ISO raincoat

Is this an endless quest?

Seems like it. Part of the problem is that there are many kinds of rain, and different solutions work better for some types than others.

Light rain in warm weather? I like a good wind garment for that.

Moderate-to-heavy rain in warm weather? Poncho for me.

Warm and little or no wind? Umbrella.

Storm weather in otherwise low humidity? People who like WPBs seem to most often report good results in that kind of weather.

Stormy and cold? Sleeves for sure. Maybe Packa or a jacket like your Precip.

FWIW, Precip got pretty good scores in Stephen Seeber’s MVTR article (see Table 2).

The only WPBs that seem to actually work well in all conditions are ShakeDry, Outdry, and maybe Frogg Toggs UL. That’s the membrane-on-the-outside tech. Maybe Columbia’s new-ish Outdry Extreme Mesh? There have been some good reports on that and similar Outdry variants. ShakeDry if you can still find it in your size, like the price, and don’t mind a short life in exchange for best-available WPB performance.

Or just give up and get a Versalite, like Ryan. He’s tried pretty much everything.

Since you have the Packa, it seems worthwhile to give that a good test. It is a worthy design. Closest thing to a custom Caffin that you can buy. Maybe clip up the bottom if it is too long?

LHG in light, cold, rain: Seems like probably sweat and condensation making you wet? I mean, the fabric itself should be entirely waterproof. Does it keep you dry in the shower?

My experience is that air movement under the garment really helps a lot. Various vents and zips help with that, as does a blousy, oversized fit. Poncho is even better. Poncho with a full-length front zipper is my personal favorite.

EDIT: When the weather is unknown and I want to be prepared for whatever Mother Nature throws at me, I pack a wind shell, front-zippered poncho, and Frogg Toggs jacket. The combo weighs between one and two pounds, depending on which shell I pick. (My heaviest soft shell performs significantly better than the light windshirts).

For what it’s worth, I don’t think “waterproof” is possible. If it is, it involves very careful management of your physical exertion, the material of your gear, and ventilation. I just don’t have the patience for that when I’m hiking.

So, I think of it as a choice between “warm and damp/wet”, and “cold and damp/wet”. I strive for the former. I use an Arc’Teryx Zeta with appropriate undergarments, for most seasons. I have a heavier EVent shell for the cold. I always carry an umbrella. And I always default to no jacket/umbrella only, when it’s warm enough (very subjective), because I’d rather be wet that way than stewing in my own juices.

Just my $0.03 .

I tend to use more stripped-down gear for backpacking (e.g. w/o pockets or pit-zips), but I really like the Precip for around town and day-hikes. If it worked well for you in practice, that’s a major positive, and it seems like a good idea to give it another try. I don’t know how much wear you got out of it before it delaminated, but maybe you just had bad luck? It has been a popular choice for decades and you can often find them on sale.

FWIW, I tend to agree with Victor that it’s very difficult to be perfectly dry and comfortable when hiking strenuously in very wet conditions. As long as I’m not totally miserable, I generally count it as a win.

I know I’ve sounded like a Packa ambassador over the years, but if you’re worried about not being able to see your feet while wearing it, fashion yourself a “belt” using a piece of elastic and a mini-biner.  That will keep it from flopping around so much in the wind.  I really like how it comes down and covers my bum and upper thighs, but I can understand how it could feel disconcerting if you’re on terrain where you need to watch each step.  You also don’t have to worry about your pack straps rubbing because they’re under the Packa.  At least give it a try since you already have one.

Agree with Kevin.  It may turn out that the Packa is not for you, but suggest giving it more than just a try…give it multiple opportunities to showcase its strengths and weaknesses.  It may surprise you…or not :)

The Packa is the dorkiest solution possible but wonderful. I carry mine in conditions where I am expecting rain and have always been very pleased with its performance. My favorite feature is that sits above the should straps and allows so much airflow. Also wonderful is the ability to don/doff while walking and just leaving it on your pack. I’ve also worn it over my pack with just the hood on after the rain when trees are dripping vertically.

I would love to have a version of it with slightly less comical proportions and 20% less fabric. I know I wouldn’t want it to be tight because airflow is good. The Caffin guy has some kind of poncho design that looks pretty good too.

I think there is a market opportunity here for something like a Packa and Mountain Poncho. I’d like mine in a thin waterproof silnylon/silpoly with taped seams please.

Edit: I will add that while I feel like the Packa would be a tripping/vision hazard that has never turned out to be a valid concern in use for me.

I would love to have a version of it with slightly less comical proportions and 20% less fabric. …
I think there is a market opportunity here for something like a Packa and Mountain Poncho.

Would you change anything else?

If you just want a smaller Packa, then maybe discuss with Eddie Hinnant?

I think we’ve all been scratching our heads over this for a long time.  Like sleep systems, rain kits divide into warm weather optimized, and cold weather optimized.

Warm: DWR wind shirt in light/short rain, + umbrella for harder/longer rain with an emergency poncho back up.

Cold: poncho when you need venting (lots of uphill).  I found most are too short exposing my sides.  S2S ultrasil poncho tarp seems the lightest/longest but no vents/zips. Your packa is optimal here, air pump billowy, pit zips, front zip.  But heavy

+3FUL kilt if top is short.

Jackets seem like a lost cause.  The BD Stormline Stretch or Mountain Hardwear Stretch Ozonic user reports are favourable despite the MVTR specs, might be worth a look but you still have all the typical jacket shortcomings. LHG gets pretty middling review on the halfwayanywhere PCT gear surveys and reports of fast wet outs (eg)

Someone make a well thought out backpacking rain top and we’ll be lining up cash in hand!

For what it’s worth, I don’t think “waterproof” is possible. If it is, it involves very careful management of your physical exertion, the material of your gear, and ventilation. I just don’t have the patience for that when I’m hiking.

Waterproof is absolutely possible, Guaranteed To Keep you DRY, that is impossible! Gore did the world a total disservice with that adage years ago.

It is totally possible for a garment to be waterproof, as in, not let water in. I know I sound like I’m being factious but I’m not. It’s more to do with ones own expectations.