Bear Bag Line Launcher: Would you use one?

The way I see it is you will have two things working against you –

Price: competing with free (a rock) by offering convenience.

Simplicity: competing with a found rock, versus carrying another thing (a mental weight, besides a physical one)

If your product is as good as you say and you can offer it at a price that you feel people would be willing to, ahem, spring for, then maybe you do have a product worth making tooling for.

Personally speaking, if the product is bug-free and works exactly as advertised I could see being maybe willing to pay up to $70 for this. More than that and it begins to seem like a very expensive luxury. Since you are offering convenience as a package you will need to make the whole experience easy – not just launching a weight but managing your ropes/lines when the product is not in use.

I would expect thru hikers such as those on the AT and PCT would be much more willing to consider a product like this, as they will be expecting to hang bags for over a hundred nights.

Stephen,

Thanks for commenting, your insights are helpful.

I got interested in pursuing this idea because of my frustration with using rocks. They are free, but I find it usually takes me many attempts to get a line over the branch I'm aiming for. The line launcher takes fewer attempts (for me, and I'm guessing others), so it saves time. But it is something else to carry, and it will have a cost.

I foresee lots of them. Tangles, stuck lines snapped off and hanging in the wind, the hassle of rewrapping or reloading the thing after every shot, etc. Can you assuage my fears?

I wouldn't use it regardless–throwing a rock isn't that hard for me–but I can see others using it if I'm wrong about the line hassles.

Todd,

I've been using 10 lb test Spectra line as a pilot line, and use it to pull up the bear bag line. Any method of propelling lines into tree branches entails risk of the line tangling, but the spectra fishing line is no more prone to getting stuck than other lines. We've been using a magnetic coupling on the projectile, so if it should get stuck, the line will pull free.

As for reloading after every shot, well, the idea is that you don't have to take many shots. It's easy to aim, and its power is adjustable. But it's not hard to reload in any event.

The whole point of the launcher is to save time by not requiring multiple attempts. Certainly, people who can regularly succeed in throwing a line over on the first attempt won't benefit from this. So that's really what I'm trying to gauge. How many backpackers are frustrated enough by the rock method?

Thanks for your comments.

I wouldn't use it personaly. I hike in NY/NJ/PA and finding a rock to throw is no problem. I guess I have pretty good aim also because I usually get it on my first attempt. I personally wouldn't want to carry something extra in space and weight that I really didn't need. Also..things break..it happens..so if this product malfunctioned I would have to carry out more garbage. I'm not saying your product is garbage, I'm just saying if it did break or malfunction while out in the woods..well…you see where I'm going? I would be careful with this..you'll shoot yer eye out with this kid..
I could be wrong..This is just my opinion, I mean hey..people actually buy trowels to dig catholes, right? Instead of useing rocks/sticks and/or stakes?

Joe,

Thanks for your input. For people who have no difficulty throwing a rock over a branch on the first attempt the Bear Bag Line Launcher is not needed. But it's very unlikely to break, so that shouldn't be a concern.

No. I would not. Interesting concept, but not for me thanks.

Ursack.

Finding the right branch is usually a bigger variable for me than getting the line over it.

If I'm going carry extra oz for bear protection, would probably be on an Ursack.

Ken,

Thanks for your response. Is there a reason why you wouldn't use one?

If you never hang food, or always use a bear canister, for instance, then there would be no need. Or if you usually hang your food, but have no difficulty using the rock method, that's another reason. I'm curious about why people would, or would not, consider this.

Katherine,

Thanks for responding. I agree that finding a suitable branch can be a problem. The Bear Bag Line Launcher does make it easier to reach high branches, so it might make the task of finding a suitable branch easier. I used my prototype last week to get a line over a branch that was 37 feet above the ground.

Hi Peter,

I like the idea but I don't think I would ever buy one and I would probably not use it if given to me. I don't have a hard time throwing the line. Just my 2 cents.

Really cool idea though!

Kelly,

Thanks for your 2 cents. I'm surprised that everyone seems to be much better at throwing lines over branches than I am!

I like using the Line Launcher, because for me it speeds things up and I can get a line over higher branches. It's also kind of fun to use.

It'd be a no-go for me.

Having worked out a way to avoid most of the gotchas I can usually get the rope up in 2-3 tosses. (I in no way have a baseball player's or football quarterback's arm)

Interesting idea, but…..

One tenet of UL gear is the avoidance of gadgets and I'm afraid this jumps into the gadget category with both feet. Gaining skill via actice is lighter and less expensive.

You might get better response from main stream backpackers. Like those that buy all their gear at REI. They always seem to be looking for the next gadget to increase the weigh of their packs. If you could get REI to stock it, it might sell. But… on the other hand, most of those people are using bear canisters probably.

Billy

it fits into the catagory of novelty.

Dale,

I agree that reducing the number of items carried is part of the way to lighter, and simpler, backpacking. For me (and it's beginning to look like I'm the only one!) the Bear Bag Line Launcher is worth it's small weight, because it makes a difficult task easy and fast. But I definitely agree with the principle that gadgets should be avoided.

Thanks for your response

It would be interesting if you could do a video of using it. That might help people get some enthusiasm for it.

Also, maybe you could shoot that video off to REI's purchasing department with a proposal?

Billy

Billy Ray,

Thanks for your suggestion about a video. That's a good idea, and I'll work on it.

I think you're missing your market segment by posting here.

Sorry, I can't be more constructive. But your audience is summarized by the following equation:

(bear can) – (current bear bagging kit) > weight_of_your_launcher AND *CANT_THROW AND *STILL_LOOKING_FOR_BRANCH_IS_NOT_A_HASSEL

That's a very narrow audiance.

Same response as all the others. It's a single use item. Most places I go is hanging vs. canisters. I take the Ursack. Tie it off to a tree.
Hanging is fine, and easy. But it too is unneeded. It does have the slight weight advantage that this gadget would close the gap on.

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/bear_bag_hanging_technique.html#.VE6Wmr5g5nE

"It's a single use item."

Uni-taskers need some serious justification and a lack of viable alternatives to pass the muster, particularly on a forum dedicated to reducing the volume of gear.

Maybe try something that piggybacks on existing gear? Like a scaled down tree-climbers "big-shot" design that fits onto the end of a trekking-pole/tent support???

While gadgets will be frowned upon, a creative spirit always deserves a smile. Good luck!!!

Jake,

Thanks for your comments. I figured that ultralighters would be most skeptical. (I consider my self to be an adherent, with a base weight of 10 lbs.) But for 2 ounces this works for me because I always hang my food, and I guess I'm the rare person who usually requires several throws using the rock technique. So I will always take a Line Launcher with me.

If it saves 5 minutes a day on a week long hike, that's 35 minutes saved for 2 ounces. Besides, it's easy and fun to use. But I do appreciate that it's an extra item, and if throwing a line is easy, there's no point in carrying an unneeded item.

Christopher,

That Big Shot might be a tad overkill for backpackers:). But it does bring up a potential market for the Line Launcher: Arborists who want to go light.