What to do when encountering dogs on the trail?

[Kattt]

From my experience dogs , when away from home, will bark and act intimidating when they sense fear, because our fear makes them feel like there is something to be afraid of.
Just recently, at work, there was a loose pit bull with a servicedog vest ( yeah right…). Owner sleeping on a bench. The dog chased off a student. I walked up to talk to the owner. The dog ran at me barking and jumping. Had it been pretty much another breed I would have yelled at it to get the F@$& away from me, which has always worked wjhen they act aggressively, and not at home. Being that it was a pit bull, I failed to convince it that I was calm and reassured. My insides were shaking and I knew the dog knew and there was this vicious cycle. The owner approached so very slowly, which bothered me but I know that it reassured his dog.
Anyway, long story….all ended well thankfully.
I own a dog and have owned many throughout the years. Have been on both ends of the situation, with a barking Aussie puppy of mine jumping around someone that screamed in fear. I knew that if they only chilled out it would end immediately, but fear is fear and nothing good can come of that.
Some dogs are easier and nicer off leash, but on the trail it can upset people so I don't do that.

Wht about off leash bears??? Maybe we should sue the state ….
;) (really)

[Kattt]

Oh, to answer OP..
If they act nice/ ignore you, do the same.
If they come at you barking and jumping a bit , I would act the way they tell you to do with a mountain lion. Plus yell at them to get the F away, as calmly as you can.

[Gary Dunckel]

I'll probably have to practice yelling calmly, Kat. I'm not quite sure how one does that, or what it would sound like. Is it like loudly whispering until your throat hurts?

[Randy Nelson]

I carry Spray Shield (citronella spray) when I have a dog with me, which is almost always. Haven't used it yet but a dog trainer recommended it to me. Almost used it last week walking near my house when a new dog that is on an invisible fence bolted right through it after stopping at it the previous times we saw him. But he stopped short when I yelled at him and ended up following us at a distance for a quarter mile or so until he gave up.

I don't carry it if I don't have a dog along. I'm more worried about my dogs getting attacked than I am about myself. I went on two trips last year without a dog and both times had a dog charge me. Each time I instinctively crossed my trekking poles so they were facing the dog like the dog's neck would hit the x if it kept coming. Both times the dogs stopped immediately. Not sure if that was just lucky or what.

[Eli Zabielski]

"I'll probably have to practice yelling calmly, Kat. I'm not quite sure how one does that, or what it would sound like. Is it like loudly whispering until your throat hurts?"

Really? You just speak loudly and assertively. Some people would consider this yelling.

[Ian]

"Really? You just speak loudly and assertively. Some people would consider this yelling."

Eli, I suspect you've never been married.

[Gary Dunckel]

Hmmm…speaking loudly and assertively, or yelling? That doesn't quite fit my idea of "calm." But I get it, Eli, I really do.

[W I S N E R !]

I prefer immediately mounting the offending dog to show alpha dominance.

[Nick Gatel]

"I prefer immediately mounting the offending dog to show alpha dominance."

How does one go about mounting a Min Pin? :)

[Kattt]

Yeah fine, not my first language…
Speak out loudly and calmly.

Now tell me what you call it if you say fairly loudly and assertively to get the F@&$ away from you!!,
I would feel yelled at, but I am sensitive, so..

[Cayenne Redmonk]

tell me what you call it if you say fairly loudly and assertively to get the F@&$ away from you!!,

I hate blind dates.

[Ian]

"I prefer immediately mounting the offending dog to show alpha dominance."

Nostril launched coffee and keyboards don't mix.

[Edward Z]

Reference the min pin….just don't lead em as much.

[Sharon J.]

"I'm of the opinion with my very limited experience that dogs will stop barking/growling when they have committed to attack. If they are still barking or growling, I feel that they are giving me a courtesy warning. "

Absolutely. From a trainer's blog

"All of that lunging and barking is their way of saying, “Stay away from me! Don’t make me come over there!” In truth, they don’t want to come over there. What they want is for the scary thing to vanish into oblivion, preferably yesterday. But think about this: if a dog really meant to attack, he would. The lunging, barking dog is spending precious energy on a display that, if heeded, will actually avoid conflict. But if a dog is very still, staring, body fairly humming with tension, he’s conserving his energy. That is a dog who should cause the hairs on your own neck to stand up, because he might very well attack."

more here:
https://wildewmn.wordpress.com/2013/06/04/the-threat-of-stillness/

[BlackHatGuy]

"I prefer immediately mounting the offending dog to show alpha dominance."

We will NEVER hike toge…… oh, dog. Ummmmmm, never mind, we're good…..

[Jennifer Mitol]

I frequently have CharlieDog off leash…and I started doing this for both our safety. I found that while he was on the lead, he would lunge at every single hiker we passed. I worked with trainers, two behaviorists…all with the same result. Off leash, on the other hand, he's a totally different dog. He hikes on the trail only (kinda cool, actually), and almost always second in line. He's got a spot on recall, leave it, etc.

HOWEVER…

There are times he sees hikers up ahead…and he runs to greet them. Guess what happens? "Aw, what a great dog you have! What's in his pack?" Pet pet pet, scratch, scratch, scratch, pet some more…

Chuck runs out of line and is rewarded for his bad behavior EVERY SINGLE TIME.

As for the OP question: I agree that if the dog is barking and growling, be assertive, say NO strongly and firmly…and recognize that the dog is a) startled b) sensing your being startled and/or c) protecting turf/owner. I like the idea of crossing your poles in front of you …

I wonder what would happen if you just gave the pup some of your jerky?

[Ken Thompson]

I make nice with the dog. Has worked so far. Really surprised a woman with her protector a few weeks back. Buds in seconds. Dogs know too if you are a dog person or not. Firm, assertive non threatening works for me with the ones that seem a little aggravated. They're missing the sofa and are cranky. Cut them some slack. The dogs, not the owners.

[Justin Baker]

Most dogs are all bark and no bite.

I was nearly trampled by a pack of pitbulls running through our camp at 6 a.m. at Terrace Creek in Big Sur. Please control your dogs and don't let them harass or annoy others. Or better yet take them on remote trails or off trail so you don't have to worry about it.

[rmeurant]

Not to mention what to do when encountering wild yaks on the trail?

(Zanskari experience, just below a pass on a narrow track. Though to be sure, it seemed gentle enough).

[Michael Gillenwater]

Sorry, I probably should keep my mouth shut. And its been hashed over on previous threads. But I here it is: I don't like dog's on the trail.

Especially in designated wilderness areas. Emotionally, I like pets. Always had a combination of four or more growing up (dogs, cats, turtles, fish, hamsters, rabbits, hermit crabs, etc.). Emotionally, they can be great. I find it emotionally comforting to have a dog around. But rationally and environmentally, I know that most pets are sort of a disaster. The stats make this clear. I can live with the tradeoff because they bring a lot of happiness to many people. But I am not OK with the tradeoff in wilderness. I just don't like seeing a dog run wild out on the trail in a place we are only supposed to be a visitor and minimize our impact. On the trail, I try to tread lightly and minimize disturbance to the natural systems and to other hikers. Dogs seem to be unavoidably counter to that objective.

I sort of feel the same way about horses in wilderness, mainly for one reason. How many trails have we all seen destroyed by horse pack trains. Just one train of horses on a muddy trail can destroy years of train maintenance.

OK, now argue or attack if you must. I just felt like a counterpoint here was missing.

This feeling has only intensified as I have started backpacking with my young daughters. I have already had multiple encounters where large dogs off leach come running up (or from behind) with ambiguous intentions and scaring the crap out of my girls. It is one think for this to happen to a full grown adult. But another when you weigh 50 or 60 pounds. There have been a couple of occasions where it took real self control for me to still be polite to these "dog owners." I want my girls to fall in love with the backcountry like I did. I never remember seeing dogs out on the trail when I was young (except hunting dogs in particular contexts). This seems to be more common that it was 20 or 30 or so years ago.

[Tipi Walter]

Justin Baker's comment about pitbulls reminded me of a trip I did recently in March.

I took my little Shih Tzu out on a 16 day wilderness trip and he starts out great.

Here he is after the trip. Ha ha ha.

JUST KIDDING

Now, to respond to Michael's No Dogs in the Wilderness post. First off, the hunting lobby from Virginia down thru North Carolina, Tennessee and Georgia would never agree to not use their dogs for hunting which for the most part roam freely thruout wilderness areas and are unsupervised. In my mind, as a backpacker, these dogs are abandoned and if a pet owner did the same he'd be cited. Ya just can't dump your dog off in the woods and drive away. Hunters do it all the time.

But Michael's comment "I just don't like seeing a dog run wild out on the trail in a place we are only supposed to be a visitor and minimize our impact." Both humans and dogs are supposed to be temporary visitors to wilderness areas—both the humans and the dogs will leave soon enough. So there's no problem in my mind. While I do see coyotes living out and while I wish the red wolf would repopulate my mountains, I do not see domesticated dogs living in permanent packs—they are just visitors, like us. No problem.

What irks me in the Southeast wilderness areas I visit are the near constant overhead jet traffic noise, the Army flying nap-of-the-earth helicopter training missions (yes, right over the wilderness), the screaming and roaring motorcycles on "scenic motor loop" roads 10 miles from our camps, and the TN valley air pollution making the GSMNP the most polluted in the country. The weathermen actually tell people to stay indoors. Compared to this crap, dogs have no impact whatsoever.

But I agree that horses destroy a place and if you want proof just look at what they do in the Mt Rogers backcountry in Virginia.

[Hiking Malto]

"I sort of feel the same way about horses in wilderness, mainly for one reason. How many trails have we all seen destroyed by horse pack trains. Just one train of horses on a muddy trail can destroy years of train maintenance."

Just keep in mind that many of the hiking trails that we love to hike were built and are maintained by horses and horse people. Agree completely that irresponsible horse people (and hikers) in the early season can reek havoc on a trail. Now back to dogs……

[Mark Ries]

I wonder if a person who is scared of dogs(and maybe for good reason) sees having a large scary dog coming towards them with owner a ways back like having some mean looking guy come down the trail pointing a gun at them appearing to have the intention of pulling the trigger and then some one a ways back yells "its OK he won't shoot you its not even loaded … its not is it Roger?" I'm asking a question not making a statement so please keep that in mind. Is that a good analogy? I am better at reading dogs than I am at people. I don't trust people till they prove they can be trusted and the same with dogs, actually I usually trust dogs much quicker they are far more honest. I'm not scared of to many people I meet on the trail or dogs but I have been. I think this is a great topic as every time I go out on the trail I meet clueless or worse yet pet owners that just don't care about the feelings or rights of others I've made a lot of mistakes on the trail with my dogs it is my responsibility as dog owner to look after my dogs and follow the rules the op shouldn't have to be posting this question he really should not be disrespected in any way. If you really know dogs the answers range from ignoring it to try to kill it, the dog that is.

[Tipi Walter]

Gotta have some levity—

Not all dogs are bad in the wilderness. This one enjoys reading thru a Campmor catalog. (Cherry Log Gap, Citico wilderness TN).

[Randy Nelson]

"I frequently have CharlieDog off leash…and I started doing this for both our safety. I found that while he was on the lead, he would lunge at every single hiker we passed."

Jen, have you tried a Gentle Leader AKA Halti? The dog in my avatar has a very soft trachea, for lack of a better description, and any pressure on his throat at all causes him to cough badly. The first day of obedience class the trainer came over before the class started and asked if he had kennel cough. Training was/is very easy with him except he wants to visit with every dog he sees and will pull to do so. It's tough to correct because of his trachea. So I got a Gentle Leader and problem solved. He will not even try to pull with it on. But I don't use it on the trail as I use trekking poles and don't want him right beside me. I use a flexi lead attached to my waist belt and his pack and have him lead or follow. Probably the main reason he doesn't lunge on the trail is because we don't pass people directly on the trail. When we encounter other hikers, we get off the trail and he's put in a sit/stay until they pass. Just like we do for encountering horses. It helps put people at ease and if they ask to visit with him, he's released. I don't see anyone else do this but it's worked well for us. Sure it slows you down a little on a busy trail but we try to avoid those for the most part anyway. When we're passing others in the same direction, I shorten the lead and move briskly past.

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