Newbie stove question

I've been using Pocket Rocket for a long time. I'm happy with it.

You can get a stove that's about an ounce lighter for more money, like Gnat.

PR and other upright stoves don't work well below about 32F.

You also need to get (or make) a wind screen.

Alcohol stoves are a few ounces lighter (depending on…) but you have to fiddle with them. Canister stove – just turn it on.

I have a Super Fly. I've heard a few complaints about the pot supports on the Pocket Rocket, but the Super Fly has never failed me. It does need a wind screen of some sort though. Luckily, the Super Fly is much easier to make a wind screen for than the Pocket Rocket; all you need to do is find a light weight bowl and drill a central hole.

check out this stove…I just bought one and it works great!!! well constructed and fits the Coleman 220g butane/propane canisters toe get ate walmart for $4.88. 3.9oz…$21 and change after shipping…
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004U8CP88/ref=oh_o00_s00_i00_details

got it in 3 days

sorry fast fingers and slow brain… (toe get ate = you get at)

I've had a PR for 6-7 years now, no issue, make sure it is screwed down good on the canister. They will work into the single digits without much hassle, so don't be fooled.
Fuel needs to be warmed up maybe, which can be done down your pants or in water. There is a new version coming out, lighter, more efficient. These have a small, concentrated head, so check out burner size before making a decision. I've made pancakes on them with no issue. The pot supports look cheap, but I have not had a problem, if you have problems being careful with important gear, it may not be for you. Many good, used stoves on Ebay.
Two burner stove. Lots of cheap Colemans on Craigslist, Ebay, garage sales. Should be able to get a good one under $20. They stand up well, especially the older ones. Make sure the seller shows you it works before forking over the money, many have sat for awhile or been passed around and not used in years. They can and do still work after sitting for years with fuel in them, but some may have issues.
Duane

Philip,

I’m happy with my Optimus Crux .

Big Supply Shop has them for $32.45. Their cheapest shipping method is Parcel First Class. To my zip code the total with shipping is $41.56. That is close to your price range with shipping included.

Weight (grams): 83 – Weight (oz): 2.92

Big burner head and folds flat to take up very little space. I nest mine inside of my Evernew cookpot in the hollow spot underneath the gas canister.

Party On,

Newton

I agree with the suggestions for a big-ole two-burner Coleman for the car/patrol camping, and then an Optimus Crux for your backpacking stove. We Scout with my 50-year old Coleman 2-burner (thanks, Dad) and after a season of scoping out and borrowing others' canister stoves while I cooked with my old mountaineering rig, I went with and am very happy with the Optimus Crux.

The Crux is among the lightest of the canister stoves, folds down very compactly, SIMMERS well, has wide, stable pot supports and can be had with a very cool "Weekender HE" lightweight cook kit that will hold a fuel canister, the stove, your mini-bic, backup book matches, three folding sporks and a vial of olive oil…based on my experience. The Weekender HE is slightly smaller than a Nalgene bottle when packed and is more than enough in terms of capacity and BTU to cook for three in the High Sierra, as we've used ours with our Scout son on personal trips.

You can find the Weekender HE kit, which includes the Crux stove, on eBay for $60, shipped. This is over your $40, but it includes a cookset, which you need anyway. Instead of folding sporks, get two long-handled aluminum backpacking spoons (lighter than ti, btw)that you'll tuck into the Optimus stuff sack around the kit (rather than in) and you'll be set for you and your son (add spoons for more persons, plenty of room) to backpack together and for yourself when your son's with the patrol and you're enjoying hot food while "the guys do whatever the heck they're doing over there in the patrol site…"

Check the pot support arms on the MSR Pocket Rocket. Very long, thin and bendy. Not good.

Cheers

I agree Roger, the pot supports on the PR are terrible and not very stable; I much prefer the Giga Power over the PR for this reason alone.

I think the pot supports must have had a design change years ago. My Pocket Rocket was one of the first made (10-12 years ago), and the pot supports had no weakness. I purchased another one two years ago, but it has not seen heavy duty yet.

–B.G.–

We cooked many meals for three on a Pocket Rocket and found the supports quite adequate even with a two liter pot that had enough food in it to feed three people. I like the stove quite well and when I take a canister stove, this is the one.

IMO the Snowpeak Giga is a superior canister stove design over the PR. That is my 2 cents of course. Yes you WILL pay more but you get more. The 4 supports is a big difference over the 3. While it isn't as big of an issue for small pots if you use it for a 2L it is.

As well the Snowpeak is very adjustable for actual cooking vs just water boiling.

For the past couple of years my go-to stove for recipe development has been the SP Giga……

I use the PR, have for a while and I've never had a problem with the supports. With a titanium pot it shouldn't matter, right? ;)
The Giga's a great stove too. Not sure you can go wrong with either, really. The both work. The Giga's got a piezo lighter, which is handy. Toss-up as far as I'm concerned though, especially with the pocket rocket on sale.

Been very happy with my Giga. 11 years and going strong.

The Gnat is nice if you need to go really light.

–B.G.–

I think the Pocket Rocket is on sale as the new Micro Rocket model introduced at the Outdoor Retailer show will probably replace it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9rlIIE6tHE&feature=related

The SnowPeak is on sale at Backcountry.com and Campsavers.com at the moment.

If you say that you want to make pancakes and simmer I would just point out that a wide burner head like the one on the Crux pictured in a previous post avoids making one tiny hotspot and are generally superior to tiny burner heads(such as on the Pocket Rocket) for these uses. Hotspots are more of a problem when using pots made of metals that don't conduct heat particularly well. Aluminum DOES conduct heat well, but I've heard conflicting opinions about titanium. Anectdotally titanium does seem to be more problematic, but many of us here (me included) only need to boil water so it works just fine.

If a person wants to cook food at times a pot made of HAA or non-stick coated aluminum is the best choice. Ti pots even when lined with non-stick will always cook hot and they chill just as quick once taken off the heat source. It is due to the metals properties and how thin it is. Thing is, HAA and Al pots are often about the same weight if you shop well and cost HALF the price!

Also, if you plan on just doing pancakes or fish a simple fry pan can be a good choice over say a pot.

I strongly believe in having multiple choices at home to choose from, based on the type of trip you will be taking! A solo trip with just water boiling? Take a $20 HAA tea kettle or similar to boil water. Two people and actual one pot cooking? A nice 2L pot made of HAA or lined Al (easy to clean, heats evenly – less chance of burn-ons). And so one – that way you can be flexible.

I also believe you should have multiple stoves as well – from a simple alchy stove, to an easy to use canister stove to maybe a remote canister stove. Choices make trips easier to pack for!

Aluminum is my choice for cooking in. Ti cooking pots are usually made from recycled Ti-4al-V, or essentially has aluminum in it. So, you do not escape aluminum. Coatings require a heavy pan to start with, soo, I avoid them. Generally the thinest aluminum pan I can find will work. That said, I have one small pan, no-name unfortunatly that is VERY thin ti. And very light at about 3oz. But, it always burns. Aluminum seems to mitigate this problem. Right around 4.5oz/2qt. Lid adds a bit more. For fry pans, aluminum is far superior. Especially with the smaller flames from the PR or Coleman F1 stoves.

Counting the weight of a 4oz canister + stove + fuel, the heat content is not much different than an alcohol stove for about the same carry weight over 4 days. Soo, don't be too eager to adopt canisters. They don't automagically make the best stove for you. For 2 week trips or longer (canisters are not always available) I take a WG stove. For ANY weight, if it doesn't work, it is dead weight. In your usual hiking haunts, make sure you know what is available. In the ADK's, often WG is there, or, regular unleaded gas, canisters are only available in a couple spots and require hitching to get them. They work well on weekend trips, though.

Also, I have had a couple lindal valves stick, meaning I have to leave the stove attached (humidity and temperture??) Soo, they often require more fiddling and checking than what other people do in western states. Just a note of caution.

The newer HAA pots get around the need for heavy pots – they can be thin walled and work well. The key is they are aluminum but have the "coating" of HA (which isn't really a coating if you will, but rather an electrical charge). You get all the cooking benefits of Al pots but with no taste of metal. My favorite choice truthfully.

On stoves – and in the Western states – one reason to have multiple choices is fire bans. In fire bans alchy stoves are nearly always banned as they are an open flame, where as canister stoves will be allowed. So something to consider if one travels.

"The key is they are aluminum but have the "coating" of HA (which isn't really a coating if you will, but rather an electrical charge)."

This is incorrect. Anodizing the metal is best called a metal surface treatment. It is not a coating that rises above the surface. Instead, it is a hardening below the surface.

–B.G.–

Does a hard anodized aluminum pot hold up over time?

I have a coated Titanium pot, but the coating has come off a little. Not a big deal, except I may be ingesting the coating which probably isn't good.

I have used maybe 50 canisters, and one time the Lindal valve stuck, so I had to leave the stove screwed on until I used it up, not that big a deal.

I used a Coleman Exponent F1 for years, but several times it leaked a little and there was a flame-up around the stove – canister connection, which I blew out and then screwed it on tighter. Then, several times I left the stove screwed on overnight and in the morning it had all leaked out – bummer, no oatmeal or coffee. Only when it was very cold, like below freezing. Fortunately, it only happened when I wasn't that far from my car.

I'm so glad I joined this group – thank you so much for the valuable input and advice – I think I'll work on getting the best deal on a Gigapower or Optimus Crux – I do like the head shape on the Optimus…

Also on the cookware – I agree it makes sense to have some variety depending on the circumstances. I know my son and I will be doing more camping – he's taken to it as have I actually (no small feat since I did not grow up in an outdoors oriented family – my son's interest has gotten me into a tent for the first time at age 44, fishing, and hiking all of which I've really come to enjoy myself!) . So it makes sense to start with a good two person setup and keep it simple to start with. Add more variety as needs and budget permit. I've gotten some good advice from friends on where to spend up front and where you can cut a few corners – but am open to suggestions in that regard from the BPL community.

I'm excited to enjoy the outdoors with him and my daughter seems to have a good bit of interest as well – my wife is warming up, albeit slowly.

Again, I appreciate all the thoughtful replies and the wealth of information available here. Thanks for your patience with newbie questions.

Plain HAA holds up well (you can also find lined HAA as well done with Teflon and similar). You just have to avoid acidic foods like at home and not letting food sit for hours in the pot. But overall it is well designed and rugged. Anyhow, any advice from Calphalon will work for backpacking HAA pots IMO – and yes, the Calaphon website waxes on about how how the process is done – fascinating nerdville on how they do they metal. I have read it…but have no desire to read it again…lol!