Bear learns how to crack Garcia cans at Yosemite

You shouldn't hang a bear canister because since the bears know how to defeat a hang, the canister drops and -ta da- might be compromised just as if it was pushed from the ledge.

We actually chatted with the bear ranger in Yosemite about that bear at the start of our trip. He told us the bear was actually maneuvering the canisters TO the cliffs, sometimes rather large distances actually..the people were not putting them near cliffs…then pushing them off. He said it happened numerous times and warned us to wedge our canisters between rocks and not just place them on the ground as you are normally supposed to do.

Maybe a canister needs to be shaped like a football or egg, so it is difficult to push. We may need to move away from shapes or sizes that suit bpers and move toward what is more resistant to bears/grizz.
Sorry, if one bear gets to be an issue, it may need to be put down if a better solution is not found.
Duane

Backpackers unwilling to protect their food is the problem. Can we put them down ?

Removing the bear doesn't help. The bear is a symptom of backpackers being unwilling to protect their camp.

Yep, I agree there too. I place my canister close enough that I can hear if something is after it. I'm in the camp that believes the canister is a temporary fix to go get your food/chase bear/critter off. More issues with deer slobber.
Duane
PS, maybe we need to place some dummy canisters out, so the bear is not rewarded.

Agreed that some will stay in their tents and not attempt to chase bears away. But some bears are not easily chased away, and persist in their business of trying to get the food despite yelling, banging, etc. What then? They are smart, and presumably some eventually learn that despite the noise, humans are no more than a nuisance in these situations.

"But some bears are not easily chased away, and persist in their business of trying to get the food despite yelling, banging, etc. What then? They are smart, and presumably some eventually learn that despite the noise, humans are no more than a nuisance in these situations."

Use bear spray – negative conditioning.

And lets remember that canisters are marketed as bear resistant.

Ken, that's why I would attempt to scare a bear off. Good reminder to us, resistant.
Duane

When I did the JMT in 1999, a bear used exactly this method – tossing off a cliff – to open a perfectly sealed Garcia used by another hiking party at Cathedral Lakes. We saw them – and the remains of their Garcia – at Tuolumne Meadows.

Rangers up and down the trail, not wanting to believe a Garcia could be breached by a bear, decided…Not to believe the story.

If it had been an Ursack breached, would they have believed it? A Bear Vault?

I don't know what to say re: What to do about the smart bears who figure this out. My personal response is generally not to hike in Yosemite, which does not have the most spectacular Sierras backpacking anyway.

– Elizabeth

"Use bear spray – negative conditioning"

My understanding was bear spray is illegal in Yosemite and Kings Canyon National Parks.

I think the term they use is "prohibited."

Black bears in Yosemite aren't nearly as dangerous as grizzly bears in Yellowstone, for which bear spray is appropriate. They normally run away from people, and a well-thrown rock often completes that job.

–B.G.–

WTF – REALLY?

I carried a big canister of bear spray with me in Yosemite from White Wolf up the Tuolmne to the Meadows and so did some of my hiking buddies and no ranger said a word!

I will frikikin' ABSOLUTELY carry bear spray in ANY bear country, even if I have to hide it in a front pouch.

"No weapons"
They must consider bear spray a weapon.

In Yosemite, there are no grizzly bears, therefore there is no need for bear spray.

Rangers may have seen it hanging on a belt, but they figure that it wasn't worth the hassle of saying anything about it, or else some California Democrat may have complained to a congressman.

In California, bear spray is sold at some REI stores, and that seems like a real marketing ploy for REI.

–B.G.–

"Who do we thank, Yogi?"

That's great! :)
Duane

I'll bet the USFS and Park Service did this ban in response to some tie-dyed California Uber Liberals' campaign. They need to concentrate on their crystals and spiritual "vortexes" and stay the hell out of backpacking matters.

I'm a former Peace Corps Volunteer, two time Obama campaign worker and Sierra Club member so my creds as a "Liberale" are up to snuff. (Never mind my NRA membership.;o)

But this nannying has now gone too far. Black bears DO attack people. I'll pay a fine if necessary for the comfort of being relatively safer, thank you very much.

Eric, I totally support your right to carry bear spray in the back country of Yosemite. That said, I've been hiking there for over 25 years and I can't imagine ever needing bear spray. And I've had plenty of bear encounters.

Umm, maybe there's a reasonable explanation for the ban? I don't know, maybe too many instances of drunken campers in the valley blinding children with bear spray? Things like that…more damage inflicted than is warranted by the very small risk of a bear attack. (Has there ever been a bear attack at Yosemite Valley?) Bears wander through crowded campgrounds every evening; people who don't know what they're doing spraying bear spray all around could be a hazard. But that's just a guess.

I think that tie dye and crystals went out after Silicon Valley became the official brand of California…now we rail against the coffee swilling technobrats…

I did find where Yosemite specifically bans the stuff, no explanation given. I'd love to know the rational (or lack thereof).

Look at how dumb this rule is

1. I can carry a gun (with a CHL) but even with a CHL I can't have non-lethal bear spay. Huh, I can have a lethal weapon but not a non-lethal one?

2. I can drive a car past preschoolers but I'm considered too dumb to handle a can of bear spray.

3. I can buy a hunting license and run around the National Forest land just outside the park with a high powered rifle capable of killing a man half a mile away, but I'm still too dumb to safely carry bear spray.

4. Millions of people in other states carry bear spray and pepper spray (and fully lethal handguns for that matter) with minimal problems but for some reason we can't have them in Yosemite and SEKI.

This "Big Brother knows best" is the kind of thinking caused me to leave CA as quickly as I could. I also quite taking jobs in New York state. It not just bear spray, its hundreds of little ways people who don't know me try and control me for my own good.

"This "Big Brother knows best" is the kind of thinking caused me to leave CA as quickly as I could. I also quite taking jobs in New York state…."

So it's a win-win-win. What a great country!

Yeah I think the folks in New York got tired of saying "No Luke we can't do that here."

I did have some great friends in both states and they are both nice places. I just didn't fit in, everything I tried to do had a rule involved.

Now I'm in West Texas and I love it, friendly people, good local government and I'm not that far from the mountains.

"Now I'm in West Texas and I love it, friendly people, good local government and I'm not that far from the mountains."

Let us once again celebrate diversity. It is one of the great strengths of this country that darn near everyone can find a place where they're comfortable.

Even me. ;0)

Let us once again celebrate diversity. It is one of the great strengths of this country that darn near everyone can find a place where they're comfortable.

+1

I had to leave the East. Born, raised, then ran

Really Ken you fled the east? What ran you off? Or was it the mountains?

Hee hee,

And now I'M in Nevada, not that Pennsylvania was all that bad as far as regulations go.

But here in Nevada I don't have to worry that my PS90 carbine magazines have a 50 round capability or that the total length is 1.5" less than the PR of CA permits, even though it meets Federal requirements!

Yeah, I know this is one of the least socially responsible states and our K- 12 public education ranks 50 out of 50 in the US, meaning BELOW Mississippi. That bothers me but the general freedoms I enjoy are nice. I assuage my guilt over state weaknesses by giving generously to the Salvation Army and local Food Bank.

Amd I do carry bear spray in our mountains here for protection from the "odd" mountain lion. No bears in s. Nevada.