All You Need to Know About Fastpacking

[Art …]

The Definitive Guide to Fastpacking

note : some of the comments that accompany this article are as informative as the article itself. if you read the article, be sure to read the comments that follow it.

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[Mike M]

Art- good find :) I whole heartedly agree with the discussion on packs-if it doesn't ride well during running-you're screwed. I've found that volume w/ smaller packs is more of a concern than weight. For shelter I think an eVENT bivy is going to be tough to beat from both a weight and volume standpoint-at least for solo travel, a tent might be a good choice for two people. Also a quilt vs bag, same argument-lighter, less volume.

Mike

[Ralph Burgess]

A good read. It oscillates between explaining general principles and Meghan & friends' personal (and sometimes quirky) specific gear lists, but both are interesting. Fleshing out the medical kit section would have been useful – some of the items (and omissions) are not self-explanatory. And learning CPR might well save somebody at your office or on a city sidewalk, but not in the wilderness – unless defibrillation and advanced life support are close at hand, it's pretty much pointless, I think.

[HkNewman]

Fantastic article. Think you can post that if anyone asks how do I. get into ..? Devote the rest of SUL subforum into specific gear or gear specifics.

[Bryon Powell]

Hi Guys,
So glad you like iRunFar's article on fastpacking. Meghan Hicks, the author and iRunFar's Senior Editor, and I (the site's founder) have long enjoyed fastpacking and are excited to share the pursuit with our audience of trail runners and ultrarunners.

We'd love it if you shared some of your own basic knowledge, favorite gear, and best memories of fastpacking with our audience as comments on the article. We intend to update the article over time and hope others will make the resource even stronger with experience-based comments from the likes of you (and naive questions from potential or novice fastpackers).

Happy trails (and holidays),
Bryon

[Mike M]

posted up a few comments ")

[Art …]

When Fastpacking …

Stove
in summer season (night time temps at 30* or above) I rarely bring a stove and the accessories associated with it. this is more a time thing than a weight thing.
in the morning get up, sprinkle some instant coffee in your water bottle, eat a few bites of your favorite easy packaged stuff, and get going. at night, stop, make whatever camp you're gonna make, eat some cold food, fall asleep.

Food
Perpetuem has found its way increasingly into my (and others) food list for fastpacking. while not the lightest food source, its easy, efficient, and nutritious.

Sleep Pad
I've only gone without one a couple times, for a single overnight, but I agree they are not mandatory for summer season trips of a few days. I'll take more trips without one in the future. not so much for the weight saving but for the bulk saving.

[dirtbag]

Fantastic article and I dont even fast pack! I do like to go minimal as possible and hike all day until evening, make a quick simple LNT camp..eat,sleep..wake up pack up and continue on my adventure. So, while I may not be running/trail running, I still think this article can pertain to my style and many others like myself. Thanks..

[Anthony Meaney]

Great article. Thanks for this.

[Peter Bakwin]

i missed this article due to walking the length of NZ's South Island when it came out. Tried to comment on irunfar but it wouldn't take. As to Skurka's #1, I thought it odd that Megan has a whole article about fast packing but never defines the term. Then reading on I thought "oh, she's talking about backpacking". I propose that "fastpacking" does mean something. It means that your focus is to cover your distance as quickly as possible, and you choose your gear and approach to that end. For trips of 1-2 nights that probably means no camping gear to speak of (maybe an extra clothing layer for naps). For longer trips sleep management becomes a very serious consideration. Anyway, I'd just like to propose this definition. "Fastpacking" does NOT mean backpacking with some running.

[Aaron Sorensen]

Yay
Thanks Peter

I'm glad someone agrees with me.
You can read my replies on the irunfar site.
Would like to know what you think about my definition of it?

[Peter Bakwin]

Aaron, I probably missed it, but didn't see where you give a definition of fastpacking. Anyway, I think mine is clear & logical, and it doesn't say anything about running. I don't think Brett or Andrew ran at all in setting their unsupported records on the JMT, for example. PCT records are set w/o running, but they do conform to my definition of "fastpacking".

[Adam Kilpatrick]

Just read through the article and comments.

I concur with Skurka, Aaron and Peter.

Its a bit weird (to me) how many ultra runners have taken on "fastpacking". I've seen a few ultramarathons in Australia (ex wife used to do them, and I've thus volunteered to help on a few), and found it disturbing how little actual trail skill was present in almost all of the competitors and organizers. It seems that "fastpacking" to them is just an extension of their ultraruns but just not in an event. Its kind of alarming, as they don't really understand the differences too well and the subsequent risk profile. Ultrarunning seems to be quite different from say, Rogaining, where competitors traditionally are very self reliant and have good skills for being out there for 24hours off track. I see "ultrarunners" filtering into Rogaining now in Australia (and not realising that they have a skill disconnect).

What's weirder is the author of the article saying that they can do 20-40 miles in a day "fastpacking". Kinda strangely low, and not realizing that if they just got their gear down, concentrated on nailing core backpacking skills and efficiency, they'd do that walking, easily, on relatively little training compared to what most ultramarathon runners put in.

In Australia, we just call it "Bushwalking", or, less, "Hiking". "Backpacking" is what most young Australian's do when they head off travelling overseas!

So fiddling around with distinctions, at least on the abitrary level of the word, between say backpacking and fastpacking really isn't that big a deal.

How its done is more important, and by that, I mean in a manner that is
1. LNT
2. Safe to the person doing it with risk carefully managed
3. Safe (and low cost and burden) to anyone who subsequently has to go and rescue them…

(Aka, good old fashioned personal responsibility)

Definitions, or least defining goals clearly, for what someone does for an FKT is probably much more important. Eg, the old "what is unsupported" debate. I think this should be focused on clearly, as early as possible…and perhaps Peter and Skurka are the best ambassadors around to, say, write and article in the popular magazines, etc, on this. There is a risk that such distinctions could be lost or distorted with the ultrarunning community coming on board with trying for FKTs.

[John Vance]

I too was surprised by the distances for "running" as I would have expected them to outpace long distance backpacking daily rates. I don't run with my pack but 20 to 30 miles a day is obtainable without running for most lightweight backpackers. I spend so much time off trail that mileage doesn't become the endgame – it's the terrain.

[Aaron Sorensen]

I attempted the JMT record going supported (and blew up on day 1) after Brett got it.
I was trying to keep up with his times from Forrester to Glen and was moving going down.
By the time I got to Viditte, I would have needed to be at the top of Glen in 1:27.

Andrew mentioned that he regularly was able to maintain a 4mph pace while going down most of the passes.

Now matter how you want to slice both, YES, they did run.

Here is a copy and paste from my definition from I Run Far:

I have been into SUL hiking almost as long as I've been an ultra runner.

I have more fun making my own gear that is top of the line and fits me better than anything off the shelf. If you have something that fits you, the thermal efficiency can save you a good percentage of weight over an ill fitting garment.

Having done the JMT Unsupported 3 times now with a starting pack weight between 15 and 17 pound, I've made some good decisions and many bad ones (one was going for the FKT).

My first of the 3 was without a sleeping bag. Everything went ok, but never according to plan.
I figured I would sleep 1 1/2 hours right before dark and 1 1/2 after sunrise when it warmed up. Bailing a the Lake Edison ferry, I managed to sleep a few hours before sunrise (while going northbound). Other than that sleep, I had accumulated about 50 minutes of sleep in the middle of the night while freezing. Other attempts to sleep included being woken up by a bear sniffing my head and having a bird come down 10 feet from me and start chirping at me until I gave up and kept moving.

Now my motto is to have a quilt warm enough to work with your gear and everything else will work out all right.

On the topic off this article, I have discussed this topic about fastpacking many times.
After all I have been fastpacking before it was coined fastpacking and doing FKT's when they were just called records.
This responses of this article have been really good and hit a few good pointers for anyone who may try to go fastpacking in the near future.

First off all, I completely agree with Skurka as to the efficiency of hiking being much more than trying to run. This is because although it may be called fastpacking, you are really hiking while just pushing big miles each day.

So what's the difference between pushing big miles and fastpacking?
Well, simple, it's running. So are we supposed to go against the Andrew's knowledge (the king of backpacking himself) and tell him he's wrong? Well no, and the reason why, is because what most people are doing when they go fastpacking is just plain hiking.

So my whole point is that in order to be efficient, you need to go light enough to have it be more efficient to be able to run. Without that ability, you are back to just hiking.

The biggest fastpacking myth I've heard from many people when they go on fastpacking trips is that pack weight doesn't make much difference until after about 20-22 pounds.

The whole running weight and efficiency of running really starts with a pack weight of under 15 pounds. If you can start with a pack at that weight and work it's way down to 11 or so after the first few days, you will actually be able to do some running each day and be much faster at that weight while running than you will just walking each step.

The problem is, almost no person does this while fastpacking.
I believe this is just because fastpacking is so new that while it may have a name to it, it is not being done (by many) in the fashion it is met to be.

[Peter Bakwin]

Well, we disagree on what fastpacking means. I go back to Jim Knight's original article where he coined the term. He focussed on speed & not whether a person was running or walking. Note that the fastest PCT thru-hikers are doing well in excess of 40 mpd without running at all. They are fastpacking by my definition.

[Ito Jakuchu]

"It means that your focus is to cover your distance as quickly as possible, and you choose your gear and approach to that end."

I like this because it is so simple and concise. That it doesn't require running or not (you can out hike a slower runner, by being consistent and going for non-stop forward progress, making it more about the speed, vs. way of moving). And that it doesn't require it to be an overnight trip necessarily (although it probably often is).

[Art …]

if we are going to use the term " Fastpacking " then the key element for me is sleep.
Fastpacking requires at least one period of sleep no matter how short.
otherwise it is just a long day trip (hike or run.)
100 miles is a magic number to many ultrarunners, and rarely is there time taken to sleep during these runs. So these are just day runs, though they may last up to 48 hours.

[Aaron Sorensen]

Ito, Peter, and Art,

Wow.

I think the 3 posts above this really do sum it up much better than the way I defined it.
Thanks.

[Allen C]

Aaron – I'm not at all sure how maintaining 4mph going downhill implies running. For me 4mph is a fast walk. Having said that, I think both Brett and Andrew did run some portions of the JMT, just not large portions. I believe Andrew talked about running towards the end of his TR as he approached Happy Isles. Brett probably did his running earlier and was too destroyed on the last day to run much if at all.

Also – doesn't fastpacking really just mean backpacking fast? Similar to Peter's definition – may or may not involve running, involves carrying/using some overnight gear, but the focus is on speed.

[Aaron Sorensen]

I'm not talking about just maintaining 4mph but averaging it through the entire downhill sections.

I know, I was out there trying to run down Brett's record.
Yes, they were running. So was I. All be it at 4.5 mph top speed which is more of a jog and letting gravity do the work.

It is easier to move at 4.5 mph going down hill than trying to put on the breaks with every step.
The thing is, it's hard to do this with a heavier pack, (and not as efficient).
This is where Fastpacking comes into play in order to complete more miles per day.

[Peter Bakwin]

I see the logic of requiring a sleep cycle to distinguish fastpacking from just ultrarunning (or overnight running). It seems that Jim Knight coined this term in his 1988 UltraRunning article about a 38-hour, 100 mile trip in the Winds. It would be good to know if Jim & Bryce slept during this trip, being that it was just one night. I don't have the full article.

“We were wilderness running. Power hiking. Kind of backpacking, but much faster. More fluid. Neat. Almost surgical. Get in. Get out. I call it fastpacking.” – Jim Knight, 1988

[Jeffs Eleven]

I have read a few of these threads and am still confused. Sorry…

So "y'all" are trying to essentially determine whether or not Fastpacking definition includes or does not include running?

So "packing" means (I guess this need to be defined too?) to go out with all the things you need to spend at least one night in the wilderness and survive. Or instead of just "survive" are we meaning "what people normally take while camping" (insulation, shelter, food, etc…)

To me this is what differentiates runners from packers. If the shit goes down (weather, getting lost…) runners could be screwed due to very minimal gear including food.

Packers have gear to get them through a lot of misfourtune.

It gets muddy thinking about say, when who was it Roman, RJ and Mike! or some guys went into the Winds with 40lbs among em and got a storm to drop a few inches of snow. They were doing situps in bed and using a lot of technique. A runner could argue that even with very minimal gear they posses enough technique and skill to make it ok. …So are they now 'packers" if their skill level increases their safety level close to that of an avg packer?

I think the distinction is in the definition of "packing"

beyond that the only question is what is fast?

To me anything over 4 is fast. The avg person would have to try hard to make 4mph avg. 3/3.5 is moving but doable for normal folks with a little bit of effort.

Running = fast.
Are you "packing"?
yes? If you are running you are fast, hence you are a fastpacker.

Am I missing something? Did I just regress the whole conversation? Did I make any sense at all anyway?

I have no dogs in this fight, I guess I've been into defining things recently??

[Allen C]

Speed depends on terrain. In some terrain 2mph is fast and in some terrain 3pm is slow. You can fastpack without running a step and you can run a bit while backpacking, then spend 5 hours at the hot springs and only cover 5 miles that day, but are you really fastpacking?

You can be fast without running and you can run without being fast. But you can't fastpack without packing fast.

[Ken Thompson]

If you are competing then you are racing, If you are carrying overnight gear and food you are backpacking. Fastpacking is a great marketing term with little value. Label for labeling sake to make people feel better about how they do something.

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