JetBoil Sol update?

Thanks Randy, I didn't know that. Although, for that price I would rather buy an AL system on sale! :)

check out section hiker http://sectionhiker.com/outdoor-retailer-summer-2014-trade-show-gear-orgy/

jetfoil will bring out burner with simmering possibilities.

myself: i just remove it from fire and put it in a ziplock in a cosy. no need to simmer…..

I had the original burner as well and the threads died (on a trip :( ) fortunately I was able to get a new "Brass threaded burner" from the reseller in Denmark. To answer the OP question, I have an original Ti pot 3 years old and no problems, but I only boil water in it.

I got an email from a rep at Jetboil this morning. They asked me for my info so they could set up a return authorization and I can send in the burner for them to evaluate it and repair it. So, maybe they can simply replace the threads… That would be nice.

Well that's really cool – especially considering the limited warranty. Hopefully they do the repair and at most only charge a few bucks for shipping or something.

> my info so they could set up a return authorization and I can send in the burner for
> them to evaluate it and repair it.

Just a caution here. Jetboil have a well-known reputation for simply confiscating the returned gear and never either returning or replacing it. Totally unethical imho. Many cases reported here at BPL.

Cheers

Roger, yeah, I am aware of that… I remember all of the threads from the last couple of years… as well, some of my post's on thier FB page were the ones that they kept taking down… but, at this point, the burner I have/had is fried. So, if they want to keep it, it's all theirs! I couldn't use it if I wanted too. (I will add though that I have no intentions of sending the cup back in… I will keep that.) At best though, they will repair it, or maybe even replace it. Who knows… maybe they have turned over a new leaf… and some good PR in this department might be good for them…

Anyway, I sent the burner in yesterday, and it should be there tomorrow. The rep said it will take 2 – 5 days and then they will get back in touch with me… so, I will just wait and see what they say.

http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=595823

Topic – Jetboil Sol Ti not recommended

Just a warning on this product: Mine caught alight whilst cooking. We were attempting the Cuillin ridge. It could have potentially been disasterous if it had caught my sleeping bag or bag. I am still not exactly sure why. The original Jetboil is a fantastic product. The supplier did not offer any feedback as to what could be the cause – further internet research into the Ti model and this seems to be a common issue. Buy the original and not this model.

more at link …

So, today I got my burner unit back from Jetboil. From the date that they received the stove burner, to today, it has been 22 days (including "non-buisness days"). I only say this because initially, I was told it would take 2 – 5 days to evaluate and repair my burner, but then when I emailed them back after the 5 days, they told me that due to it being their busy season, it would actually be 10 – 15 days before they could get to it. To be fair, yesterday was the 15th business day, so that was an accurate time frame.

They did not replace the burner all together, which is fine by me, but they did replace the threads with the updated brass threads. But, according to the paperwork, all that they mention is that they "replaced valve (AL threads).

The threads are nice and new, and appear to be brass. Screwing the unit onto a canister is smooth as butter!

What I found interesting though is that when striking the piezo (which has always been hit or miss) it fired up immediately, but it didn't sound at all like I was used to. Instead, I got a soft ssshhhhhhh, as opposed to a loud sssshhhhh as if a jet were actually taking off! Before I sent it in, with barely a half of a turn on the valve control, the stove sounded as if it were on full blast (really, by turning the valve control any farther, it all sounded the same). Now though, that doesn't seem to be the case at all… Now, it seems to take 2.5 full turns before it sounds like it is at full throttle (although, it does still have a couple more turns left). But, I have way more control over the flame. I can get it down to a simmer very easily now… which makes me wonder if they used the same valve as is in the newer MiniMo…

This made me wonder about fuel efficiency. Before I sent it in, I could get a full rolling boil with 2 cups of water with only 4 grams of fuel, and in about 1:45 (inside – read: optimal conditions). I only did 2 burns (inside, as before) and found that while I was still only using 4 g of fuel (with ~ 2.5 turns on the valve control), the boil times were now closer to 2 minutes. Although, the water from the tap may be colder than before…

Either way, I am very happy with the outcome on the stove. Now, I don't have to buy a replacement, and on top of that, I have a much better flame control. This has definitely made me have different feelings about JetBoil. I can say that this has definitely restored a great deal of my faith in them. However, I will admit, I would still like to seem them update their "1 Year Limited Warranty" to something a bit more reassuring. Although, it appears that they will still take care of the customer if it is out of that time frame… at least in this case they did!

I haven’t seen anything official coming out of Jetboil, but I keep hearing that their Sol system is going to be completely discontinued, both the Ti and the Al versions. Anyone got anything official?

I do notice that REI no longer lists any version of the Sol system for sale on their site although you can still get the Sol pots. The Ti version is marked down to a clearance price. Jetboil still lists both the Al and the Ti Sol systems on their site.

Regarding the heat exchanger melting/separating/burning on the Ti Sol, it doesn’t seem to be super common but it does seem to happen. I recently picked up another damaged Ti Sol pot at a used gear sale just for photography purposes. The two pots on the right are Ti Sol pots. The larger pot on the left is a Primus pot that’s just there to show what an intact HX should look like.

There are more photos on my blog if anyone is interested..

Jetboil from what I understand did modify the design of the Ti Sol pot slightly. It’s possible that the redesign improved things.

HJ
Adventures In Stoving
Hikin’ Jim’s Blog

I spoke with our local sales rep a couple of days ago and the SOL in both versions has indeed been discontinued. The mini-mo is more or less a replacement for the sol. I didn't think to ask if the SOL companion cups were also discontinued. I do know the companion cups are still available at this point.

I purchased a Sol Alu a while back from REI, I am wondering
if I should return it.

>I purchased a Sol Alu a while back from REI, I am wondering
>if I should return it.

Why? Is there anything wrong with it. The SOL Alu version has never had problems and is a great little stove.

Thats good to know there is no issue with the Alu one.

Thanks,

Since it's discontinued, wait a while, then sell at a premium? : )

I spoke with our local sales rep a couple of days ago and the SOL in both versions has indeed been discontinued. The mini-mo is more or less a replacement for the sol. I didn’t think to ask if the SOL companion cups were also discontinued. I do know the companion cups are still available at this point.

This seems very odd to me. The Sol is their high end stove. Perhaps they’re just not selling enough of them?

The Zip is only 1 oz heavier than the Alumuminum Sol (which is in turn only 1 oz heavier than the Ti Sol, at least on my scale), so maybe they figure there isn’t enough differentiation to justify the expense of three separate products?

I suppose their product line will be something like this:
Jetboil Zip — Customers interested in light weight; customers on a limited budget.
Jetboil Flash — Middle of the road customers.
Jetboil Mini-Mo — Higher end customers, particularly foodies.
Jetboil Joule — Specialized winter stove users.

The stove that makes the least business sense to me is the Joule, but that’s a subject for another thread.

HJ
Adventures In Stoving
Hikin’ Jim’s Blog

I am not sure on the reasoning myself. I suspect that it ultimately boils (lol) down to sales. I do know that the Mini-mo is supposed to have an improved valve system. You certainly can turn it down very low, so it should actually simmer unlike the earlier jetboil stoves. Provided the wind does not blow the flame out.

I think you have the product lines and target customers about right. I would add the the Joule is probably also targeted toward groups – I haven't seen figures but I would guess with the inverted canister that it should melt snow and boil water faster than the other stoves at the cost of some efficiency.

The current Jetboil line-up, without the Sol Al and Ti would be a bit odd to me.

There's really nothing that weigh's as little while being as compact, and has a comparable capacity as the Sol and its light burner. It remains to be seen if JetBoil is indeed dropping them, though I don't necessarily doubt what's reported here.

Will add, I've had a Sol Ti since 2010, as has my wife's backpacking friend. My wife has a Sol Al. All ours have performed well, no melting/separating fins.

The only issues with the Sol Ti is/was the original pot lid and the difficulty getting the pot to "lock" into the stove.

The original lid was a very hard plastic which didn't seal. I complained to Jetboil (now part of Johnson Outdoors Inc) and they replaced mine and my wife's friend's @ no charge, even though they wanted to charge $5 each. The new lids are made from a slightly different material and do, now, snap shut over the Ti pot.

The customer service person at Johnson had no idea what I was talking about re the Ti lid, even though it's a widely documented problem… alas, that's what happens when a small Co. is gobbled up by a large one.

My wife's girlfriend recently got the MinimM, but we haven't used it in the field yet. But it seems like a "simmering JetBoi" is not a bad thing!

The current Jetboil line-up, without the Sol Al and Ti would be a bit odd to me.

Yeah, that’s my take. They’re replacing a ~10 oz (Sol Ti, my scale) to 11 oz (Sol Al, my scale) with a 15.7 oz (per John Abela’s photo, below) system? What? Hunh? That’s more than a quarter pound of weight gain. Yes, it looks great, but a quarter pound plus?

I can sort of see eliminating the Sol Ti since it’s a) only about an ounce lighter than the Sol Al when you do an apples-to-apples comparison (JB appears to have played comparison “games” by using unequal component lists to develop weights that make the Sol Ti look lighter) and b) probably relatively low volume in the overall sales picture, but to totally eliminate their light weight offerings? Of course the Jetboil Zip is supposed to be only 12 oz, so maybe they’re folding everything into the Zip as their lightweight option.

MSR’s new Windboiler appears to be well timed. If someone had a fairly high discretionary spending limit and were a serious backpacker, then the Windboiler might be a nice choice in that it’s a higher end, serious integrated canister stove. The Mini-Mo strikes me as more cutesy, possibly targeted at less serious backpackers. Maybe. We’ll see. :)

HJ
Adventures In Stoving
Hikin’ Jim’s Blog

Jim, agreed mostly… however, the Mini Mo is directed at those, like my wife's girlfriend who is a foodie and chef par-excellence, that want more pot room and the ability to simmer… I actually think the MiniMo has a real niche for those of us that despise freezedried food and want to actually cook a meal, but appreciate the Jetboil's miserly fuel consumption.

The Jetboil Zip is a step backwards relative to the Sol lineup… no Pizeo igniter (not a great loss) and a heavier burner (with less sensitive control) and smaller capacity pot… not really sure how decreasing a pots capacity below the current Sol's .8 liter make's sense… all this compromise is heavier than the Sol Al with higher capacity pot.

Too bad JetBoil got sold to a clueless conglomerate.

Also, the Ti pot has a lot of appeal to those that don't like cooking with aluminum… again, not a big deal for a barbarian like myself, but it does matter to some.

We've got two Sol Al's and a Sol Ti in the house… I have no plans to replace them anytime soon!

However, I did recently pick up an Olicamp pot/stove combo to try out and it may very well make my Jetboils a thing of the past… same miserly fuel consumption in a slightly easier to handle and more versatile configuration… and at the same weight as the Sol Al and less than half the cost:

http://www.bobwards.com/OLICAMP-Vector-Stove–XTS-Pot-Combo-115945

http://www.olicamp.com/products-pots/xts-pot

http://www.olicamp.com/products-stoves/vector

I'm sure this has been covered but I wonder how efficient my jetboil ti pot would be with my Sno peak lite max?

OK, for the metallurgically challenged, does it really make that much difference whether your threads are brass or aluminum? I mean stainless steel is so much harder than either. Yes, brass is generally harder than aluminum (depending on the alloy and whether it’s been through some kind of hardening treatment), but given that stainless steel is SO much harder than either, does it really matter?

On the one hand I note that higher end canister stoves tend to have brass threads (Soto stoves for example), but on the other hand I note that the MSR Pocket Rocket (aluminum threads) has been widely used on the PCT and elsewhere without undue problems.

Is the difference between the two really all that significant, particularly for the typical hiker that might spend a week or two per year out on the trail at most?

HJ
Adventures In Stoving
Hikin’ Jim’s Blog

I'm not a metallurgist but they did make me take some classes back in school. I think Al threads are easier to damage and won't last as long as Brass threads. For people who carefully thread on a stove it probably wouldn't make a lick of difference. For regular folks Brass would probably see less returns.

Hi Jim

> does it really make that much difference whether your threads are brass or aluminum?
> I mean stainless steel is so much harder than either.

Not sure where you got the SS bit from. Both canisters and Lindal valves are made from plated steel, not SS.

Now, thread material. Well, for a start, see our article on Lindal Valves. That will give you lots of useful info, but it does not cover exactly this question. Why not? ‘Cause I didn’t think of it!

The thread on the Lindal valve is made by roll-forming very thin-wall steel tubing. It is anything but smooth and polished. Unfortunately, it is also seriously malformed. If you look at the discussion on the thread in my FAQ you will see photo of a stove with a ‘stripped thread’. It looks like many other stripped threads one sees.

What has happened here is that the seriously malformed thread on the canister has steadily, over the years, sheared off the TIPS of the brass thread on the stove. It did this because the canister thread has inadequate depth – it does not conform to the standard for that thread. Basically, when EPIGAS designed this fitting, they ‘screwed up’ and produced a really defective design. That’s why the French campingaz company came out with their amazingly better Qwik-Clic design a few years later (and one reason I developed my canister connection too).

In more detail: the rough/sharp edges on the canister thread cut into the brass thread in the stove and slowly grind it away. Takes some time, but it happens.

Now, what about aluminium threads? Well, they are usually hard-anodised (on good stoves, anyhow). That hard anodising is harder than the steel thread, so it should wear the canister thread away … in theory. However, what happens in practice is different. The very high pressure on the anodised aluminium surface is transmitted to the much softer aluminium inside, and that softer aluminium yields. After a while the hard anodising starts to literally crack and flake off. Once that starts, the end is quite close. The rest of the anodising flakes off, then the aluminium threads shear off – very fast. That is why good stoves have a brass insert for the thread: in practice it lasts much longer than aluminium. But, of course, it costs extra.

IF you only ever do the aluminium thread up gently, and you only use the stove for a 7 – 10 days per year, then an aluminium-thread stove will probably last you quite a few years. But will a ‘typical’ (= novice) hiker always treat his stove ‘gently’? That is a good question.

Am I saying that the common screw-thread is a seriously defective canister connector design? Yes, it is. Ask any qualified engineer.

The only saving grace is that when the stove thread strips the stove usually slips off the canister so the pin can’t release any gas. Er … usually.

Cheers

Roger,

Thank your for that explanation. It all makes sense. The only thing still nagging at me is the number of people who have successfully used, say, a Pocket Rocket on the PCT. After months on the trail, their stoves are fine, or so I read on blogs and such.

So, what in very general “ballpark” terms can be expected in terms of a life of a stove? Six months of use (or the equivalent spread out over time) with care? A year equivalent? Too tough to put a number on?

And brass? What kind of increase of life expectancy would occur with brass threads? Is there any way to make a “ballpark” estimate?

HJ
Adventures in Stoving
Hikin Jim’s Blog