1oz/yd2 Cuben Tarp-Shelter Prototype

Ok….good thing I posted! A quick google search did show that you would have to be extremely careful if trying to take off duct tape from cuben, or you can delaminate the cuben. So…..I won't be going that way.

So, there were two ideas ->

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Could you attach the cones with double sided tape instead of sewing?

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You mean, just use tape (like gorilla?) that I would more or less decide to leave permanently there? I imagine if I used any form of duct tape that it would eventually lose its stickiness…and the tape would have to stick to both dyneema x and cuben. Is there a good tape option out there?

And second ->

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Just glue the cones in, much cleaner way to add it after its all sewn up.

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I like the sound of this idea….b/c with glue the cones won't just "hang there"….I can glue to the sides the tarp and it will be more ridged there in the peak….less hassle when putting my trekking poles in the cone. But again….what glue would stick to both cuben and dyneema x and be more or less permanent?

John, you may not want to, having put time into the dyneema cones, but if I were doing this, I would consider making the cones from ZPacks cuben hybrid repair patches. But then, my MYOG experiences are fairly minor.

Now…that is a good idea to use hybrid patches.

The dyneema x cones were a good learning experience…I had fun making them even if I don't use them.

I have a zpacks duplex and that is what zpacks uses on their tieout reinforcements and the peak "cups".

So…yes, I could do that. I still have the nagging thought in the back of my mind that I would still rather not reinforce with cuben. I know its on my duplex, but I've had several zpacks arc blasts through my house via the gear swap, and all owners have said they had little use, but they all had abrasion issues. Which is why I originally made the cones out of dyneema x, like what MLD uses for their high abrasion areas in their mids.

Well, if you really wanted to go overkill you could sew the dyneema cones to the hybrid cuben reinforcement patches. Our Duplex has 30+ nights with no sign off wear on the peak cups. Once set up, the pole really doesn't move inside the cup, which would cause the abrasion. When we had an earlier mid, without the hybrid cuben cups, I used to put a sleeve (a cut down umbrella cover) over the top of the pole to prevent wear. Something similar to the Tarptent Trekking pole handle adapter.

Edited because I just realised the end of the first sentence went AWOL.

Yeah, I also have that internal debate whether this whole thing is necessary with the cones. Once the tarp goes up, there shouldn't be much movement b/c of the tension so there shouldn't be much abrasion.

You did give another idea though…I do like the idea of just covering the trekking pole handles themselves with like a small cup made out of dyneema…which I would actually do if it wasn't two more things "to lose".

Make a silnylon sock for your trekking pole handles. Or just use a stuff sack. That should help mitigate any abrasion.

Hopefully tim will see this…but he said ->

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Just glue the cones in, much cleaner way to add it after its all sewn up.

-Tim

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Does anybody know of a glue that will stick to both dyneema and cuben?

Seamgrip or Aquaseal will stick to both and be easy to find(cheap).

Ryan

How about silnet? I already have several tubes of that….but I don't have seam grip of aquaseal.

And just to make sure I fully understand…..seam grip and aquaseal are used for polyester fabrics, and silnet for silnylon. And aquaseal is exactly the same as seam grip but just thicker?

And….since I would be using seam sealer as a glue, I would assume this is by nature not that "permanent"…i.e., it will eventually come apart/wear out, which means I'll need to reapply.

And, if I did want to separate the two pieces, that would probably be possible? What would I clean off the residue with off the cuben?

Sorry, last question….I usually always do the tarptent method of seamsealing where I dilute with mineral spirts….if I did that here, I would assume it would just be less sticky as a glue then, but would be less weight once dried…

John, have you seen these circular repair patches from ZPacks? I think they’re new – at least, I haven’t noticed them before.

Thanks for mentioning those…I do believe that they are new (I haven't seen them before) and right from zpacks mouth they say that these are what they use on their tarps like the duplex.

Again, a bit hesistant on the abrasion resistance, but it would probably do fine…and I could cut the circles into cones. Though, I still wouldn't mind trying to glue the dyneema cones in with silnet (I just need a response re: silnet vs seam grip) since I wouldn't have to spend the $15-$20 on an order from zpacks.

Here is a thought, and I am happy to provide materials at my cost if you'd like. Take some 1" double sided Cuben tape. Attach to a scrap of Cuben hybrid material in either 50d or 150d weight. This would essentially create a cuben-hybrid patch that you could cut into a circle or cone to adhere as an abrasion patch. Another idea if you wanted more abrasion resistance than the 50d or 150 Cuben hybrid. Is to use an XPac fabric without the tricot backing like X21 or X51. The laminate used by DP is the same as Cuben and Cuben tape stick to these fabric just the same as Cuben.

John,

Regarding Silnet vs Seamgrip….You want Seamgrip. Silnet will not bond as well or last as long.

I have some adhesive backed Dacron that you can use for reinforcements as well. It's more burly than what Zpacks uses, but less than the 210d nylon. Would be happy to send you a piece. PM me.

Ryan

Ok…so, since its Spring, I went ahead and put the finishing touches on this shelter.

I added shock cord to the mid panel tieouts then zpacks line down to a mini linelock.

I also decided against placing a tieout at the two tent apexes…I didn't want the line to have to be so far away from the tent. Otherwise the line would potentially rub against the vent fabric. So now, the zpacks line is just there to make sure the vent stays nicely open in wind. I'll probably put some shock cord on it to further make sure its not guyed out strongly.

I don't even think I need the guyouts from the vents. I put heavy duty weed wacker line in the hem and only in huge gusts would the vent start collapsing. I could even put two weed wacker lines if I wanted. But…it worked even better than I had hoped, plus its completely removable. I didn't need to make holes..I noticed that at the end of my hem I didn't sew it flush to the tarp edge, so there was already a little sleeve gap to just slip the line in.

I still haven't put the apex reinforcement fabric in…mainly b/c I don't think I can do it cleanly..and..I don't think I need it (there is so much cuben fabric in the apexes already). If I do see that it starts abrading, I can always add it later.

Its a beautiful shelter. Now that I've finished it…I'm actually thinking I might sell it. I have 2 cuben 2 person shelters (this and a duplex) and I don't think I can keep that much money tied up when I'll only be using 1 mostly. I like using an accomplice which I wouldn't be able to use with this type of shelter, but that is just about the only disadvantage.

Looks good. Nice job on the shelter. This kind of shelter design works great for rough weather. Heavy Duty Weed Wacker Line is what I use for the vents as well. It works great.

Here is two person cuben mid that I built about four years back.