How to identify Pertex Quantum?

Thanks for the feedback!

Alas, it's pretty clear that my Marmot Ion — purchased late last year at Sierra Trading Post — is the newer, breathing-challenged version.

Its nice to hear the manufacturers reply even if it only confirms what the website says. Could be this is natural variability in some of the last lots of PM Pertex. Lets hope Mitsui has better QA.

Thanks, Michael. I appreciate you talking to Marmot. I'm also heartened to learn that I am not crazy — that this new Ion is much less breathable than my wife's 2-year-old Ion. It's going back to Campmor as soon as I get it back from you.

Unless, that is, someone on this list would like a once-used Ion, the last of the Pertex Quantum fabric, only $55 plus shipping.

–Ken

Tag in mine. I missed out on the down fill tho. Any one else care to tell us where there's was made?

I have to say, I've been pretty disappointed with the breathability too.

Paul-Great job on analyzing the fabrics!

Indeed, the questionable Ions look like they are coated with a non breathable membrane such as silicone. DWR does not fill gaps in the weave.

The Chinook's Meta P-120R, weave looks very similar to the deniers and pattern of coated and uncoated fibers used in both the Patagonia Micropuff and the Wild Things windshirt.

The Ballistic Airlight nylon looks very similar to the Pertex Microlight fabric weave.

Gene – Regarding how I took the photos I posted … where I work, we have a high-powered (50x-100x) stereomicroscope with a CCD camera attached.

Mike Martin – Thanks for your effort (and persistence) in trying to get an answer from the Marmot folks. It is surprising that this is (apparently) the first time they have been questioned about this issue.

Has anyone here tried calling Marmot's customer service?

WOW!
I would not expect to hear that from Marmot.

I would expect that this is the first time they have heard about it. This site is at the top of it's game. Where else would you expect it to come from.

By the way, it's Marmot not Marmont.
If you bought it from Marmont, then it is probably a fake.

Aaron – The "Marmont" in my subject line was nothing more than a parity error somewhere between my brain and my keyboard.

PLR

Speaking Pertex, has any one seen these?

http://www.sportsshoes.com/product/?product_code=LIT153

http://www.sportsshoes.com/product/?product_code=LIT154&related_code=LIT153

Not sure on the curency rate but it's a good price for a pertex jacket, but £25.00 for shipping is way up there.

I don't mind half zip jackets. Any one know the weight is of these?

While digging around, I saw this.

http://www.backcountrygear.com/catalog/appareldetail.cfm/MA4198

I am willing to bet that the one's purchased at Campmor are made with the same material.

It looks like all the materials are 2-tone.
Are the ones from Campmor 2-tone as well?
The latest ones aren't.

Aaron, My newer 'down tag' Ion is single color.
Thanks for the link to this new(for me) type of Ion. These are made of "Banshee P-170" material; what the heck is that? Is anyone impressed when a company renames nylon(I assume) to Banshee? "I can't wait for my Houdini to arrive so I can send it back and trade up to the Banshee.." please. You can stick a fork in Marmot, they are done IMO.

I sent my Marmot Ion windshirt back to Marmot on 1/19/07. I had discussions with Brian Dresbach in customer service. At first Brian stated that they had not known of any material problems with the Ion. He said that the product was being discontinuedand a new model would be coming out this Spring. He first offered to send me a new windshirt of thier material for $20.00. I stated that I purchased thier product because of its reviews but I didnt want to throw more money at a product that didn't perform in the first place. He said he would talk with thier materials group and see if they could determine the products material. The next week he called and is shipping me the newer model at no cost. He never admitted that the material was not Pertex Quantum, but I'm getting a new windshirt. I will post a review after I recieve it. Hopefully it is as breathable as Pertex Quantum.

Marmot Ion – '06 vs. Earlier – there really is a difference!

Ok. Y'all have heard me say i have "old-timers". So, was straightening up, organizing gear & i come across this vomit yellow Marmot Ion hooded windshirt that i purchased a year or two ago. i think it was from Backcountry.com. If anyone is interested an in-depth, painstaking search of the Forums from a yr or more ago, will reveal someone posting that they weren't going to made anymore, or something like that. So, i settled for a puke yellow one (or is it urine yellow – doesn't matter, it's an awful color of yellow, but on the trail, unless i want to "go stealth", who cares?!!).

However, to the point – it is a totally different fabric from the BCO black one that i purchases a month or two ago. The older yellow one feels much nicer & i can also inhale and exhale right through the fabric – not so with the late-'06 black one (i would literally suffocate fr/lack of oxygen).

After seeing it, i remembered, it too is cut too tight (but seems a bit looser) and so the Medium doesn't fit my 40.5" chest very well, and my wife doesn't like the awful yellow color, so i packed it away and forgot about it (can't remember why i didn't try to return it???).

If I can find my receipt Im returning my '06. Ive got a Houdini in the mail. If you dont use that urine yellow one, why not put it up on Gear swap? Someone can use it..

Brett, good idea on the gear swap suggestion. if i do so, i guess i'll call it canary yellow ("canary", that's better than "banana", right? i know it's better than names i called it in my prev. Post!).

I do have some nice unused & some used only 1x, 2x, or just a handful (still indistinguishable, IMO, from "new" condition) that i might part with. Sort of gear "experiments" or "rentals", that didn't live up to my, personal, expectations. My main reason for not doing so, is that i don't have a convenient way to accept payment (i don't think that i can accept PayPal payments as i don't have a bank acct. tied to my PayPal acct.).

Brett – have you read my new post about replacing the 2006 Ion with 2007? If you are interested in doing the exchange but hesistant because of the hassle of a foreign address, feel free to ship it over to me and I'll take care of it for you in terms of dealing with Marmot.

PJ – Most hikers here are cheap bastards — present company included. You can sell your stuff here, of course, although the expectation is that you are not doing so in order to make a profit. Look at it as half cutting your losses and half giveaways. But if you want a shot at better prices for some of your items, Ebay is often a better venue — and over there — folks bid amongst themselves, so no worries about feelings of guilt. I once sold a lightly-used sleeping bag for $1 more than what I paid for when new. :)

..or so Ive heard. I recently started using it, and linked it to my bank account. They(paypal) have $200 fraud protection. At first I was so worried about fraud I didnt use ebay/paypal, but with some new protections they use I dont worry. It just is really convenient.

"Canary" or "Dark Lemon" sounds better than urine or vomit, at least to me.

Ben, have you seen what USED Golite Breeze packs have gone for over there?!! Saw one go for just "south" of $200!! I also understand the limitations of selling here on BPL. Profit wouldn't be my intent – i appreciated your guidance.

Hi PJ:

Just to clarify… I wasn't questioning your motives at all — but more to point out that Ebay is where you have the chance of striking gold. :)

Brett, PayPal will mail me a check? Didn't know that. Hope they would do that faster than they resolve disputes. I'm in one now over there regarding a NEW, NEVER USED, "flawless" (her words) bivy that is SMOKE DAMAGED, but "flawless" othewise in both appearance & function. Though, just this AM i managed to snag a heavily USED, though well cared-for, "one-off", modified Wanderlust Nomad Lite variant (at a premium price). Hope to get it in a day or two. Nice fella', said he'd take it back if i don't like it.

Ive been ripped off a few times also; and it took me a few years to return to ebay. Now I look carefully at the stats of the seller, as I am sure you did.
Good luck with your dispute resolution! My advice is write it off financially in your mind; then if you actually get something it will be a nice surprise.
It is nice to deal with the individuals here at BPL; they all seem to bend over backwards to be courteous, honest, and fair. Even giving gear to needy compadres. The recent platy nipper example comes to mind; and I remember you offering our pal Vlad a free membership!

Another act of kindness was when PJ bought a whole case of Flexair UL pillows and distributed free to members who wanted them!

PJ — there's a minimal charge to get Paypal to mail you a check. But if you link your checking account with Paypal, electronic transfers from Paypal to your bank is FREE. This is the method I use.

Ben, i missed your other Post. Yes, i knew that you WEREN'T ques. my motives. w/o explicitly stating such (since i didn't want to imply that someone could mis-read that into your words), i tried to communicate that all i read from and into your Post was much appreciated "guidance", as i believe that i termed it. I truly did appreciate your Post.

So, don't lose any sleep over it, my friend – i sure won't!!

---

Also, Ben, i hesitate to link my Credit Union checking acct to PayPal. My CU won't restore misappropriated funds until a couple of yrs, or so, down the line after a SUCCESSFUL criminal fraud conviction. This is what they told me a couple of yrs ago. I was surprised banking laws allowed such, but it shouldn't surprise me – the little guy always gets the short end of the stick.

Ive washed and rewashed my Marmot Ion hoping to somehow wear down some of the DWR coating to make it more breathable. It does not seem to be working. Were any of you who bought your Ion from campmor able to return it after wearing it, washing it, and removing the tags like I did?