BRS 3000 deluxe?

[Jan Rezac]

It’s well known that the BRS 3000 stove does not perform well in wind. The flame gets blown away very easily. In the past, I made a nice windscreen for the stove and it helps a lot, but it is quite complex to set up and I don’t use it on short trips.

I wanted to try something with less fiddle factor. The design of more windproof stoves such as the soto windmaster or pocket rocket deluxe inspired me to try similar approach here. Both these stoves have a raised rim around the burner, and it brings the flame closer to the pot (I think this is more important than “shielding” the burner itself). I made similar windscreen for the BRS burner, for now just a prototype out of a piece of sheet metal cut from a tin can (weights 1.5 grams and is sturdy enough). It looks like this:

I tried also a conical version (on the right) but it does not work so well.

A first simple test suggests that it works. Under controlled conditions (indoors, with a fan providing steady breeze), it reduces the boil time significantly. I used a narrow pot (toaks 650) and without the mod, the flame gets blown away a lot. The stove was set on medium power, opening the valve more would result into too much flames escaping from below the pot. This is a realistic scenario in windy weather, using more power just wastes the fuel. The stove was running continuously, I just removed the tube while it was burning and replaced the pot.

At this (unknown) wind speed which felt more like a breeze than a wind, without the mod I was able to boil 250 ml of water only in 10 minutes. With the mod, it took 4:30. Nice improvement, but still nothing to rave about. Here’s the thing in action, it is clear that it helps:

This was just an experiment – I don’t know if it is safe for real use. Overheating is likely not an issue, the windshield doesn’t get red hot, and the pot supports stay even cooler. It would be really useful to measure the CO emissions of the stove without and with the mod, but I don’t have the equipment for that.

Also, the boil time is still rather long for such a tiny amount of water. It is probably better to use a more windproof stove than try to fix the BRS. I’ll test it against some more windproof stove in the future.

[Jerry Adams]

interesting hack.  The flame still looks blue which is good.  The BRS 3000 is so lightweight – it would be worth it making it work better

[Casey Bowden]

Very nice.

What is the diameter and height?

[Glen L]

Excellent mod. The fuel savings is very good. Doesn’t look like it will add much bulk or weight to your kit. If you find a relatively sheltered place to fire the stove this might be all that is needed for efficiency.

[David Gardner]

Whoa. Brilliant! So small and light, and minimal fiddle factor. I need to give this a try!

[jscott]

yeah. great mod! great design targeted at the problem area. does it restrict oxygen intake or create a build up of gasses? Probably not.

I use the outer portion of a Caldera Cone as a wind screen (as people are sick of hearing). It weighs about an ounce and can function on its own as a pot support for a wood chip fire underneath if things go wrong with my stove. Never happened, but…it’s an excellent wind screen! I cook solo so water boils quickly and the canister never gets hot with this method–altho I test it with my finger every time.

[Jan Rezac]

The dimensions are: internal diameter 18 mm (tight fit on the burner), height 16.5 mm.

The height is just a first guess. There’s 7 mm clearance between the tube and the pot and it works and doesn’t restrict the flame too much.

I may try to make the clearance even smaller to increase the velocity of the flame leaving the tube. Quick calculation shows that to keep the free cross-section the same as the surface area of the burner itself, the gap would be only 4.5 mm. Some margin should be added for the change of the direction of the flow which adds some pressure, but something like 5 or 6 mm may work.

[Jon Fong / Flat Cat Gear]

If you put a hole on the side and a flame comes out, the internal pressure may be too high.  That might help you to tune in the gap.  My 2 cents.

[Roger Caffin]

Now that is cute!
Cheers

[Jan Rezac]

I made a final version of the tube, now from a thin titanium sheet. Compared to the prototype, it is spot-welded and has tabs for attaching it to the burner. It works perfectly, an weights one gram.

And finally, it serves as a platform for adding a piezo igniter:

[Diane “Piper” Soini]

Wow! I just got one of these stoves. Do you think aluminum from a baking sheet or turkey roasting pan like they have at the grocery store would work? Or does it have to be something like a can of beans?

[Roger Caffin]

Aluminium melts at 660 C. A dull red in steel means it is over 700 C.
I have never seen aluminium actually glowing: it is always a small molten puddle before it gets that hot.
Steel and titanium will work OK.

Cheers

[David Gardner]

Awesome. This version has three little feet/legs that I don’t see on the original prototype. I assume they sit on the three pot supports inside the hinges? Does it create a space a the base of the tube for more air to get in, or does it seal tight to the burner?

[Jerry Adams]

looking at the photos, the pot support arms get red hot

the windscreen does not get red hot, so it’s not as hot

I bet aluminum would work.  It might start eroding with use, but that wouldn’t make that much difference.  At least for that trip.

with aluminum pie plate material, you could just fold it over itself to keep it in place, rather than spot welding.  Since it’s so thin, it would be more likely to erode from heat.

[DAN-Y]

It’s amazing how easy it is to make the pot support legs get red hot. No wonder they have a history of deforming while in use.

Hikin Jim’s photo

[Jan Rezac]

David,

The  tube sits on the pot supports, and the tabs extend below it and are bent around the edge. This holds the tube in place. The tube itself wraps the burner tight, there are no vents. The first version without these tabs was just pressed tightly onto the burner, and it held in place quite well too.

Jerry,

You’re right that the windshield tube doesn’t get red hot, at least in these pictures. If I remember, the upper edge had got red hot in some of the tests. The lower part never had. I won’t use aluminum there.

[Jon Fong / Flat Cat Gear]

What stove has pot support arms that don’t glow red in the wind?  I can’t name one. In the pictures below it may not show it but that is because the arms may not be directly down wind  but off to the side, I have seen this on basically every stove that I have tested in the wind.

This also one of the dangers of using an HX pot with the shroud of the HX assembly sitting directly on the pot support arm.  In high wind, the flame can been blown off the bottom of the pot to the point where it has melted section of the aluminum shrouding.  I have seen at least 1 of these cases.  My 2 cents.

[Roger Caffin]

I have attached 3 photos of damaged BRS3000-T stoves. They are not wonderful, but they are all I have. I hope they help.

The first one shows the ‘damaged arm’ on a BRS3000-T. You have to look closely to see where the damage is. It is not the pot support arm: that is intact. It is the bracket holding the pot support arm: it has twisted. Look at the blue line underneath. This cannot have been done by heat as the flames go nowhere near it.
The second shows what I think has happened. Force on the arm has bent the support as seen in the 1st photo.
My guess, and it is only a guess, is that a production batch of the stoves was made with the wrong alloy used for that support bracket. It was some soft alloy rather than a hard one like 6Al4V. Strong enough for a small pot with .5 L of water, but not for something heavier.

The third photo is a bit different. It shows the support bracket cracked at the bend, inside the red box. This suggests that a good alloy was used here, but the bend was done cold rather than hot. I have bent bits of 6Al4V alloy cold and had exactly the same effect. A production fault.

My impression is that the current production of BRS3000-T stoves has sorted out these problems. None of the ones I have bought for the V7 stove show any problems. Here’s hoping?

HTH
Cheers

[Diane “Piper” Soini]

The first time I used my Snow Peak Litemax stove the arms turned red. I was really afraid they would melt. They never did and I got used to it.

[DAN-Y]

Concerns from the internet:

We appreciate the sturdiness of the pot stabilizers. Once snapped into place, they form a platform more rigid than some of the more expensive stoves. While we wouldn’t want to make a habit of it, the BRS was plenty stable under our 1.7-quart test kettle, even when it was holding a liter of water. We have read several reviews on the internet that mention the stove arms melting and deforming under load once they’re hot. If this happens during use, it could cause a boiling water disaster and ruin your meal. Our reviewers did not experience this while testing the stove, but complaints of this kind seem too widespread to discount.

https://www.outdoorgearlab.com/reviews/camping-and-hiking/backpacking-stove/brs-3000t

 

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[Jan Rezac]

Long time ago, based on what I had read on the internet, I got worried that the pot supports on BRS-3000 can  melt. I bent them so that they were aligned with the flames, what prevented major part of the supports from getting that hot. However, the folded stove became much less packable. I started using another BRS stove I had because of that, and it worked without any issues.  So I straightened the supports on the first one again, and it survived it well.

In the end, I don’t thing that the “melting” of the pot supports is a real issue, at least with small pots which are good fit for this kind of stove. If I want to boil more water in a large pot, I bring another stove, just because of the stability needed for safety.

Bending and straightening the pot supports without breaking them show that the material is very pliable. I think it’s plain (CP) titanium, or some cheap alloy that’s even softer. Definitely not the 6Al4V, that’s completely different beast.

[Jon Fong / Flat Cat Gear]

Bending and straightening the pot supports without breaking them show that the material is very pliable.

Jan – suspect that you are correct in that it is probably a CP grade titanium. If you look at the pot support arms, they are embossed to increase the cross-section area moment of inertia (stiffer). Additionally, the bracket that supports the pot support arms have tabs that are bent up 90 degrees. While they could form and then heat treat the part, I find that doubtful on a stove that sells for ~$16. My 2 cents.

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