Mini Caldera Cone awesomenessness
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Jan 31, 2013 at 12:44 am #1298674jason quickSpectator
@jaseLocale: A tent in my backyard - Melbourne
Dan Durston’s quest for his ultimate cook pot system resulted in the pursuit of my own, more simplified cooking system. My version incorporated the TD sidewinder with an Evernew 600 pot. I loved it, and have used it in conjunction with Zelph’s Starlyte on every trip since.
What has emerged now is a newfound love of Esbit. Sure, I’ve used it many times before, but now…I just can’t see past it…I love it! This led me to change things a little further, so I grew more determined to improve on my own system yet again.
So, in addition to Dan's criteria set out in the earlier thread, which were:
1. Simpler than 4 pieces
2. Lights easily in deep winter (Aussie winter anyway…lol)
3. Could be lighter
4. Could pack even better
I added the following criteria (essentially, as small, efficient and functionally simple as possible):
1. Dedicated Esbit stove
2. My pot had to be my mug…anything more is superfluous
3. My mug just had to have handles, simply because grabbing it with my Buff or whatever is simply a pain in the *ss…I’m over that.
4. I needed, at most, a volume of approx. 400ml. Anything larger and the mug becomes too big in volume for my standard cuppa (250ml), plus, my MYOG dehydrated meals rarely need more than 350mls of boiling water for rehydration.
5. The mug had to have the widest base I could find – helping with the efficiency of the Esbit burn
6. It had to be in a caldera cone…nothing beats the efficiency and simplicity of a caldera cone IMHO
7. The caldera cone had to be a sidewinder-type set up…so it fit inside the mug for storage
Wow…that’s a lot of criteria!!! So…. what I came up with was the Evernew EBY265 400ml Ti Mug. With a diameter of approx. 100ml, and a height of approx. 57mm, this mug was perfect.
One thing though, it didn’t come with a lid. I contacted Josh from Ruta Locura with the dimensions, and he recommended a couple of options. My first preference was the #2 carbon fiber lid. It fits like a treat.
I was initially going to MYOG a Caldera Cone using a Youtube tutorial, but after speaking with the guys at Trail Designs, I decided to go with TD simply because they make a great cone, and whilst I could have made one, nothing beats their dovetail joining, accuracy and finish. I asked them to make the cone fit inside the mug like a sidewinder. This meant however, that I would have to use a silicone band to set the height above the stove….no problem. I still have the packaging from the TD crew, where in the corner of the packet it says “…now that’s a small cone…Enjoy!”
What I ended up with from the crew at Trail Designs was the cone, plus they kindly threw in some extras including a ground up Gram Cracker, a couple of silicone bands and a titanium ground plate. How awesome was that!? I used their ground up Ti Gram Cracker, which works a treat…simply acting like a U shape with walls that press in on the sides of the Esbit (same philosophy as their normal Gram Cracker)…works well for when I want to use full Esbit tabs.
So, what have I now got now?…. a dedicated Esbit burning mug/pot that nests inside a custom caldera cone from TD, set to the height of 1.25 inches above my MYOG Brian Green Esbit Tray stove. Happy as a pig in ____! You'll probably notice how bent the Esbit Tray Stove is, that's because it's a test run made from flashing…so it's nice and bendy. I wanted to see if I could achieve even better flame control by being able to bend the sides in more when using the narrower, 4g Esbit tabs.
I forgot to mention, just as a precaution, I purchased the Snow Peak Hot Lips (thanks David Thomas! :-)), which hooks on and wraps around this mug really well. It adds an extra 3 grams to the total weight…whatever. I also considered simply using the silicone pot ring as the lip protector…sliding it up higher before I drink….but that would just be annoying after a while.
Total weight for this mini, efficient UL cook system is 85 grams.
So far, average burn time for one cup of water is sitting at around 5 minutes, using about one third of a 14g Esbit. Although, quite frankly, now I have this set up, I don’t really care about burn times. I’ve managed to bring one cup to boil using 7g worth of Esbit…as in…starting with a new, half Esbit cut lengthways. This is a good thing, so I ordered a heap of 4g Esbit tabs the other day. That way, I can use a couple at a time, and not worry about carrying half burnt Esbit… I simply let them burn out. Alternatively, I can use 3 little blocks totalling 12g which actually works really well for when I bring 350ml to the boil for dinners.
The set up can store 3 full Esbits inside the cone, and two on the outside, plus there is room for a half light-load towel and mini-Bic lighter. Enough for a decent adventure that's for sure!
I got a bit carried away with my testing, and had the Esbit burning so huge that the flame came up through the handle cut out, and burnt through one of my silicone bands. Bummer. I may try something else here if anyone has any ideas…such as cork, or even some sort of permanent tabs type thing glued on to the outside of the pot. Anything to reduce the likelihood of burning through another band, avoiding the need for material to run through the handle portion of the mug.
Any ideas there?
Otherwise, I’m very happy.
I’m thinking of naming this stove …M.E.U.L. Mini. Efficient. Ultra-light. ☺
Edit: Mini Bic.Jan 31, 2013 at 12:51 am #1949185t.darrahBPL Member
@thomdarrahLocale: Southern Oregon
AWESOMENESS + 1Jan 31, 2013 at 1:18 am #1949187Jan 31, 2013 at 5:21 am #1949214Ken ThompsonBPL Member
@hereLocale: Right there
Looks like a ULC
Nice, tidy kit.Jan 31, 2013 at 8:54 am #1949272
This is great. I love a compact cook setup. The custom Caldera cone and carbon fiber lid look pretty sweet too.Jan 31, 2013 at 12:40 pm #1949356Dan DurstonBPL Member
@dandydanLocale: Canadian Rockies
Wow that's an awesome (cute?) little setup for it's intended purpose.
Please tell me more about the silicone band burning. I've never had trouble with mine, but my distance from the stove to the band is also quite a bit higher (~3.5"). Did the band quickly burn through? Or was it a slow process where you have time to save it?Jan 31, 2013 at 1:41 pm #1949393AnonymousInactive
Jason, would mind posting a picture of your 400 and .6 side by side? Thanks.Jan 31, 2013 at 9:01 pm #1949526jason quickSpectator
@jaseLocale: A tent in my backyard - Melbourne
I'd call it cute too.
As for the silicone band burning, well…it was kinda my fault. I was using a full esbit, and let it rip. I also don't think I had the stove centred properly either. The flame came up through the cut-out for the handle. I was a little distracted and let it go instead of attending to it straight away. It burned through about half, and still held its elasticity. It snapped on the next burn. I've since put my second band on, with no issues at all. I just got cocky with my testing. BTW, the distance from stove to band is about 23/4"
Sure, below are photos of my Evernew 600 agains the smaller Evernew 400 mug.
Jan 31, 2013 at 9:25 pm #1949535Eric BlumensaadtBPL Member
@danepackerLocale: Mojave Desert
Welcome to the Caldera Cone fan club. I too use a Sidewinder and a 3 cup aluminum pot (& plastic cup).
I love ESBIT with a CC Sidewinder. With the "Gram Cracker" ESBIT holder and the cone I now use about 30% less fuel than with my previous best ESBIT setup. And believe me, I've experimented with ESBIT for almost two decades. That Gram Cracker holder keeps the ESBIT sides from burning thus controlling the flame for a bit longer burn time. But Brian's ESBIT tray to contain the liquid is genius! I'm gonna make one.
With the optional Inferno wood burning gassifier stove I can winter camp without being forced to carry a load of white gas bottles and my heavy MSR Dragonfly stove.
Plus after dinner I still have a cheery but contained campfire.
** P. S. I'm now making a better ESBIT holder from Brian Green's Blog pattern. It works like the Gram Cracker but saves (and burns) the liquid residue for a longer burn time (reportedly 15 minutes) and no residue dripping onto the aluminum or Ti baseplate under the holder. Still MORE fuel savings!Apr 5, 2013 at 9:58 am #1973095KiTemoBPL Member
you have 2 superb cooksets, thank you for showing them.
i wonder if this pot/cone would work in alcohol mode?
would starlyte (caldera modified) fit inside your evernew eby 265?
could you post some pictures in this mode?
MonikaMay 10, 2013 at 2:31 am #1985026Marc KokoskyBPL Member
@mak52580Locale: Washington, DC Area
+1. I'd also be interested if this could take the Starlyte modified.May 29, 2013 at 7:22 am #1990761Pierre LambionMember
Very sweet setup indeed.
How much can you fill the 400ml cup without spilling boiling water out?
I currently use a 700ml mug and consider switching to a small wide & low cup for heating water plus a light bowl (like the GSI plastic one)to rehydrate and eat.
– a touch lighter
– can heat more water while re-hydrating and eating
– cup more efficient to heat than tall mug
– bowl gentler on fingers with hot food and easier to clean than tall mug
But this is only living room thinking and am concerned a 400ml cup might just be too small for practical use.May 29, 2013 at 7:43 am #1990767TJ WBPL Member
What is a simple list of all articles used? And would you even use a mini plastic canister from caldera to keep it enclosed and debris free in your bag or does it all stow perfectly? Thx!May 29, 2013 at 8:10 am #1990782
After seeing this thread I've put together a nearly identical setup.
All of the items fit within the Evernew pot with the carbon fiber lid from Ruta Locura. I've found that a small rubber band keeps the lid from slipping off.
1. Evernew 400ml Companion Cup (EBY265) (1.77oz)
2. Trail Designs Ti Sidewinder – Custom Size (0.62oz w/ Rubber Band to keep its form)
3. Esbit tray – design from Brian Green
4. Esbit Tabs (I can fit 4 full tabs in the cavity of the sidewinder cone for a total of 8 boils.
5. Snow Peak Hot Lips
6. Mini Bic
7. Carbon Fiber lid from Ruta Locura (0.25oz)
8. Towel (Can't tell but looks like a cut down Lightload towel maybe?) I use a reusable Branwy type.
[Edit] – Added some weights. My total setup with Pot, Sidewinder, Beer Band, Esbit Tray (made from aluminum flashing), Carbon Fiber Lid, Snow Peak Hotlips, Mini Bic, and small rubber band to keep the lid on weighs in at 3.25ozJun 1, 2013 at 3:46 pm #1992273
Looks like this little system is gaining some popularity. Trail Designs now has a setup for us "Fringe" hikers wanting a 400ml pot.Jun 1, 2013 at 3:52 pm #1992276
I know you have the same gram scale that I have…
Could you let me know what the weight of the stove and the sidewinder are (by themselves).
(update: looks like I would need to know the weight of the band too, as its required. might as well let me know the weight of the lid too, I suppose. lol)
I would never use it in wood mode so I just care about the pot and sidewinder.
I use the BGET too.
Thanks mate!Jun 1, 2013 at 5:12 pm #1992297
I've updated my post above with weights. Let me know if you need it totally itemized :P.
FYI, my cone does not have the four hole punches for use in wood mode with stakes. Perhaps they've made some refinements.Jun 1, 2013 at 10:52 pm #1992359
You rock dude, thanks!!
So, thoughts on it over the Zelph/Suluk setup you got??Jun 2, 2013 at 12:53 am #1992369PineyBPL Member
I like it. Why not punch two holes for a ti stake though, you'd save the weight of the band. You could mock it up in heavy paper first to refine placement.Jun 2, 2013 at 8:29 am #1992436
@Drew, The stakes (two of them) are intended for wood burning or alcohol mode. Being that I'm using it with Esbit I don't need the holes. I could add them myself or send it in for the modification if I change my mind.
@John, I am liking the Caldera setup more. The handles are a big benefit as well as the stability of the pot with the wider cone base. It is easier to clean the Esbit soot off of the Evernew base and the mug can double for tea or coffee; something that I didn't feel the Zelph 2-cup pot could do. Now for the negatives, I finally found a great spoon for the Zelph pot, a MSR holding spoon, but it is too long to fit in the Evernew. I end up stashing the spoon in my food bag instead. The Evernew does not have indicators for 1/2, 1/3 cup etc. These would be nice and I'm contemplating scoring the inside of the cup for my typical freeze dried meal water requirements.
EDIT: 07 APRIL 2015 | I've since purchased a new 400ml Companion Cup which does include indicators for 1/2, 1/3 cup measurements.
All in all I really like the Caldera setup. It is my first product from Trail Designs and it already has me looking at a larger setup (600ml?) for trips with my wife or father.Jun 2, 2013 at 5:39 pm #1992571Joe LBPL Member
@heyyouLocale: Cutting brush off of the Arizona Tr
A bail handle is lighter if you can tolerate holding and drinking from your cup with something that protects your hand. Is it the cup that you like to drink from, or the finger sized handles for holding the cup, or both? A bail handle does not require the cutout on the side of the cone, somewhat protecting the band from high flames.
What are you using to rehydrate your food–your Ti cup, freezer bags, or a plastic bowl?Jun 2, 2013 at 6:52 pm #1992596Adam KilpatrickBPL Member
@oystersLocale: South Australia
I'm interested in going something like this. I'd like the option of alcohol though. Anyone tried a small alcohol stove yet? Maybe something like a simple tea light stove or a Sgt Rocks Ion stove. I figure the output would need to be very low, so those stoves are probably the way to go.
One thing I personally don't like the idea of is having to put the C Cone inside the pot after burning Esbit. Even though that is the best way to store it…I just hate the idea of getting gunk on the inside of my pot (don't care at all about the outside). Does anyone else find this an issue? Or should I just put the windscreen inside a small snaplock… hmm…Jun 2, 2013 at 7:12 pm #1992604Eric BlumensaadtBPL Member
@danepackerLocale: Mojave Desert
I use my CC Ti Sidewinder with ESBIT a lot but I store it in its own tiny stuffsack.
Nestled inside my 3 cup mating pot is a cut down Glad plastic fridge bowl and a plastic drinking/measuring cup. The pot goes in a stuffsack. No room for the stove in the pot. Bowl and cup weight 1.6 oz.
ESBIT gunk is (mostly) wiped off with leaves, grass and a very light plastic scratch pad and water before storing. Ya gotta do it every time you cook.Jun 2, 2013 at 7:21 pm #1992609Chad “Stick” PoindexterBPL Member
@stickLocale: Southeast USA
I also used the little tyvek sleeve to store my cone before putting it inside the cook pot. With my 1.3L set-up, it has been used for lots of both wood & Esbit, however, the Tyvek sleeve does an excellent job at keeping the soot away from the inside of the pot.
As far as the Esbit stove, I use a fold over sandwich bag to store the stove in before putting it inside my pot.
I use the Starlyte stove with my cone, and I found that it will fit perfectly inside the cone (which is rolled up inside the tyvek sleeve).Jun 3, 2013 at 9:48 am #1992781Nate BoyerBPL Member
looks like this is out of stock at traildesigns.com
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