Why no bivy love?

I don't own a bivy and I don't think I ever will. Getting changed, having a 'shower' (wet-wipes wipe down), cooking/eating and waiting out rain I cannot imagine doing in a bivy. I have the rainbow tarptent and for some the 1.2kg is a big no-no but I am stoked to own it. No bugs, no rain, plenty of room and for me what it offers I will definitely be happy with the 1.2kg sacrifice!!

Sleeping in a bivy feels like sleeping in a sleeping bag- open a zipper and get out. I carry a Cuben/eVent bivy and a 4×9 cuben tarp for a total of 10.5oz. Good setup for mild weather or snow. I suggest one with extra girth to fit thick pads. To me tents are for wind and rain/storms.

To me tents are for wind and rain/storms.

yes that is why I don't use a bivvy. That and bugs.
If on the other hand I hiked where it never rains, bugs are not about and wind is not too much of a problem, I would use a bivvy, in fact I would probably use just a sleeping bag.
Franco

I picked up a large/wide side zip bivy from Borah Gear. 6.5oz, M50 top, sil bottom. I love the thing. It's my first bivy. I always assumed it would be claustrophobic and irritating, but it's a complete nonissue. That was a barrier for me with getting into tarps for a long time.

It feels no different than getting in and out of a sleeping bag, except I have a net overtop myself. Adds some warmth to the bag, keeps the splashes off be under my 5×9 tarp and I'm just generally happier knowing nothing can crawl into the bag with me. I was a complete convert to tarp+bivy by the first night.

With the weight that you can get a tent for nowadays they just make more sense. You can get a full hexamid with everything for under 10 ounces. Talk about waiting a storm out in a bivy that would suck. A few weeks ago we had golf ball sized hail coming down really hard one night. I was glad to be able to sit up, read, pack up and organize things, cook, etc all in my tent. I have a fly creek ul1 (31.9 ounces) by the way, and I'm looking for something lighter.

It's all about conditions.
And of course, how people want to deal with the conditiions.

In many of the cases here on BPL, I suspect that there are two main reasons for not using bivvies.

The first is that the bivy is often used to shield rain splash when using a small tarp. However, the 6-7 ounces of bivvy weight could also just as easily be carried as 6-7 ounces of bigger tarp that would cover you without rain spray. So, there is a certain group of users who say, "Just get a bigger tarp".

The second is condensation. This is probably the biggest one.
The breathable bivy, when used in conditions which create condensation, just brings the condensation down from the tent, right on/in to the bivy.
Presumably, a main reason for having the bivy is to keep dry. If the condensation is wetting the bag in the bivvy, it doesn't make for happy users.
However, in low-humidity conditions in some southwestern climates, perhaps condensation isn't a big deal. But I assure you that in the muggy southeast, or in winter conditions which may affect the insulation of the sleeping bag from moisture, ending in "insulation collapse", it can be a big deal.
In any case, condensation can be a comfort problem, and it does happen in bivvies.
Many would prefer to have the condensation happen on the tent walls/roof, and just avoid touching it. Or use a double-wall tent.

In favor of the bivy, it is highly useful for keeping bugs away.
But, so is an inner net-tent which weighs about the same.

I think for all the favorable reasons that I have heard about having a bivy, I have heard an equal number of unfavorable reasons.
IMO, the best way to run a bivy is to have a waterproof bivy, and use a VBL layer inside it to keep your body moisture from condensing inside the bivy or inside the sleeping bag.

I use a Bivy in snowholes and single skin shelters, I used to open Bivy when I was a teenager but value my comforts too much now.

As far as I am concerned, I live in backpacking heaven–Colorado. And beautiful Wyoming is just a bit north of me. My Ti Goat Bivy gives me a tremendous amount of flexibility with my choice of sites for the night. I don't always have to pitch my tarp if the weather is good. Cowboy camping is pure joy! The bivy keeps the occasional mosquito or ant off, keeps the cool katabatic breeze from sneaking under my quilt, and gives me a great view and the sense of "being out" in the places that I love.

I do use a minimal tarp and many times just my MLD silnylon poncho and the bivy does help with the concern of rain or hail bounce. With a bivy I don't have to take a ground cloth or a mosquito head net which I would need with a larger tarp. And the ground cloth and head net when weighed together may add up to 2 to 2.5 ounces. So for freedom, flexibility, etc. the bivy and small tarp equals a large tarp with ground cloth and mosquito netting. Condensation has rarely been a problem for me in the arid West.

That's just my 2 cents.

Seems pretty 50/50. I live in SoCal so condensation has never really been an issue. Are these the companies that probably make the best sacks?

LMD Superlight
Borah
Ti Goat
Oware

Am I missing any?

Thanks for all the responses!

Six Moon Designs Meteor

http://www.sixmoondesigns.com/bivy/meteor.html

Currently out of stock but there are MYOG plans and patterns available on their website.

http://www.sixmoondesigns.com/images/stories/pdf/Pattern_Meteor.pdf

Party On,

Newton

Thanks, that one seems to be a little different than the other as it looks like 1/2 of it is big net. Probably be better if someone had a condensation problem

Pretty sure we answered your “why no bivy love” 10 days before you posted this identical question over at http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=67904&skip_to_post=580386#580386.

I think this is a situation of not needing a bivy but simply wanting one.

I have used many different types over the years but have really gotten tired of the condensation issues. I no longer use them.

Oh John, you'll just have to fogive him not assuming you have all of the answers.

If I am going to use a bivy I would rather just bring only a bivy. By the time you get a bivy + tarp the weight would be greater than or equal to a tent with bug netting. And being able to do things inside a tent is priceless compared to the confinement of a bivy.

That is a good point. Several years ago, a tarp and bivy combination was the lightest configuration you could find. But with the advent of lighter fabrics and new designs, there is really no benefit to the combination.

If you want a bivy, I highly recommend the John West Borah bivy. John will work with you to get exactly what you need/want for a very fair price.

I love bivy camping. I have found them to be a pretty nice alternative in most conditions either with or without a tarp. Mine (REI Minimalist) kind of sucks when it is hot and buggy at the same time. I wonder if a more breathable one would work better in those conditions. I am tempted with the Ti Goat Ptarmigan.

I really like poncho/tarps, both the feel of sleeping under a small tarp and the dual use as rain gear and pack cover, but with any small tarp a bivy is usually needed for a little extra protection when the weather gets a little crazy.

They certainly have limitations, but depending on what your objectives are they can be a nice choice. And since I spent $35 on my tarp + $70 for my bivy, I have a nice light (13.5oz) system at a fraction of the cost of a tent with a similar weight.

-David

Thanks guys! I think I'm going to pick one up. I live in SoCal and usually just camp in good wester so I think a lot of times I'll just be bring the Bivy with no tarp so I'll have a 7 oz bug and wind shelter. I'm usually sleeping in a hammock, Bivy is just when I'm goin somewhere without a place to string it and I like that I have the yep I can use with both the Bivy or hammock

or this

If you are going to get a bivy get one that can get rained on. Having a bivy with mesh is only good for bug protection. There are some that have a mesh vent but still has a flap to keep rain out.

+ 1 on John West bivys. I've tried bivy's in the past and never liked them, to restricking, but John made mine to fit my Neoair and now I'm a convert. I will probably switch completely over to tarp and bivy after I try my hand at a MYOG Trail Star.

I use a bivy in the winter when I'm sleeping in a snow trench or snow cave. Keeps my bag dry, and adds a little bit of warmth as well. But for being out in the elements, I would much rather have the convenience of a tent. I live in Alaska where bugs are plentiful, and like no-see-um netting to keep them out of my sleeping area, and I like to be able to sit up or work on my gear or whatever out of the elements. It's bad enough to spend long durations of time in a small tent during inclement weather, I can't imagine the misery and boredom of being stuck inside a bivy sack.