put on and I’m really happy with the results. The mid panel tie outs do help out a lot with interior space for your head and feet and because the tarp pitches fairly taught without them, they don’t seem to distort the pitch so I’m really pleased. I’m just using a blake’s hitch for those (thanks Eric Chan). I added some photos of the tie out detail as well. Anything that is sewn is sewn to the patch of 1.43 THEN taped on. There is not a single hole in the canopy. All main tie outs have no stitching, just taped 1/2″ tie outs with reinforcement patched taped over for extra friction, like Leshy. The zipper has a 1/2″ piece of cuben sewn on both sides of the zipper tape then is taped into the tarp.

[Hoosier T]

The dimensions from the pole back, not including front peak/vestibule are 100″ W x 60″D. It’s massive for one and could really be used for two if needed. I designed the tent itself around a 46″ height and planned for 4″ of gap all around so it pitches with a pole height of 50″. Plenty of head room.

[Hoosier T]

All main guylines are 2mm Lawson’s orange

[Jerry Adams]

That’s a good idea to angle out the rear rather than making it straight.

Mine is straight, and if it’s wet and windy there’s a little rain that gets in there

Next time I’ll angle it

[Hoosier T]

Yea and it’s just six triangles and each one can be flipped (inverse) on the fabric roll so that it consumes minimal materials. This took about 5.5 linear yards.

[R]

That looks fantastic – nice work!  What’s the final weight?

Have you considered a detachable floor?  .5″ velcro weighs .23oz/yd.  #3 separating zipper weighs .36oz/yd. I think you’ve got around 9yds of separable perimeter so you’re looking at 2oz – 3oz.

Zpacks style perimeter mesh doesn’t see any tension.  The velcro would be loaded in shear, so I think it would be adequately strong.

 

[Hoosier T]

What’s the final weight?

Well…That’s the less glorious part. I could have saved a little weight since it’s a little overbuilt with heavy reinforcements and a #5 zipper. I also need to trim the guylines to almost half as they’re too long. But, currently in the sack with guylines it’s 12.6oz. Not Hexamid light but it’ll do.

 

 

[Jerry Adams]

I’ve tried #3 zipper but it seems too light for a tent zipper that takes quite a bit of load.  After a couple years it failed – the zipper was open on both sides of the pull, wouldn’t close.  Replaced with #5.

12.6 oz is pretty good for a tent that will give good storm coverage

[Hoosier T]

Jeez, now I see why Zpacks connects the floor the way they do in the plex tents. I’ve been measuring trying to plan the mesh connecting the floor to the tarp in a floating style like the lunar duo, it’s proving to be super challenging to plan. Not sure I want to take the chance on taping in a floor/net that turns out crappy and ruins a good tarp. Choices…

[Hoosier T]

Stripped the guylines to trim them. It’s 10.7oz without lines. 11.9oz with proper length guylines.

[Hoosier T]

@jenmitol, are you wanting to make it in cuben? I think it makes it way easier to put in a floating floor since all I’ll have to do is sewn the top of the noseeum to a 1″ strip of cuben, throw some tape on it then slap it on. When measuring for the floor, I realized that, due to the angles of the rear wall, a rectangular floor was proving too difficult since the mesh would need perfect angles. I decided to make the floor hexagonal. I made the floor up last night. The ends are 36″ and the center is 44″ (total fabric width – 6″ bathtub – 1″ seam allowances) and the total length is 88″. This avoids any seams on the floor. I’m using Silpoly PU4000 (1.4oz) for the floor (the stuff is seriously awesome and I won’t need a groundsheet). I make my own cuben tape so it’s cheap so I used that to tape the corner seams of the tub. The tape used for cuben works REALLY well for PU coatings. Wouldn’t trust it to hold a tarp together, but trust it to stay put for sealing a seam. The floor is 5.65 oz as is with taped corners. I’ll roll the mesh into the rolled hem all the way around the perimeter of the bathtub then tape the other end to the tarp. I will be taking final measurements later today and cutting the mesh. It should come together pretty quickly after that. Lastly, the door will be vertical, sewn to the front/top of the bathub then taped along the front seam of the tarp all the way to the peak. It will have a rainbow zipper. Basically identical construction to the door from a ‘Plex tent. Except, the bottom 12″ of the door will have 7D robic (RSBTR) for a little added splash protection and privacy when the tarp door is open. Then mesh the rest of the way up.

[Hoosier T]

Well, I decided on single wall. Got it done and tested it out last night. I love it. Tons of room for sure. The ends of the floor are 36″ and the center is 44″. The photos below show a pitch with a pole height and rear pitched higher than I designed but I wanted to test it this way for a night. Because of this, I lost a little but of width in the center of the floor. You can see where the bathtub is lifted up a bunch in the rear. At a normal pitch height, it would be uniform with the rest, 6″. Great ventilation, not a drop of condensation last night. The bottom of the door is Dark Olive Robic 7D from RSBTR. I wanted this for wind blocking, privacy, and splash protection. And the dark olive goes nicely with the green cuben :).

[Hoosier T]

It’s all taped in, btw. Everything is sewn to a 1″ strip of 1.43 cuben then I put double sided tape on the strips and threw them in. The taping held up wonderfully last night so I have no concerns with it.

[Author]

Posts