camping= fire, why?

A teaspoon in the laundry would probably be just right.

I like having a fire at camp for many of the reasons people have mentioned above. I don't have to have it and have enjoyed plenty of trips without. Finding fuel in the snow or in a wet environment is half the fun. I don't enjoy it when smoke follows me no matter where I move.
It is not necessary but it is one more way that people seem to enjoy being outdoors together.

I go both ways on this issue. I love a nice small fire at the end of the day but when above treeline in the Sierras, the lack of a fire does not even come into question. Both can be quite satisfying.

Snarky comments on a fire thread. Common folks.

"my father in law has an RV trailer at a camp ground year round. he MUST have a fire. it gives him something to do. i think that is were a lot of this need for a fire comes from, a sense of purpose. i don't think he can sit quietly in the woods and watch the darkness close. for some, i think that is torture to just sit and stare out into the wilderness. they have to be doing something, and if it's not hiking, it's cooking, and if it's not cooking, it building a fire."

Nothing wrong with that at all.

"He might have been one of the young people who's tents flooded, got turned upside down and left a fire unattended. Just remember, not everyone is as smart or well educated as you are. Not everyone has or has had the same opportunities as you. Not everyone has read a no trace pamphlet or book like you have. Not everyone has had someone teach or educate them about being a responsible person in the back country. So instead of turning a snob nose up at others for a lack of knowledge or responsibility. Just remember that not everyone has your same belief set and that you too were at one time ignorant and irresponsible. Let's treat others with respect. It goes a lot further in conversation than a holier than thou attitude. Just saying"

They were from a high level if not Ivy league college in Boston. Intelligence was not the issue, a lack of proper outdoor skills was.
There are signs at most campgrounds about leaving fires unattended, especially in high wind like we were having that week. (used every guy line on our tent). We respected the owner of the campground enough to not leave it alone and let it burn down her property. She treated us very well all week, it was the least we could do.

There was a water pump at each section of tent locations. using theirs was more to get them to think, they were not losing anything. we were leaving so we could not explain it to them.

I was saying that the Boy Scout leaders should have been teaching the kids proper rules so they did not end up like the college students. That is when the mentoring should be done.. especially in an organization meant for teaching.

Firem'n Chip

1. Read and understand fire use and safety rules from the Boy Scout Handbook.
2. Secure necessary permits (regulations vary by locality).
3. Clear all flammable vegetation at least 5 feet in all directions from fire (total 10 feet).
4. Attend to fire at all times.
5. Keep fire-fighting tools (water and/or shovel) readily available.
6. Leave fire when it is cold out.
7. Subscribe to the Outdoor Code and Leave-No-Trace.

LOL! Never thought of that! Maybe I can mix it with a little alcohol and dab it behind my ears!

Careful where you wear that… Bear's like BBQ too ;)

"They were from a high level if not Ivy league college in Boston. Intelligence was not the issue"

That does not ensure common sense :)

Gosh, I have seen so many 'drown your campfire' public messages on TV this year, they are wearing me out. If you live in the US, you just about have to be a hermit regarding "putting fires out, dead out."

Well out there in Cali you guys have a much bigger fire risk. But even so, we still have smokey the bear commercials and stuff in school and on TV so it is still widely known.

if they left it smoldering it would have been one thing.. but they had it full bore flames above the metal ring

If someone started a forest fire and had to pay all the costs to fight it, and it was common knowledge you were financially responsible for any fire you started, would that possibly change how people act?

>> "They were from a high level if not Ivy league college in Boston. Intelligence was not the issue"

> That does not ensure common sense :)

Agreed… Some of the smartest people I know are some of the dumbest people I know.

>> Gosh, I have seen so many 'drown your campfire' public messages on TV this year, they are wearing me out. If you live in the US, you just about have to be a hermit regarding "putting fires out, dead out."

I grew up primarily in California, and remember Smokey engraining those fire safety principles in us… On TV, in school, coloring books, ranger stations, etc. That is simply not the case here in the midwest. In the last 17 years, I don't think I've seen a single Smokey Bear/fire safety PSA outside of maybe a faded delaminating one-page poster on the check-in board at some state parks. I'm a scout leader, and we do teach the "dead out" principle, but it's not the norm for most campers here.

Fire is deeply ingrained in our psyche as a source of security. We historically depended on fire for warmth, cooking, light, and keeping wild things away at night. We are even attracted to the smell of burning wood.

Heck, some wild-eyed lunatics even put a special place in their house to build a useless fire sometimes just because seeing it makes them feel better. Fireplaces, I think they are called.

why? why do I drink coffee? because I enjoy it, I think a small fire would fall into the same category

like others- when solo I rarely start a fire, but have to admit I do enjoy the slight warmth and glow from my little wood stove :)

when with my wife and/or kids, a small fire in the evening and morning has become pretty much de rigueur- the fires are small, usually of short duration, thoroughly extinguished and the ashes scattered

"If someone started a forest fire and had to pay all the costs to fight it, and it was common knowledge you were financially responsible for any fire you started, would that possibly change how people act?"

Possibly, if you could catch them and they were financially solvent.

My camping buddies like a big fire, and I sometimes appreciate it on a cold night. However, I would prefer to hang out in my sleeping bag or down jacket, and not get that old smoke smell the next day (week, month..). I don't mind getting dirty, but don't really see the need to get dirty just to drag & cut some wood for a fire.

I think Ray Jardine also raises a very good point that when you have a fire your world at night in limited to ~6 ft diameter. The focus is the fire, not the environment. You miss out on the stars and the realization that even ambient lighting on a moonless night can allow you to see things once your eyes adjust.

Yeah, I have fires sometimes, but I encourage folks to do without them sometimes.

Tom

When i started hiking and climbing, all we had was wood fires, along with woolen clothing, heavy sleeping bags, and tarps (actually surplus GI ponchos). Those items actually worked pretty well together, and were not readily damaged by fire and smoke.

As time progressed, we changed to lightweight nylon items and synthetic clothing, stoves of one sort or another, and tents (nylon, again). Drifting embers are not good for any synthetic fabrics, other than Nomex, and that has a lot to do with my shift away from fires. Clothing is a lot more efficient, thus rendering a fire unnecessary. Lighting one these days is a good sign that something has gone wrong in our planning and preparations.

It's called paradigm shift….

In my opinion and experience, people build fires because they are scared of the unknown. Tom said it, people end up staring at the fire and missing out on everything outside the 6-foot radius of light. Personally, I think having a fire while backpacking, unless cooking, drying or staying warm, ruins the experience. You lose your night vision and draw attention to yourself. i have snuck up on friends around a fire and scared them because they could see anything in the dark. It seems counter intuitive to have a fire if you are scared. Keep it dark and the stars "pop".

I end up building fires when I'm with friends because they don't know any different….the same friends who lug around 50lb packs and complain that 4-miles is killing them. Let the newbies and scardy-cats build their fires and I will build my stealth camp. I can see them for miles but they wouldn't even know I was 50-feet from them.

"people build fires because they are scared of the unknown."

Poppycock. I build fires because I'm scared of the known! There's this woman who keeps stalking me, she wants me to marry her, but I'm just not interested! But she hates fires! So as long as I have a fire, I know I'm safely single…..

We cook exclusively with fire; breakfast and dinner. If it has been raining for a week and we stop for lunch, we build a fire to have some hot tea and miso soup. Of course, we live in a rain forest and seldom camp at the same place twice, so there is a lot of dead wood in the forest, and often drift wood on the beach.

Some of our fires are small and for a quick pot of tea

Others aren’t

>>people build fires because they are scared of the unknown

Considering my back country experience, I am going to go with my first, most simple, theory:

“‘Cause I like ’em” :)

A back packing buddy is a Triple Crowner (mainly solo). Another buddy is an all around outdoors guy who is a mountaineering instructor.

We occasionally make a camp fire.

I *think* we are pretty comfortable outdoors. Could be wrong? ;)

I know it is odd for different people to have different outdoor loves and ways of enjoying ..but there you go.

Jeeze-louise.

Why does the simplest thing in the world (love of the outdoors) have to be so complicated by people thinking that there is only one, true, absolute, correct way to enjoy the outdoors?

If only there was some sarcastic treatise about this (mainly) internet phenom? :)

ps. WHat’s with the sneaking up on people on a dark night? Training for the Ninja Olympics???? :D

/walks a lot
//has a sub-10 lb pack
/// Sleeps under the stars
////though the 3 liters of wine he has been known to carry mitigates this light pack at times
/////never mind the 10lbs of marinated pork roast he carried on hut trips
//////I love slashies…

i hope all these "fire haters" practice building fires outside in adverse conditions

whether you want a fire or not is up to you …

but knowing how to build one when the cards are down and practicing it enough to be able to do it easily in poor weather… well you can "hate" it all you want but it can save yr life

"In my opinion and experience, people build fires because they are scared of the unknown."

Right. I go solo into the wilderness but have a small fire because I'm "scared of the unknown"? I know there are bears, cougars, moose, etc. so they are known. And not scary anyway. I'm trying to fathom what I don't know of that I could be scared of? Too deep a concept for me, I guess. And the nights I don't have a fire?

"I end up building fires when I'm with friends because they don't know any different….the same friends who lug around 50lb packs and complain that 4-miles is killing them."

I'm guessing if you told them what newbs and scaredy cats they were you wouldn't have this problem.

@Paulmags

You're my kind of hut tripper! We had 5 pulks in our group last season and took steak, lobster, and some good brews. Unfortunately, we got skunked in the lottery this year or I'd have invited you along. But there's always 2013!

http://www.tcfroar.org/pdf/freeresources/bsa/others/jeffmarion/Campfire%20Impacts%20EM%20paper.pdf

ABSTRACT: Using resource-monitoring data from seven protected areas, the effectiveness of three campfire policies—campfire ban, designated campfires, and unregulated campfires—were assessed based on the number of fire sites and the amount of tree damage. Results indicate that unregulated campfire policies permitted substantial numbers of fire sites and tree damage in campsites, although fire bans did not eliminate or even substantially decrease these problems. A designated campfire policy was effective in decreasing number of fire sites, but little difference was found among policies regarding tree damage. Given the importance of campfires to visitor experiences, campfire prohibitions could be viewed as unnecessarily restrictive based on their limited success in preventing resource damage. Conclusions encourage protected-area managers to consider designated campfire policies and prohibitions on axes, hatchets, and saws to better meet resource protection and visitor experience mandates.

Another Sierra Club opinion on fires.

http://dallassierraclub.org/page.htm?outingscorner201103

For warmth but also contemplation vs. sparks putting holes in my Patagucci and smelling like burnt wood. Still, if allowed I do not mind if someone else lights one but not going to put it out, though sometimes I will practice in a heavy rain just to make sure the skill is fresh in sub-optimal conditions.

If fire danger is high, not going to take a chance nor let others.