How good is the MSR WindBurner in the wind?

Good testing.

I think that shows PRDeluxe and windmaster require a wind screen.  I have both of those and have reached the same conclusion.

Maybe there’s still value to the wind resistance of the burner cup.  Maybe it stays lit until you put the pot and windscreen on it.  It doesn’t cost much so probably not important – negligible weight increase.

The surprising this to me is that the Soto WindMaster is so much better than the Pocket Rocket Deluxe.  People assume that MSR copied the Soto WindMaster and if so, they missed a few important features.  On a side not, the funny thing is that Hikin’ Jim and I were just discussing this yesterday.

I truly appreciate this Jon, I’m in the market for a wind resistant canister setup. This answers what I need to know.

I actually purchased a WindBurner a few years ago and returned it after a home test. Coming from using cat can stoves and an old Snowpeak Gigapower, it just felt to clunky and complicated. But since then I’ve come back around to feeling there might be real utility in it…especially as I’ve been using stoves at the beach a lot.

The MSR WindBurner is really an odd duck stove.  It took a little while to get use to the whole REACTOR operation, the glow wire helps.  Being able to “try” to set the flame levels is going to take some practice.  It is unfortunate that due to the design of the REACTOR system, they can’t implement an auto-ignition system.  This is pretty important in windy environments.  For my wind tunnel testing, I have to have the fans off to light the stove, quickly place the mug and turn the valve to the right level before I can turn on the fans.

I use a re-purposed titanium windscreen from an old twig burning style stove (I’ve forgotten the brand!) on a Pocket Rocket. It comes well up on the pot. I cook solo, so the boil time is quick. The canister has never become warm, much less hot. It works great in wind. And in a pinch, I could this on its own, coupled with tent stakes in the upper slots to make a free standing twig stove for boiling water.

Mostly out of curiousity, I put together “on paper” a couple of cook kits comparable to the MSR’s Wind Burner Personal Stove System, using manufacturer specs and list prices where possible.

MSR WindBurner Personal Stove System, from msrgear.com
Includes stove, 1 liter pot, canister stand, 16 oz plastic cup
430 grams
$170

Option 1: MSR PR Deluxe, DIY windscreen, Toaks pot and cup
MSR Pocket Rocket Deluxe
Reynolds Turkey Roasting Pan, DIY three-sided windscreen
Toaks Titanium 1100ml pot
MSR Universal Canister Stand
Toaks Titanium 450ml Cup
385 grams
$168

Pros and Cons
45 grams (1.6 ounces) lighter
Comparable price
Easier to light in the wind
Integrated piezo igniter
More flexibility on pot size, potentially saving more weight
Maybe similar performance in wind

Option 2: MSR PR Deluxe, DIY windscreen, MSR pot and cup
MSR Pocket Rocket Deluxe
Reynolds Turkey Roasting Pan, DIY three-sided windscreen
MSR WindBurner Personal Accessory Pot 1 liter
MSR Universal Canister Stand
420 grams
$175

Pros and Cons
10 grams (0.4 ounces) lighter
Comparable price
Easier to light in the wind
Integrated piezo igniter
More flexibility on pot size, potentially saving more weight
Maybe similar performance in wind
Same pot and cup as WindBurner, but don’t know if pot works with the PR Deluxe

Many variations with tradeoffs on weight, price, and wind-resistance.

— Rex

For the sake of comparison on the UL side of things, this 116 gram/4.1 oz rig uses the BRS 3000T, holds 0.8 L, and boiled 500 ml of 68* F/20* C in (1) calm conditions 5:08 minutes using 5.8 grams of fuel, and (2) in 8 mph wind 5:00 minutes using 12.9 grams of fuel. Not as fast or efficient as the Windburner, but almost 12 oz lighter and more than $100 cheaper.

I am very close to production and sale of a similar system of windscreen and base plate designed around the BRS and sized for popular 500-750 ml Ti and aluminum mugs like Toaks, SnoPeak, Imusa. In Ti the windscreen and base plate by themselves weigh 1.5 oz. Aiming for $35 in SS and $50 in Ti.

Next will be a system designed around the Soto Windmaster, which should have even better performance.

Ooooo!  David, if you can improve on the Windmaster’s performance you likely have a client right here.  I love the Windmaster with the 3-prong spring steel pot support.  Never had a problem finding a spot out of the wind, but a simple retrofit that improves performance would be very tempting.  I also favor short wide pots as they are most efficient for heating water.  I use this one with the Windmaster.

Jon…..What would the Pocket Rocket Deluxe with your Ocelot: Pocket Rocket 2 & PocketRocket Deluxe System look like if compared to Soto WindMaster  and  Jetboil Stash Cooking System  in a 8mph wind?

@Ken Larson  Generally speaking, at 8 mph the Ocelot systems will allow you to boil water and the fuel consumption about doubles.  So in calm conditions if you need 6 grams of fuel, it would increase to 10-12 grams.

The Stash by  itself really doesn’t work above 4 mph.  In fact, in long term use you would probably melt off the bottom of teh heat exchanger housing.

The Soto Windmaster is a fantastic stove.  One thing to note is that the burner to bottom of teh pot distance is only 0.23″.  As a reference, the Pocket Rocket Deluxe is 0.35″.  IMO, that small gap really helps the Soto WindMaster function well in the wind.  At 8 mph, the fuel consumption is highly variable.  I have only tested this a few times with the Soto Windmaster and saw consumption rates from the high teens to the mid 20’s.  I am just impressed that it works at all.  Does that answer your question?

I’ve used my soto windmaster a lot and this defect developed:

I

It never failed though.  I just switched to the 4 armed pot support.  This is a design defect, in my opinion, for the pot support to attach to burner where there is maximum flame and the metal turns red hot and eventually corrodes.

I still use it.  I think maybe the micro spot where the support sits on the burner edge, is actually cooled enough by the burner edge so it won’t fail.

@Jon….. Sure does.  With a EVERNEW 750ml on a trip in 2020 using the Ocelot Systems I use 6.6g in a CALM Conditions even though we were on a island in Lake Michigan (North Manitou).

Jerry Adams – I likely have hundreds of burns on my Windmaster since new in March 2014 and it doesn’t look anything like yours.  Granted, my avg burn time is ~1.75 minutes to boil 10 oz of water with a wide pot.  I have seen the “ears” (that have deteriorated on yours) glow red, but I have not seen any negative effect.

Thanks for this Jon! Your really empowering people to make informed purchasing decisions here. I wish just a small fraction of the very popular mainstream youtube gear reviewers had an approach as quantitative as you do.

Quality of YouTube info depends on the whether the poster intends to honestly review a product, or to grow the channel in order to generate income.  Probably possible to do both but…

Yeah, I have toyed with the idea of becoming a gear “influencer” because I could probably make more money there than trying to run a cottage business.  I wouldn’t be nearly as fun though.

You would be very good at it though! Your chasamatic, articulate, and most of all, your very thorough, quantitative, and objective in your approach to gear evaluation! Not to mention, your good looks/personality will probably help you out too ;) You have a very likable, trusting, and relaxing demeanor.

I digress… if you ever did take a serious whack at it, I think the UL community would have some truly awesome content to look forward to.

Interesting jch

Maybe I’ve used mine more or run it lower or higher

This is still my favorite stove and it hasn’t failed

Probably good to look at it occasionally just to be careful

Jerry – When/where did you purchase your Windmaster?  I bought mine in March of 2014 from Basegear.com, which appears to no longer exist.

Perhaps our 3-prong stands are different material from different production runs?

I got mine in 2013.

It was given to me by the sales rep for Soto, to test for backpackgeartest.org

It’s possible they got an atypical batch for some reason, but I’d think they would want the best for someone that’s posting a test report publicly

Only thru tests and failures will we ever truly progress..

David Gardner – Lemme know if you devise a windbreak for the Soto. Upgrading from the BRS, I’ve used it 80+ days, always lights fast, holds up great in mean wind. But I’d be happy to cut down the fuel consumption if possible. cheers!

Any windscreen would do.  There are threads with different wind screens

A Caldera Cone is good.  Or just a sheet of aluminum, rolled around to make most of a cylinder with a slot to get into the valve.  High enough to go mid way up the pot.

@mudjester: Will do. Ordered a Soto Windmaster and waiting for it to arrive.

While it’s true that any windscreen is better than no windscreen, some work better than others, are safer, lighter, and easier to use.

Jerry, as I’m sure you know but forgot to mention, and at the risk of being pedantic, the windscreens you mentioned are not safe to use with canister stoves. It is explosively dangerous to completely enclose a canister within a windscreen. A caldera cone that sits on the ground, completely surrounds the stove and canister, and goes mid way up the pot is a BOMB waiting to certainly happen. On the other hand, if the cone/cylinder is about 1/4 – 1/2 open it is probably OK, as long as one monitors the canister temperature to be sure it is not getting warm.