Topic

Western Mountaineering on water resistant down and Pertex fabric


Forum Posting

A Membership is required to post in the forums. Login or become a member to post in the member forums!

Home Forums Gear Forums Gear (General) Western Mountaineering on water resistant down and Pertex fabric

Viewing 25 posts - 101 through 125 (of 131 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #3376327
    Gabe P
    BPL Member

    @gabe

    Anything new from WM on this?

    #3376334
    Eric Blanche
    BPL Member

    @eblanche

    Locale: Northeast US

    http://www.westernmountaineering.com/about/

     

    towards bottom of page. Seems like nothing new yet. Still testing.

    #3376345
    Stephen M
    BPL Member

    @stephen-m

    Locale: Way up North

    Similar post on Feathered Friends website, not a peep out of PHD or Valandre.

    http://featheredfriends.com/faq/

    #3376351
    Stuart .
    BPL Member

    @lotuseater

    Locale: Colorado

    Good answer on the FF site about the difference between duck and goose down.

    As for water resistant down, given that some of the early adopter cottage manufacturers are moving away from it and some of the premier companies are cautious about adopting it, this still seems to be a time to wait rather than jump in.

    #3376426
    Gabe P
    BPL Member

    @gabe

    thanks! Been thinking it’s just a gimmick – one that might work slightly for a while but that washes out quickly and limits the life of the feathers. Guess the jury is still out

    #3376429
    JCH
    BPL Member

    @pastyj-2-2

    I’m glad WR down is out there, but I’m not jumping in yet…old school is working just fine for me thank you very much. We have decades of data on the performance and longevity of “traditional” down…it’s going to be a very long time before we have that kind of data on WR down. Not to mention all the variations on WR down technology.

    #3376646
    Miles Spathelf
    BPL Member

    @miless

    Just curious…

    Which cottage makers have moved away from DWR down?

     

    “As for water resistant down, given that some of the early adopter cottage manufacturers are moving away from it and some of the premier companies are cautious about adopting it, this still seems to be a time to wait rather than jump in.”

    #3376657
    J-L
    BPL Member

    @johnnyh88

    ZPacks is one example. From their website:

    “Water resistant down is just normal down that is washed with a water resistant treatment by the factory. In theory this treatment makes the down take longer to wet out, and may retain a little bit less water after being soaked, however real world results are hard to observe. The down still wets out after a while and you still need to be careful to keep your bag dry. I personally think that the benefits are very minor. We have also noticed that the treated down can be more clingy and can take more work to break apart clumps and fluff the bag up, which could result in cold spots if the bag isn’t fluffed well.

    It is for this reason that we have decided to streamline our production and discontinue WR down as a standard option as of November 2014.”

    It’s only on their twin quilts page.

    #3376660
    Miles Spathelf
    BPL Member

    @miless

    Thanks!  Are there any others or is Zpacks the only one that has dropped DWR down?

     

    ZPacks is one example. From their website:

    “Water resistant down is just normal down that is washed with a water resistant treatment by the factory. In theory this treatment makes the down take longer to wet out, and may retain a little bit less water after being soaked, however real world results are hard to observe. The down still wets out after a while and you still need to be careful to keep your bag dry. I personally think that the benefits are very minor. We have also noticed that the treated down can be more clingy and can take more work to break apart clumps and fluff the bag up, which could result in cold spots if the bag isn’t fluffed well.

    It is for this reason that we have decided to streamline our production and discontinue WR down as a standard option as of November 2014.”

    It’s only on their twin quilts page.”

    #3377016
    Jennifer Mitol
    BPL Member

    @jenmitol

    Locale: In my dreams....

    one other thought…

    I washed my EE Enigma (with downtek) after my CT thru and this time I couldn’t really break up the clumps.  I have a lot of migrated down and a few cold spots now that I can’t seem to make go away.

    I’m going to try to re-wet it and re-dry it, this time with tennis balls, and far more attention to breaking up the clumps than I have had to in the past (which still was quite a lot anyway).

    To be honest, I’m not sure I’d get a WR down product in my quilt again.

    #3377033
    Stephen M
    BPL Member

    @stephen-m

    Locale: Way up North

    Hi Jen,

    That’s a real shame, have you spoken to Tim\Peter about it?

    I was all up for this technology 2-3 years ago but not so bothered now, I might change one of my bags if WM come out with a new solution but may not.   I have moved away from down clothing for all my trips bar ones at 0F (I still have a monster down park and trousers for this) so not such a big deal for me anymore.

     

     

     

     

    #3377043
    Jennifer Mitol
    BPL Member

    @jenmitol

    Locale: In my dreams....

    I’m going to wait to see if a re-wet and re-dry with the tennis balls does it.  If not, then absolutely I’m going to talk to them about it.  I need to make sure it wasn’t just user-error before I mention it to them.  My thoughts are that the DWR down will need more attention during washing/drying than the untreated version….

    We’ll see.  It didn’t happen the first time I washed it (last year…).

    #3377050
    Stephen M
    BPL Member

    @stephen-m

    Locale: Way up North

    Hopefully it will be ok Jen, if not Tim will look after you.

    Do report back.

    #3377081
    Matt Dirksen
    BPL Member

    @namelessway

    Locale: Mid Atlantic

    Hi Jen,

    In lieu of tennis balls, might I recommend wool dryer balls. We use them in all of our laundry, since they pretty much eliminate the need for any fabric softener.  I have used them for many of our sleeping bags over the years, and they work quite well at de-clumping down. While I do have an Enigma downtek bag, I haven’t washed it, even though I have a couple hundred miles on it. (Perhaps I should smell it when I get home.) I do always wear a full base layer when I sleep in it.

    Anyway, while you can certainly buy wool dryer balls, here’s a link to making them:

    http://www.diynatural.com/how-to-make-wool-dryer-balls/

     

    #3377106
    James holden
    BPL Member

    @bearbreeder-2

    just put some heavy cotton/wool (not expensive ones) socks in the dryer …

    thatll do the same job …

    as to the DWR down … im debating myself wether to get a rab/MH 800 DWR down bag, or a WM 850 fill non DWR down one

    the problem i have is that ill be using the bag with minimal shelter (exposed ledges, WPB bivy bags, small tarps/bothies) … so the DWR may actually be worth it for the condensation resistance

    hmmmmmmm

    ;)

     

     

    #3377135
    Jennifer Mitol
    BPL Member

    @jenmitol

    Locale: In my dreams....

    thanks for the tips guys!

    #3377141
    Stephen M
    BPL Member

    @stephen-m

    Locale: Way up North

    That’s a fair dilemma Eric,

     

    Rab use Nikwax down treatment, could that be applied on a non DWR down bag I wonder.

    #3377223
    James holden
    BPL Member

    @bearbreeder-2

    well im actually debating whether to use a blizzard bag for summer bivies stephen

    ive tested it down to PNW rainy 5C conditions … and they are fairly accurately rated at 8 togs

    all in one bivy and bag for 380g … the problem is the condensation (no down jackets inside unless under synth)

    and the noise … if folks thought a neo air was krinkly, its like a meditation mat compared to the SNAP CRACKLE POP of the blizzard

    but then short bivies arent supposed to be comfortable anyways … yr probably too exhausted to care

    its that or 260 maple syrup dollhaz for the rab neutrino 200, $350 for the MH phantom 32, or $440 for the WM highlite

    the WM will probably last the longest down wise … but i guarantee that ill be putting a hole or rip in the bag before it takes that long with the UL fabrics and putting it down on rocky ledges

    ;)

    #3377235
    Stephen M
    BPL Member

    @stephen-m

    Locale: Way up North

    Hi Eric,

    After sleeping in a Blizzard bag once I definitley would not want to do it again due to the noise (even with ear plugs) unless it’s for its intended use.

    Sounds like the Rab is the way to go, for summer I got a WM Terralite which can be used as a proper bag or quilt, a bit heavy but not overly so.

    Do Mec have any offerings?

     

     

     

    #3377250
    Woubeir (from Europe)
    BPL Member

    @woubeir

    Rab uses Nikwax Hydrophobic Down, which probably uses their Downproof-technology as a basis, but I would be surprised if they would simply get their Hydrophobic Down by applying just the same process, and nothing more, that you can do at home.

    But by using their Down Wash and Downproof, you can make the down in your bag somewhat water repellant.

    #3377253
    Stephen M
    BPL Member

    @stephen-m

    Locale: Way up North

    I have some at home Woubeir, might try it out on a down mitten or bootie.

    #3377264
    Billy Ray
    Spectator

    @rosyfinch

    Locale: the mountains

    Someone might try contacting the companies that provide a down washing service. Being that they likely have MUCH more experience washing down products, they might be able to tell us is this clumping issue is real and if so how bad..

    Billy

    #3377321
    James holden
    BPL Member

    @bearbreeder-2

    Stephen

    MEC has a -3 C 800 fill talon bag, but it weights as much as my EE 20F quilt !!!

    The problem with the rab is that its the neutrino endurance 200, a more resistant shell but 675g for 200g of dwr down is a poor ratio … They must have used every trick in th book to get an en-rating LL of 0C, perhaps some “volkswagen testing” protocol =P

    with our poor maple syrup dollahz the way it is though im forced to buy from what available up here in canuckistan

    otherwise im paying a 50% premium on yankee prices

    on that note for u yankee folks, this is the time to buy mec or dead birds off canadian sites

    with clerance and the exchange rate you get 50-60% off

    ;)

     

    #3377347
    Stephen M
    BPL Member

    @stephen-m

    Locale: Way up North

    Your right Eric on the Rab weights, I remembered looking at their bags years ago and thinking they are heavy for what they are.

    My rule of thumb for 0c is normally 400 grams of down.

    Good call on buying from Canada, I am only 5 hours drive from Toronto so might be worth a visit again soon.

    #3377353
    Ross L
    BPL Member

    @ross

    Locale: Beautiful BC

    Eric

    You have not mentioned the “Dryshell” Taiga Down bags from Vancouver. I was curious as to why you never mention Taiga, too heavy or Dryshell not to your liking? I have a few in my closet that have been very durable that I still sometimes use for ugly conditions. They are a bargain compared to WM.

    https://www.taigaworks.ca/Sleeping-Bags-c7

     

     

     

Viewing 25 posts - 101 through 125 (of 131 total)
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
Forum Posting

A Membership is required to post in the forums. Login or become a member to post in the member forums!

Loading...